How do you do it? What machine do I have to purchase to do it?
please help
-garrett
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How do you do it? What machine do I have to purchase to do it?
please help
-garrett
This might answer you question.
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...ight=anodizing
You need a car battery charger, some aluminum or titanium wire, some battery acid, water, some aluminum plate to use as anodes/cathodes, some clothing dye, a pot, and stove to boil the dye solution on.
If you really want to get hardcore, you upgrade to heavy duty adjustable amperage power supplies, different cleansing agents, some sealants, and some more anodizing specific dyes.
The difference in quality? 99% of the finish you get will depend on prep work. You can get virtually the same finish using a car battery charger as an expensive power supply (as long as you aren't annodizing something with a gigantic surface area).
Is there any machines I could buy that does all that for me?
No, there are no real "machines" per say. You can buy power supplies that work better than a car battery charger however. They also sell titanium anodizing racks for doing large quanities of parts at once, but that's probably not what you are after.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeyser14
How is there no machines for this? So you are saying everybody does it out of a coleman cooler? I was reading this machining book about production anodizing. there HAS to be a machine
You should find all the info and the products here:
http://www.focuser.com/atm/anodize/anodize.html#top
or
http://www.caswellplating.com/kits/aluminum.htm
Hope this help,
Alex
Pyro, There isn't a "machine" that will automatically do your anodizing. Professional systems are basically the same as the Coleman cooler system, except that the tanks are alot bigger and they have automated conveyor systems to move the product from tank to tank and dip them in the tanks for the proper amount of time.
I'd say that the "machine" that you are talking about is a "factory system". Cost is probably about $5 million dollars.
All,
I purchased a complted kit from Focuser.com. Prior to purchasing the kit, I bought his manual which is a guide and complete step by step of the process and the equipment needed to set up your own anodizing line. After reading the manual, I purchased the kit from him and it was all done in a very professional mannor. I am still in the process of completing the line, but have done some small sample parts. I ended up buying a "professional" style power supply, I am using a Moeller controller for the heating and timing. And, a aquarium ariator to keep the stuff moving. I am automating my equipment, using slides to dip the racks, control the temp and time thru the controller and then slide the racks back out when the controller tells it to. Anyway, it is working out well, still have some things to do but all in all I am very pleased.
Regards,
Glen
Oh yeah,
The guide / manual was around $24, and I believe that was taken off my purchase of the kit when I made the purchase.
Glen
Quote:
Originally Posted by buscht
really there is that much of a demand to have a 5 million dollar factory? What else do they anodize?
A whole lot of what you buy is anodzied and you probably don't even realize it. Heat sinks on electronics, metal keychains, basically anything that is made from aluminum is almost guaranteed to be anodized.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkeyser14
wow didn't know. I just wanted to anodize some stuff that I machine. But if this is a business maybe I could help people out. hmmmm
Here's a website for a typical aluminum extruder/anodizer.
http://www.bowers-mfg.com/anodize.html
Look at a MagLite flashlight. Those are all aluminum anodized. I heard that they make 40,000 of each color at a time. That's alot of anodizing for just one little product.
I've had the pro's do anodizing and i've done it myself. I would not do it unless I had to and here's why.Quote:
Originally Posted by pyroracing85
First, anodizing is not expensive. I get aluminum tubes anodized. They are 2" long, 3/4" OD and 1/2" ID. I think I paid about $150 for 400 of them to get anodized in about 6 different colors and they came out perfect.
I tried to anodize myself. First you must clean the parts PERFECTLY to a bare AL finish. Then you anodize in sulfuric acid at a given rate based on the amount of AL you are doing. You hang the part with wire and when its done, you rinse it off then you put it in color for 30-60 min, then you boil it. To get the same results as the pros you need to accuarely get your acid solution right. You also need to have the right current - not too much to burn your part. You need the right kind of dye or the color wont be even or it wont take. I've gotten to where I can get results 95% as good as the big guys, but it is a hassle, I have buckets of acid around and I have to set it all up to anodize. If I wanted to do it for parts to sell on a regular basis, I would absolutely get a good power supply where I can adjust the voltage and current. I would use titanium racks because bending wire all the time is a huge pain. I would use lead conductors for the cathode and I would leave it set up all the time. You also want coolers on your acid bath or it will overheat if you use it too much and coolers aren't cheap.
All those parts may not sound critical but the reality is that they all contribute to the overall quality of the part. If you skip on the power supply and the right temperature acid bath and don't rinse right or use a nitric etchant you will lose a couple of % here and a couple of % there of finish quality. It would take probably hundreds or thousands of parts before you save money over what a shop would charge. And if you do it as a business you have to think about rinse water (don't flush it or put it in the sink - thousands in fines if you do). You also have to treat all your waste as haz mat which is expen$ive and you need permits and inspections and on and on. In addition, if you do someones part and it comes out bad (which they sometimes will) its a tough job to redo them all.
Personally I would always outsource anodizing. Its a messy job with a lot of regulations and hassles to deal with, and its tough to make money unless you have some really big accounts. But those big accounts will go with the BIG shops with 1000+ gallon tanks and overhead cranes to move parts between tanks who can do it WAY cheaper than you will be able to.
My 2 cents from someone who has done it before. My local shop charges minimum $85 but their prices are good as long as you're doing more than 1 part. They would likely charge $50 for a wheel, etc, which would be a HUGE hassle to do yourself (too much juice to anodize it). I would only anodize when I need one or two parts and I need them like yesterday for a prototype, etc.
You're right for the most part. If you are trying to do large scale production, it's not worth it. But if you are doing a lot of small batches, it saves you money.
And finishing the aluminum first definititely is the hardest part. Or if you are lazy, you can sand blast it for a frosted look (who said the ano had to be shiny?).
You can make your own adjustable power supply for about $50. My friend has one that is 12V 0-30A he made from a computer power supply and potentiometer. It's enough to do a reasonably sized batch, but nothing close to the large production vats that large companies do.
I would by no means discourage anyone from trying though, it's very satisfying to actually do yourself (even though it will take several samples to get things set up correctly).
I second the "sending it out is cheaper/easier" option. For example, once I get my CNC router up and running I will be machining a part (3" circle/badge) and I will want to have them Anodized. So, I called around and found a local place that will just charge a basic batch charge (since I have small parts, and 100-500 parts at a time). Came out to $.40 per for clear and $.45 for color. Far too cheap for me to even bother trying to do it myself.
It was this company, for anyone that is local and is interested:
Deluxe Anodizing
(716) 856-6203
588 Michigan Ave
Buffalo, NY 14203
Quote:
Originally Posted by buscht
I work in a sulfuric acid anodize line (You can anodize with Phosphoric or sulfuric) at Bowers MFG. We have one of the Largest ano lines in the US.
The "machines" are hoists. Each one is about 6 feet square and can lift about 2000 lbs. Our racks are about 20 feet long and some of them hold around 60,000 parts. (depending on the part) We have 40 some tanks. If you want shiny parts they go in nitric acid and phosphoric acid. If you want etched (or matte) parts they go in sodium Hydroxide. When they are actualy anodized they are in sulfuric acid and water. The electricity and acid creates a very hard coat of "corrosion" that is imperceptable to the eye but very hard. After the anodic process they are dyed. Our black dye is very expensive at a couple thousand dollars for 5 gallons. We also have gold dye, stainless steel, Brown, Carbon and clear. (which skips the dyes alltogether) Other plants have colors like blue and pink. Last I heard there is no white anodizing. I heard is impossable. Etch clear is the closest you can get. A warning for any do it yourselfers, sulfuric acid for anodizing is very corrosive and will burn you nearly instantly. It does not mix well with water. Boils when you mix the two if not done properly. Phosphoric acid is not as bad on you skin. It will itch mostly. Don't get anything with a high or low PH in your eyes. You will go blind.