OK start the ball rolling on a hardware store design CNC router.
Printable View
OK start the ball rolling on a hardware store design CNC router.
Well, here we are in the hardware store design thread... Does that mean another black pipe design? Or is there a better option?
I'm not sure we want to go backwards to drawer slides...
And it'd be mighty difficult to do a conduit design like Ger21, cause we don't have a cnc machine to cut all the parts with.
Are we talking improved black pipe designs? Fixed gantry? Moving gantry?
Your thoughts...
Mike...
Hi Milke,
As a newbie with no machinist knowledge but plenty of electronics and lab experience, I've been forced to use the local hardware as a major source of raw material.
For me small means a small workpiece, so it makes sense to move the work not the spindle. I'm heading for a 2.5D axis setup with the z axis movement of the workpiece coming from a separately controlled arm. But I would put the z axis movement on the fixed gantry if I needed to use the spindle in 3D.
As the only source of steppers at the moment is old printers or ebay(limited funds) the timing belts will give me my transmission.
I do have a supply of old display framing - aluminium extrusion - so I plan to use 19mm chrome steel tube ( wardrobe fitting dept) epoxyed into the channel. This will be bolted down onto an offcut slab of formica clad 38mm kitchen worktop.
I'm using miniature bearing from the scrap box augmented from ebay, but would try skate bearing otherwise.
Any thoughts?
Drawslides work pretty good for the X and the Y. You can even you steel wire wrapped around a plastic wheels to move the gantry, like pulling a curtain.
Buying your hardware from ebay is definitely a good option.
As for using the components that you've gotten out of old printers, you'd have to include some photos and descriptions so that we could better understand what you have.
Mike...
Quote:
Originally Posted by greybeard
I'm looking to build a machine using drawer runners. I've located a source with 450mm travel and minimal play in the bearings (heavy duty ball bearing runners).
I've got plenty of stepper motors now from 100oz in upwards and some toothed pulleys/timing belts.
Just need to build a workshop to house it all in before I can start building the machine.
hi
I am currently building a machine , mainly using MDF , but i guess the problem is some of the parts , like 20mm*20mm L section steel at 3mm thick that im using for the runners and supports and 20mm stainless steel bar for the bearing slides, are not available in most hardware shops , (but are available on the web ) and bearings are a problem also,
i thought about using unistrut , that is an excelant matirial for making the frame work , even if a tad expencive , but would require minimal machining
and m10 threaded bar for the lead screws
although i guess all the bits are not available from the big diy hardware stores here in the uk like B&Q and homebase ,but i have found that CEF(city electrical factors) in the uk (have shops in almost every major town) stock items like the treaded bar and unistrut and fittings
i designed my machine to use minimal machining as i only have access to a electric hand drill and the router that i am going to use as the cutting tool and hand tools like saw, file
sorry no pictures yet and its still a few months off compleation but looks like its going to be finished within the £400 budget i set for it and its got a workspace size of 900mm*500mm*100mm
i originally started with the same idea that i should be able to get all the parts from the local diy/hardware store but in the end found that way too restrictive on parts , threaded bar for example was not available , and local steel stock holders can supply steel some places will cut it to lenth also
i can only speak for what the uk hardware stores will stock , and not shure whats available in stores elsware things like good quality draw slides for example are not available
i need to solve a dfx export problem with my cad package (total cad ) to get the fonts right then i will post my design
Dave
My first machine used a combination of drawer slides for the X axis gantry and ball bearings and gas pipe for the Y axis table. I like the drawer slides and am in the process of modifying the table to use slides.
The combo I have worked out is one heavy duty full extent slide mounted 180 degress around and on top of another slide. This means that the table will always have support and the travel is obviously doubled. This will be interesting to test.
mikeschn,
Ger21's conduit design can be done without cnc If you have a good router and a laminate trimmer bit with a bearing. All you have to do is make a simple jig to hold the form that the bit follows & the work piece.
This reminds me of the Dave Gingery books. He talks at length about how some one had to build the first one. It's the old "which came first the chicken or the egg." In this case it is the egg because without the egg you can't make the chicken out of the hardware.:)
Also the draw guide system is not that bad. For a first time machine and a learning experience, I believe most beginners would be very pleased with the machine. I have read about many machines getting 1/32" accuracy from drawer guides. This is far more accurate than most cabinet shops could ever hope for.
I am a newbie my self and I do not have an unlimited budget to build with so I really hope that people will come to the cause with some new "cheap" ideas for the beginner.
Thanks so very much
Jimmy Southern
P.S. don't be afraid to throw out very crazy ideas, sometimes they work!! (group)
Having built a few machines now and used several different hardware store solutions for the slides, I would say that the number 1 consideration is rigidity.
This being said, the easiest way to make a rigid machine is to make a small machine. Drawer slides can work OK on a moving table if the travel is kept small enough. Drawer slides on the Z axis do not work well at all though, another solution is necessary there.
Also a moving table design with a fixed gantry will be far more rigid than a moving gantry design.
So, if I may suggest, lets work towards a small (8" X 12" travel??) fixed gantry moving table design.
Colin
Wow, I didn't realize there would be that much interest in a drawer glide cnc router.
Do we have 2 cad users here that would be interested in working on a drawer glide machine?
Mike...
Doesn't the laminate trimmer force you to cut the entire 3/4" thickness at one pass? Can you cut that much plywood or mdf at one pass?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy Southern
Maybe we should look at a pattern bit.
Mike...
He said router and flush trimming bit, he just was a little unclear. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeschn
A faster, easier way if you have a table saw and drill press:
Use a sliding cutoff sled with a stop to cut all your parts the same length.
Use a fence on the drill press with stops to make the cutouts for the pipes. Use a forstner bit.
For those of you in the UK who want decent quality drawer slides check out www.buller.ltd.uk - speak to Rafael - he's a really nice chap.
Go to Miscellaneous on the left hand side and Runners/Slides - you'll pick up a 500mm length runner for £3.84+vat per pair and up to 700mm for £7.98 a pair and they are pretty reasonable heavy duty bits of kit :)
Gerry,
Thanks for the correction on my post. I was in a bit of a hurry when I typed that.
If you are going to use the flush trim bit idea you will have to remove some of the waste material first and of course rough cut to length & width. But I would use one one master template for all of the pieces for each area to have consistency.
this willgreatly reduce the errors from operator input.
hope this helps
Jimmy Southern :)
I'd suggest you make it a rule that you keep the scope as the title "hardware store design". As example it is reasonable to expect you can buy gas pipe or drawer slides, mdf, drawier glides, rollers at a hardware store. I can't say I've seen IGUS or Thompson parts at one.
I agree with pminmo.....before we muddy up this site...perhaps we need separate threads...one for "hardware store design", 2nd for "gantry with rails"....you kinda have skill level categories....instead of requires 2hammers...we'll have have a machinist rating like "2 mills" with a 1 being the minimal amount of tools, 2 being need access to a mill, 3 being need access to mill & lathe....
Most people will be more likely to have table saws (maybe) and drill presses. Very few will have mills or lathes, imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by ViperTX
And there are a few different forums set up already. But yes, some ground rules need to be set up quickly.
I agree with both of you. The hardware store design is exactly that, with all parts coming out of the hardware store. I went back and re-read the posts, and I can't see where the conversation was diverging, and maybe it didn't. But your point is well taken.Quote:
Originally Posted by ViperTX
We also have threads for a cheapcnc design and a mid level design. That's where it starts getting less clear. For a mid level machine, do you assume access to a mill and a lathe? I like the mill code you started up there... I would suggest the ratings 0 mills, 1 mill or 2 mills.
0 mills is just basic tools, 1 mill is access to at least 1 mill, and 2 mills is access to a mill and a lathe.
With that in mind, the cheapcnc, the 80/20 and the hardware store designs can all be 0 mill designs. The midrange machine can be a 1 mill design, where a person is using his entry level mill to create the masterpiece he really wanted in the first place!
Mike..
Guys,
When you say hardware store supplies, does that mean exactly what it sounds like, or are bearings included? The reason I ask, the local Princess Auto store (think of it as a small town store that caters to farmers) carries almost everything a hardware store does, plus surplus parts and bearings and steel.
Using what they sell, I have built several different machines cheaply, using fairly basic hand tools plus a drill press.
Combine them with Home Depot, or your basic building supplier, and you have everything you need except software and the electronics.
HTH
Iain