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IndustryArena Forum > MetalWorking Machines > Uncategorised MetalWorking Machines > Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
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    Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    Does anyone have any experience milling wood on a machine designed for metal? I've never done any woodwork, what range of RPM is wood milling done in? I assume i'll need tooling designed specifically for woodwork? The main obvious things i can think of is to obviously run it without coolant, set up a vacuum, cover the coolant drains. Are there any other issues i could run into?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    1523

    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    Wood dust is quite different stuff to metal chips, it will get everywhere.

    What are you doing it for? One off or regular work?

    Carbide tooling at high rpm and feed (18k rpm plus).

    If the VMC is worth anything I'm not sure I would do it.
    7xCNC.com - CNC info for the minilathe (7x10, 7x12, 7x14, 7x16)

  3. #3
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    Apr 2009
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    5516

    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    There are a few guitar builders I know using VMCs specifically. PRS, Tom Anderson (probably the first small builder to use a Fadal), John Suhr (Haas I believe), Greg Olson. I couldn't say what if any special provisions were made. Generally you'd want between 10k-18k rpm spinal speed with 2-flute bits. If you have slower spinddle you may need 3-4 flute bits but then chip clearance becomes an issue.

    Yes, wood tooling is different from metal, as far as having higher rake angles and deeper flutes. Spiral O flute tools designed for aluminum work well with hardwoods.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    any vmc will work well. they are the prime choice in guitar factories because they are rigid and enclosed. speed is desirable, but even 6000rpm and 100ipm is acceptable provided the fixturing is reliable (no tape). they typical setup is a vacuum fixture with registration pins to prevent slipping. vmc's put out a lot more side force than a router. they key to wood cutting is just matching the feed and speed. you can burn the wood at 24000rpm an 2000rpm with the same tool if you cant feed it fast enough. once you've burned the wood, the tool is usually ruined.

    one thing to know though is these machines are not run as "normal". they are completely dry, with the bearings greased, not oiled. they have to be meticulously maintained and cleaned after each use. the machines are dedicated purely to wood work. you cannot go back and forth from wood to metal without a complete overhaul or you risk ruining bearings and gumming up every system with wet oily sawdust.

    for tooling, anything youd use in a router still applies. solid carbide is best. consumer brazed carbide tools are usually not ideal. the shanks bend in heavy cuts.

  5. #5
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    Jun 2010
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    I find a vacuum system right at the tool just the thing for wood.

    Cheers
    Roger

  6. #6
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    thats not always possible on a vmc. they tend to interfere with the tool changer and other features.

  7. #7
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    They make mist extraction systems for VMCs (to remove coolant mist before opening the door) I'm sure it wouldn't be difficult to implement a similar idea for wood dust. CR Onsrud machining centers have a dust boot and ATC carousel. If your stock is relatively flat, you can fabricate a dust boot that is stationary in the Z axis while allowing the table to move underneath, with a clearance hole for the tool.

    Some brazed carbide tooling is actually tougher, because the HSS shanks can take more abuse, where carbide would shatter. At the spindle speeds of most VMSs I don't think that will be an issue. I've seen clamping done via vacuum, toggle clamps, bolts... depends on what you are cutting.

  8. #8
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    My vacuum system is NOT attached to the Z axis. It sticks in from the side to where the tool will be.
    Ah well, the idea works on my machine very well. But then, I doubt I could put a tool changer on an ER collet system.

    cheers
    Roger

  9. #9
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    Quote Originally Posted by louieatienza View Post

    Some brazed carbide tooling is actually tougher, because the HSS shanks can take more abuse, where carbide would shatter. At the spindle speeds of most VMSs I don't think that will be an issue. I've seen clamping done via vacuum, toggle clamps, bolts... depends on what you are cutting.
    a hss shank would be nice... most of the consumer router bits are just mild steel though. they do bend. so thats not a comment on the brazed style of cutter, its just a comment on the quality of consumer router bits.

  10. #10
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    Quote Originally Posted by RCaffin View Post
    My vacuum system is NOT attached to the Z axis. It sticks in from the side to where the tool will be.
    Ah well, the idea works on my machine very well. But then, I doubt I could put a tool changer on an ER collet system.

    cheers
    Roger
    if its got no atc, then its not a vmc

    we assume the OP means a machine like a haas or fadal, typical large enclosed vmc with cat40 tooling or similar.

    i think the typical dust extraction is some sort of global suction for fine particles, and then just a vacuum at the end to suck up all the chips. part of the benifit of being fully enclosed is that you dont really need to be concerned with sucking the chips op at the tool. they have nowhere to go.

  11. #11
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    Jun 2007
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    about 5 mins in on this video they talk about the setup of the fadal. seems they have a dust collection port somewhere at the bottom of the machine. they likely sweep all the chips into it after milling is done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ON8lmH4rg4c

  12. #12
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    Jun 2007
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    Re: Milling wood on a VMC designed for metal

    a nice video of the same machine and some of the cutters used. a mix of end mills and brazed carbide form bits. also shows the cut qualities before sanding. you need to keep tools super sharp for this. youll note they use the biggest possible cutters. 3/4" end mill for the outside and large cavities.

    i think this machine has a 12k or 15k spindle.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnUKqRqQbao

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