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  1. #1

    biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    I am looking at converting a 1996 rover over to mach 3.

    the machine would be used for profiling mdf and plywood sheets and the gcode would be created using aspire or similer.

    As the machine would only be used to profile, I would only need one router head and no tool changer. I am hoping this will reduce the need for any custom programing to zero.

    Drives on machines from this era are prob analoge this could be the stumbling block for the project and will decide if I should go and look at the machine.

    Has any one converted a machine like the rover and had any success using the original drives with mach

  2. #2
    Community Moderator ger21's Avatar
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    Here's one.
    I know he used a Galil card, which can control analogue drives, but not sure if he changed the drives.
    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ai7mGOdbhns]Biesse "duzzit" conversion. New drilling cycles completed. Much better! - YouTube[/ame]
    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  3. #3
    Thanks Gerry, actually I did spot that video a few weeks ago when I was considering the idea of a conversion. He has done an incredible job with that machine, espically getting so many functions to work under mach.

    Im planning on a bare bones conversion, locking down the one of router heads and running it like a standard 3 axis router rather than a machining centre.

    Galil cards look like they are up to the job but I wonder how these Kflop cards from Dynomotion | Motion Control Boards perform.

  4. #4
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    i chatted with him recently as ive found a biesse machine locally i might grab in the new year.

    he says that its been alot of work getting all the features going. alot of scripting. but i think the basic xyz and spindle would be fairly straight forward.

    the one thing that stands out on his is that the performance (acceleration) is poor compared to the original control. he mentions in one of the comments that it was overshooting if he set it too high. i dont know if thats a mach3 pulse thing, or the galil cards needing tuning on the loop.

    i talked to heidenhain about the acu-rite 3500i control yesterday. they seem to think it would work well. wont be quite as cheap as a mach/galil solution, but its not too bad.
    wotzBotz

  5. #5
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    Smile

    the acceleration is set lower because im running the machine off a generator!
    as its running at my house with no 3 phase.
    i have had the machine to 65m/ minute on x and y with same acceleration as original biesse cni control. however while this is fine for point to point machining when using the cv that mach3 offers it is way smoother for engraving and finer work if the acceleration is set a lot lower.(to be fair i never tuned the servos extremely tight as i dont like the oscilations this can cause.

    i am using the original dc analogue drives.
    i didnt go with kflop due to the huge number of i/o required which i couldnt get with kflop. (ive ordered a kflop for a new project as the backup and help on their forum is superb!)

    im just converting another 2 biesse machines using galil rios to give me distributed i/o around the machine
    so much to learn, so much to pass on.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by battwell View Post
    the acceleration is set lower because im running the machine off a generator!
    as its running at my house with no 3 phase.
    i have had the machine to 65m/ minute on x and y with same acceleration as original biesse cni control. however while this is fine for point to point machining when using the cv that mach3 offers it is way smoother for engraving and finer work if the acceleration is set a lot lower.(to be fair i never tuned the servos extremely tight as i dont like the oscilations this can cause.

    i am using the original dc analogue drives.
    i didnt go with kflop due to the huge number of i/o required which i couldnt get with kflop. (ive ordered a kflop for a new project as the backup and help on their forum is superb!)

    im just converting another 2 biesse machines using galil rios to give me distributed i/o around the machine
    ahh, cool, thanks for that. i ended up passing on the machines id found, because i just couldnt find a space to put them. bit sad. they seem to pop up often though, so i may grab one after i move (they are ripping down the building my shop is in in a year or so for condos).
    wotzBotz

  7. #7

    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    I'm reviving an old thread. We have a 2002 Rover 35L for our work CNC. I use Mach3 and CamBam at home to run my basement CNC. I love CamBam, and am trying to figure out how to write a post for our Rover. NC1000 is not easy GCode to produce unfortunately.

    I had the idea of converting the machine to run off of Mach3 but I'm not sure it's worth the effort. Has anyone been successful with this?

  8. #8
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    I see mostly people converting with Mach3 these machines. I am looking at getting one and intend to convert to LinuxCNC with mesa boards controlling the servo drives.
    I did one allready with a big vertical machining center and it is amazing. Mesa cards are not expensive and they work amazing.

    I have my eye on a Biesse rover 23.

  9. #9
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    i think mach3 is nice and friendly. emc is more convoluted. but since the new tragectory planer has come in, its probably a pretty good choice on one of these. will do some fast 3d contouring.
    wotzBotz

  10. #10
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by ihavenofish View Post
    i think mach3 is nice and friendly. emc is more convoluted..
    HOW????? WHY?????
    I have to ask : have you ever seen a screenshot of LinuxCNC????
    Mach is absolutely despicable as far as looks go, while Linuxcnc looks like Iceland's women .

    now wondering .............have you seen Iceland's women? They are beautiful.
    Then again, mach has a face only a mother can love.

  11. #11
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    linux cnc' ui looks like something half finished and barely functional. among the worst ui's ive ever seen. mach is fairly nice and full featured and easy to understand.

    that doesnt mean mach is better at running the machine, just that its got a far more professional and complete UI.
    wotzBotz

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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    You can make the UI look however you want.

    I have both LinuxCNC on a large VMC and Mach3 on a large router. I'd take LinuxCNC any day and twice on sunday before Mach3.

    I had a video card lock up the UI while LinuxCNC was cutting a part. Couldnt do anything with the screen,mouse and keyboard. LinuxCNC kept on cutting until the part was finished. Changed the video card and it was back up and running.

    Try that with Mach3. I'd take robustness and functionality over a nice pretty UI anyday.

    Just my 2 cents.

    Bob

  13. #13
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    like i said, it doesnt make mach 3 'better" at its job. just more friendy. mach has some bugs that make it virtually useless to me. my main complaint on emc was it was super slow, but that should be vastly improved with the latest version.
    wotzBotz

  14. #14
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by bevins View Post
    I'd take LinuxCNC any day and twice on sunday before Mach3.

    Bob
    Nicely said.

    From extensive experience regarding robustness :
    Mach3 => every day is a gamble, you start the computer and......you get windows errors, mach got it's period so it thinks the whole universe uses inches, but you do need mm, you save the fixture ( why the hell does it ask this on close, sometimes without changing or doing absolutely nothing????) etc etc.
    LinuxCNC => if the computer hardware is O.K. you can bet your ........insert whatever here........
    that it will work without a hitch, for months without ever needing to restart EVER.
    The other thing that i extensively use is the ability to program anything and everything and make it work however i see fit. Running 5 phase steppers or running servo motors directly are just the start of it's capabilities.
    I am done, sorry, wandering off subject a bit.
    Tom

  15. #15
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by tommylight View Post
    Nicely said.

    From extensive experience regarding robustness :
    Mach3 => every day is a gamble, you start the computer and......you get windows errors, mach got it's period so it thinks the whole universe uses inches, but you do need mm, you save the fixture ( why the hell does it ask this on close, sometimes without changing or doing absolutely nothing????) etc etc.


    err. never seen a windows error on my cnc pc. never had mach change units automatically. fixture save saves the fixture in a g54 offset in the menu. i never use that feature so i suppose there may be issues, but it doesnt do "nothing"

    many reasons to hate mach3, but those aint it. ive had a ton more issues on linux, like my number pad stop working, par port driver failing if you close and restart emc, etc. nothing is perfect here. everything has its own quirks. hell not even the industrial controls from fanuc etc always work flawlessly

    note that the original biesse control is windows based, as are many new top of the line controls from fanuc, siemens and heidenhain. they do use external hardware though.
    wotzBotz

  16. #16
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    my machine has been running well on mach3- older version which ive stuck with. (galil motion card and pluging)
    over 3 years now- used most days.
    with the correct settings its proving to be amazing-
    im lazy and use it and abuse it- adding bits i want as i want them.
    machs cv settings for carving are superb.
    if running flat out for cabinet work i use exact stop.
    i recently rewrote my drilling scripts slightly - now i understand more about it all (my biesse was my first mach3 conversion so wasnt bad just to get it all going)
    Attachment 282256
    so much to learn, so much to pass on.

  17. #17
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyAp6SNzSE0

    improved drill cycles- as 1 macro so each is just a single line of code.
    small movement was caused by my shoddy subroutine incrementing it.
    still learning- but im a 1 man hobby guy not biesse corporation with loads of head scratchers working together. biesse uk hate me...lol
    so much to learn, so much to pass on.

  18. #18
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    battwell,

    Did you get schematics for your machineÉ Biesse here in Montreal said oh, that machine is way too old. We dont have those manuals anymore. Its a 2000 machine....

  19. #19
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    no. I just traced wiring and drew my own- very simple
    Leave all original wiring intact and piggy back to it

    Did you get schematics for your machineÉ Biesse here in Montreal said oh, that machine is way too old. We dont have those manuals anymore. Its a 2000 machine....[/QUOTE]
    so much to learn, so much to pass on.

  20. #20
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    Re: biesse rover - mach 3 conversion

    Hi everyone. Can anyone tell me if it's possible to change out XNC controller on a Biesse rover 346 and make it run on another software?
    The reason I ask is I have this Biesse rover from1996 but the keyboard on the control panel many of the buttons stopped working like and old TV remote and in my case the start stop reset buttons don't work so I can't start the PLC and Biesse want 5000$ for a new keyboard
    Can anyone referring me to someone who might sell my a different options to get my old rover running again?
    I have seen a YouTube video where they run Mach 3 but I don't really know if its possible to bypass CNI control and only use the server packs and Inverter together with for instance mach3
    Or if someone have a secondhand keyboard for an XNC controller that would do the trick to...Attachment 284132Attachment 284132

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