Help needed from the Taig Pros...shopping list

Hey guys, while I'm a long time lurker of this great forum, I've only joined today. I've found there is a ton of reading and know what I'm asking could be a loaded request, but it beats doing the wrong thing 10 times before getting it right.

After owning multiple machine shops and owning multiple product lines, I now source all of my work out, but have found I desperately need to be able to prototype my own parts in house (at least the parts that have high potential for changes prior to production). A majority of my parts are milled components but a few will require a lathe (which I plan to go ahead and order a Taig micro lathe).

So here's the request. I'm needing help putting together a solid 4th axis capable (or 4th axis included) Taig setup that can handle fine detail, and can do it as quickly as possible...within reason of course. Time is of the essence and I am looking to get the necessary parts/kits on order now.

I know there are a lot of preferences involved as to the ideal Taig CNC setup, but I need to get the right parts the first time to get the most performance for my $$ and get me to cutting prototypes...that's why I am coming to the most informed users of the Taig mills with my request. I utilize Alibre for all of my design and have the CAM package for it along with an older version of MasterCAM. What I am looking for is guidance on everything I need to be cutting parts. I have a large air compressor here and will be building an enclosure with air and mist for it right away as well.

You can browse around my site and see the types of parts/materials I'll mostly be working on/with. www.billet-works.com

I know I'm asking a lot and hope I don't get blasted too hard here.

Thanks a ton for taking the time,

Don Eidson
Owner
Billet Works Designs
Partner
Billet Works Tactical

http://deepgroove1.com/

Not sure what the quality of their rotary table is.

Deepgroove uses a sherline rotary table, he adds a taig 3 jaw chuck if you want it. IF you would like I have an extra i can sell you with or without the chuck. It has his current 280 stepper motor on it. I currently have 3. This one hasnt been used other than to spin it in circles when I hooked up my mill to the driver set up. Im using the taig deepgroove set up as well. pm me if you would like a price on the 4th axis. Mike

Yeah, I know deepgroove1 sells them, I was looking for input regarding the most stable, reliable, and best performing setup whether it be a full setup from a single vendor, or seperate parts from various vendors to achieve the best possible results for the $$.

I'm sending you a PM mredburn.

Don
BWD

Quote:

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Originally Posted by billet works

Yeah, I know deepgroove1 sells them, I was looking for input regarding the most stable, reliable, and best performing setup whether it be a full setup from a single vendor, or separate parts from various vendors to achieve the best possible results for the $$.

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What is your budget for the mill?

For performance, the 280oz motors deepgroove uses are described as too large by some. People have had better rapids results by using smaller motors, but it likely won't matter for the components I see on your page.

His wiring can be questionable, but its hard to screw up a g540 install. G540's are reliable drivers, and support is great (check out the gecko forum).

Developing a thorough shopping list for getting started is desktop machining depends greatly on what types of things you are trying to make. The link to your website was a big help in this regards.

Machine wise, for the Taig CNC mill, everybody starts with the same 2019CR-ER from Taig. The difference is in the quality of construction of the controller and what it is already pre-wired to do. Many are just the bare necessities, others have all the plugs for limit switches, VFD, etc already brought out to the rear panel. One sticking point for me, from my industrial experience, is that I always look for a real E-Stop switch on any piece of automated equipment. While a Taig mill probably won't kill you having an E-Stop switch for those 'O-Sh8t!!' moments is priceless.

Most folks, including Taig themselves, use the Sherline rotary table. It is a very solid piece of work. The nice thing is that you can use any Taig or Sherline chuck on it. You'll need the right mounts to fit it too the Taig table. I also like using the Sherline tail-stock with my rotary table and made a small spacer for mine to allow aligning them both up along the center-line of the mill's table.

For the lathe I would suggest getting the newer lathe with the power feed already installed. I really enjoy the power feed, it can certainly improve your finish quality.

Tooling is another area to visit. The folks I know who do similar types of work find that good quality carbide stub mills produce great quality cuts in aluminum, diamond-cut PCB router bits also work great for composites.

Jeff Birt at http://soigeneris.com/default.aspx has a really nice controller setup based on the G540. He has done a good job of exposing all of the inputs and outputs.

He is also a Taig dealer and stocks a good range of accessories from various companies.

I originally bought my Taig from Deepgroove1 and was satisfied with the transaction. I bought a bunch of accessories from Jeff and that went very well too. I wouldn't hesitate to deal with either of them again.

bob

I wouldn't get the deepgroove1 unit if you want something that is turnkey. It sounds like you'd be happier with a system that already has limit switches, working relay controlled power sockets (for spindle and coolant) and robust wiring.

I'd probably second the idea of talking to Jeff Birt. He has impressed me on these lists, but I've never done any business with him.

My Taig is an older model from Super-Tech. It doesn't use the latest and greatest drivers, but it has good integration of limit switches and power relays. The owner of that company (Dennis) was also pleasant to work with when I was looking for information on how to drive it. I'm not using their software, I run it with EMC2 and CamBam. If I were buying a new unit I'd be tempted to look at their options. I would probably avoid the USB-based ones unless there are methods for using them with Mach3 or EMC2.

Deepgroove1 seems to be the budget choice, but his setups are more about providing a kit of components that you need to get working together. They are bare minimum setups for CNC.

Finally, you might consider flood coolant instead of mist. I didn't find it much more work to setup, the components were less expensive, and I'm getting much more reliable performance out of my flood coolant setup. I can take much deeper cuts with more aggressive feed rates. It also runs much more quietly, which is nice when I'm doing other stuff in the shop.

First off I have to say WOW...what a great group of guys in here. This is precisely the kind of help I was/am looking for. I am definitely wanting something as turn key as possible and at the same time want something with minimal headaches and good performance. As for budget...it's relative. I am looking to spend what I need to in order to get the right setup that meets my needs/wishes. I'm using this for business as well as hobby so it will be used a lot and will most likely not be the only Taig to end up in my shop from what I've seen so far.

I also appreciate the input on the mist vs flood. I would much prefer flood as that is all I ran on my HAAS mills and prefer it far over the mist systems I've used...especially when it comes to milling pockets and such in aluminum. Would you happen to have a link to pics of your flood setup?

Jeff, I left you a message and appreciate your personal attention so quickly. When you have a minute to chat, please feel free to get back with me.

Thanks everyone and please feel free to post up any more info and/or pointers you think might be helpful to a Taig newb like myself.

Don

Get the whole thing from Taig (or a Taig dealer). Their top-of-the-line DSLS 3000 system comes all ready to run, with a proprietary control box, Mach3, a relay receptacle box, encoder-equipped stepper motors, cables, collets, vise, etc. The rotary 4th axis kit for that model includes the Sherline rotary table mounted for vertical use, an encoder-equipped stepper motor, and an adjustable tailstock that mounts on the bed of the mill.

One advantage of getting it all from the same manufacturer is that you will get technical support that doesn't pass the buck to whomever supplied whatever odd components you've cobbled together in hopes of assembling a working system - Taig has a stern note on their site disclaiming any responsibility for supporting people's home-made motion control solutions:

http://www.taigtools.com/specialnote.html

They are good, however, at supporting their own proprietary systems.

Andrew Werby
www.computersculpture.com

After getting tons of great emails regarding this, and several long chats with Jeff Birt, I ordered a full 4 axis Taig setup and a loaded power feed Taig lathe from Jeff at Soigeneris. I don't think you could find a more helpful and informed guy out there, who looked closely at what I'll be using it for, and set up a package suited to meet those needs.

Knowing how obsessed I get with this stuff, I already warned Jeff that once verifying the mill does what I need, I will be ordering at least a second to keep up with all the R & D going on here. I also have already begun planning a Taig CNC lathe setup as it's a must have for my shop, which will mostly comprised of components from Jeff's shop.

I am still very interested in knowing what tooling, vises, etc. you guys have had the best luck with and which vendor you've gone through for it all.

I will be posting up a thread showing the Mill and Lathe all setup and making parts as soon as they arrive and I get the enclosures all built up.

Thanks again everyone...looks like I have found a new hobby and a favorite online hangout for tons of cool info and guys. Works well with my OCD :)

Don

You picked a good guy to buy from.I've found it's not the price it's the after sell service. Jeff is the man there.Bought the 4axis controller and 166 steppers from him and this mill is fast. I have the smooth stepper also.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by billet works

Would you happen to have a link to pics of your flood setup?

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Pictures are coming, but for now I made this short video with the mill making a 2D part with flood coolant going. There are some stills at the end showing the overall setup:
[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcHI00MC35Y"]YouTube- CNC Taig mill with flood coolant[/nomedia]

I probably have it flooding more coolant than I need for cooling purposes, but I find that a higher volume does a better job of pushing chips away. I probably need to get a nozzle with a smaller oraface so that I can use a lower volume of coolant but get higher pressure.

alex