534,964 active members*
2,823 visitors online*
Register for free
Login

Thread: New 8L Lathe

Page 1 of 2 12
Results 1 to 20 of 21
  1. #1
    Registered
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    136

    New 8L Lathe

    I guess it is official now!

    It looks like they kept some aspects of the RapidTurn, the Duality Lathe, and the 15L and molded them together into a small CNC lathe package.
    I have always wished the RapidTurn had the bed for a tailstock, and was just in the process of incorporating one for my machine. I may wait a bit and consider the 8L.
    Being able to turn 10" between centers will add a lot to what the RapidTurn chucker lathe can do. I like that myself.

    Instead of gang tools on the headstock like I do with the RapidTurn, this would be able to have a better setup for gang tooling for short work. The limit would be the tool post for turning between centers, but looks like it could be a good balance with a gang/toolpost setup possible.

    I just did a basic setup and it looks like about $8500 to get it running.

    It will be interesting to see what people think about this and where it fits. If the price was a little lower it would be great.

  2. #2
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Just finished thumbing thru operators manual. Looks like a decent machine and is +1 " larger footprint then the manual lathe I have. No base wings included.
    IMHO its again a little expensive, but you get a system. And the size format is very appealing to modest shops imho. I have said for many years. If it fits in a 5c I can have my way with it in a mill or lathe. I bet these will be popular.

  3. #3
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    3065

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    They will be adding a 5C-mounted 3-jaw chuck as well.

  4. #4
    Registered
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    665

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    I can't seem to find deets on its construction. Just wondering how heavy duty it is. I'd still like a gang tool plate, auto closer and part puller....

  5. #5
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by Spinnetti View Post
    I can't seem to find deets on its construction. Just wondering how heavy duty it is. I'd still like a gang tool plate, auto closer and part puller....

    The axis moves 4.5" off center of 5c spindle. Be pretty tight to use a gang plate with tools. Bet it can be done either way.
    I have a half dozen parts done in Sprutcam ready to run using generic operations. Just need machine and setup tools and offsets and could be making shiny stuff in no time.

  6. #6
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    I bet these will be popular.
    They sold out in 2weeks, that is popular.

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    117

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    I imagine they didn't have too many in stock right from the go. Would be smart to bring in a couple for testing and/or immediate delivery but limit the initial batch until demand is established.

  8. #8
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Couple quick pointers for anyone setting one of these machines up.

    MY
    machine base come with 2 sets of feet. Look for both sets and decide on what you like before you install on machine base.
    machine was bolted to shipping pallet with large socket head cap screws "had to use 7/16 bolt head for removal tool because no allen / socket head wrenches that big.
    Spend time adjusting lifting straps so the machine is pretty level when lifting. Helps big time when setting it on base and aligning holes
    Follow Tormach's directions at your own risk "but it works and no sheet metal damage" still a spreader bar would eliminate any risk for this lift.
    Check the cast iron legs under lathe for correct length as stated in manual " 3.25 "very important" I used 3.125" as length this left only a paper thin gap around machine sheet metal to base sheet metal.
    It will take some time to align the 4 machine leg holes to the base and install studs and bolt machine down. mirror and flashlight is required for this.
    I then moved machine into position and leveled base so coolant system would not puddle to much.

    Wired it and fired it!
    Important the control puck requires a usb plug on the brix box controller. Do not use the usb extender plugs! Plug everything else like keyboard, mouse, network into it!


    Tool setup
    The directions for setting the tool offsets in the manual does not work as explained. The directions are repeated a number of times in 2 different manuals and had me scratching my head for a couple hours.
    It states a number of times to take skim cut, measure and enter this as a negative value and then select the touch x button. Not clear to me why this is explained so clearly in so many places to use a negative value for the front tool post holder and it does not work that way! It requires just the diameter value only, no negative sign!
    A negative sign moves the entire part center off x-center by that amount and will not work correctly.


    Overall:
    My crates were damaged. machine did have some sheet metal damage "dent" in one spot
    Pallets were almost gone so I had to supply 2x4 material under crate base for pallet jack to move them. This made setup more work also. "Holiday shipping sucks"
    Coolant pump hose fitting was wrong size.
    One shot oil pump had gasket bulge out the side and required repair.
    z axis makes more noise at full rapid then I would expect.

    Better instructions for the collet system and how to assemble, lock and tighten would be helpful to non experienced users.
    Better instructions for High low speed settings would help. Kind of confusing and need more detail on use.
    Better instructions or correct instructions on tool setup of x offset

    In short not much to complain about other than I forgot how much time it takes to clean and setup even a modest / small tool like this.
    Took me a couple days because I have limited use of my hands before they get tired, useless and painful.

    Doing some Test parts and indicating / verifying the inspection report to the machine is last item of my setup list

    Hope this helps some readers on what to expect and what issues I had.

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    158

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    Couple quick pointers for anyone setting one of these machines up.
    Tool setup
    The directions for setting the tool offsets in the manual does not work as explained. The directions are repeated a number of times in 2 different manuals and had me scratching my head for a couple hours.
    It states a number of times to take skim cut, measure and enter this as a negative value and then select the touch x button. Not clear to me why this is explained so clearly in so many places to use a negative value for the front tool post holder and it does not work that way! It requires just the diameter value only, no negative sign!
    A negative sign moves the entire part center off x-center by that amount and will not work correctly.
    Negative value should be used for tools mounted on the operator side. Positive values are the back side. On the slant 15 all turret tools are positive and most gang and the toolpost are negative. Just how the control knows which way to move. You may find that it worked during setup but if you program a part in conversational you may not get the result you expected. When you jog, negative should bring the tool towards you.
    -Jon

  10. #10
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by maker of things View Post
    Negative value should be used for tools mounted on the operator side. Positive values are the back side. On the slant 15 all turret tools are positive and most gang and the toolpost are negative. Just how the control knows which way to move. You may find that it worked during setup but if you program a part in conversational you may not get the result you expected. When you jog, negative should bring the tool towards you.
    Only way I could get conversational to work and it requires negative values in some places also.
    The kicker is sprutcam programs works exactly as you say and put everything in negative values. I set a number of programs with front tool post and they all had to be changed to look like its flipped over and they all have positive values for x

    does not work as documents I read.

    I dont have a clue why it works backwards. Can motor control be wired wrong?

    The couple test programs using 2 different tools I did turned out with great finish and accurate. And all the tool offsets worked fine. Just not per documents . it acts more like rapid turn should work.


    When I jog the Puck minus moves tool away and plus moves tool toward center.

  11. #11
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    Only way I could get conversational to work and it requires negative values in some places also.
    The kicker is sprutcam programs works exactly as you say and put everything in negative values. I set a number of programs with front tool post and they all had to be changed to look like its flipped over and they all have positive values for x

    does not work as documents I read.

    I dont have a clue why it works backwards. Can motor control be wired wrong?

    The couple test programs using 2 different tools I did turned out with great finish and accurate. And all the tool offsets worked fine. Just not per documents . it acts more like rapid turn should work.


    When I jog the Puck minus moves tool away and plus moves tool toward center.




    It us well documented and a CNC standard to use values as per setup instructions. PP even warns you its wrong to have a positive value in x with front mount tools. There is a dip switch or a pp control problem for that axis. I dont understand how it will home correctly but not work per design when setting x offsets.

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    158

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    [ I dont understand how it will home correctly but not work per design when setting x offsets.]

    that is strange. I would contact Tormach through the website or call them tomorrow. I bet a quick phone conversation will sort it out. Does jogging Z- bring the tool closer to the head stock?
    -Jon

  13. #13
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by maker of things View Post
    [ I dont understand how it will home correctly but not work per design when setting x offsets.]

    that is strange. I would contact Tormach through the website or call them tomorrow. I bet a quick phone conversation will sort it out. Does jogging Z- bring the tool closer to the head stock?
    No. Z works correctly in both programs and dro on screen. X + and x- are flipped and make all the programs only work with positive numbers. Sprutcam has ability to do just about anything Was not real hard to flip and change everything to get usable multi tool programs. Brute force settings to test the machine anyway. But it does not look the same in simulation as on machine . But the part come out just as designed and accurate.

    I closely examined all the connections in the control cabinet and dip switches ..compared to design drawings and schematics.... Looks to me like it goes together only 1 way for the most part. So I think its an issue with Path Pilot machine file for 8l .
    Imho in a factory test environment this would shown up in qc. makes me think its control software issue



    Sounds like a long talk with tormach is in order.

  14. #14
    Registered
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    527

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    No. Z works correctly in both programs and dro on screen. X + and x- are flipped and make all the programs only work with positive numbers. Sprutcam has ability to do just about anything Was not real hard to flip and change everything to get usable multi tool programs. Brute force settings to test the machine anyway. But it does not look the same in simulation as on machine . But the part come out just as designed and accurate.

    I closely examined all the connections in the control cabinet and dip switches ..compared to design drawings and schematics.... Looks to me like it goes together only 1 way for the most part. So I think its an issue with Path Pilot machine file for 8l .
    Imho in a factory test environment this would shown up in qc. makes me think its control software issue

    Sounds like a long talk with tormach is in order.
    Hmm.. So if you issue a G0 X1 in the MDI while the machine is at X0 and a zero tool offset set (with nothing to crash into of course), the toolpost moves towards the operator or away?

  15. #15
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by shred View Post
    Hmm.. So if you issue a G0 X1 in the MDI while the machine is at X0 and a zero tool offset set (with nothing to crash into of course), the toolpost moves towards the operator or away?
    To!
    I was told 8l works with positive tool offsets with front mount tools. At this point anyway not a std. imho
    Would have been nice to know up front. Was a little frustrating to figure this out. But no big deal to me at this point. Just need to setup cam templates a little different so they generate code with +x values for front mount tools.

  16. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    158

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Well, all my positive tools are upside down, so if you just realize your lathe is upside down, you will be fine
    -Jon

  17. #17
    Registered
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    527

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by mountaindew View Post
    To!
    I was told 8l works with positive tool offsets with front mount tools. At this point anyway not a std. imho
    Would have been nice to know up front. Was a little frustrating to figure this out. But no big deal to me at this point. Just need to setup cam templates a little different so they generate code with +x values for front mount tools.
    That is unusual. I guess they thought it would be simpler to grok for people with no CNC lathe experience, but it's going to play hell with CAM that thinks otherwise. That said, I did twist my brain into knots setting up an internal threading tool on a SL15 the first time out.

  18. #18

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Is there anything in the MDI to change stepper direction?

  19. #19
    Registered
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    2000

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    Quote Originally Posted by number40Fan View Post
    Is there anything in the MDI to change stepper direction?
    Not that I could find.
    Last word from Tormach was to use plus values for front mount tools. Different then expected. I figured they sell many of these tools into schools for teaching. And if so I would think they would stay as close to a standard as possible.
    That said I did watch a very expensive cnc lathe with only front mount tools and all the values on the control were plus values. It was making valves for $$$ engines. So I guess some controls do use this behavior or mimic it.
    Myself I can adapt either way. The cam I use will complain but it will do it no problem. Like mentioned above your upside down or flipped so its a Tormach Fx8L
    Seams to be a pretty good tool so far! Pretty well made from what i see and easily as accurate or more then the tools I use to measure results.
    The setup process for tools is detailed and requires a number of different ways to get it done. No fast or easy procedures that I can see for them. Much more involved then mostly simple tool offsets used on a mill cutters.
    Cam part, so far is straight forward and almost automatic. The time is spent setting up tool table and setting up tool table and offsets at machine.

    .

  20. #20
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    158

    Re: New 8L Lathe

    I would think fusion or sprutcam wouldn't care if your machine is upside down, as long as your tools are setup correctly. Tool setup is different than a mill for sure. To set tool offset originally and when I turn the machine on for the day, I use conversational to write a program to turn down a piece of stock realistically. Rough doc .1" and finish .01" for example then turn the stock from .5" to .25" and a Z depth of .25" or so (just long enough to get a good surface for the mic). When the machine is done cutting (and cut looks ok)) I move the tool G0 x.25 (programmed final dia) then mic the material and get the actual result. If setting up a tool I then go to offsets and type in the result from the mic and click touch X. If turning the machine on I just type the result into the dro. Basically how John Grimsmo showed in a real old youtube video and I have been happy with the results. If you test cut in delrin then do your real cut in steel, you may have a discrepancy depending on how hard you push your tool.
    -Jon

Page 1 of 2 12

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-21-2019, 09:21 PM
  2. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 03-31-2019, 02:19 AM
  3. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 05-03-2018, 04:14 PM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-05-2017, 06:45 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •