Anybody in here using OpenDMIS ver. 2.8 yet? Just would like to compare notes with ya. I'm a machinist 80 percent of the time and an inspector the rest of the time. I've been working on a Wenzel CNC CMM for the last couple of months.
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Anybody in here using OpenDMIS ver. 2.8 yet? Just would like to compare notes with ya. I'm a machinist 80 percent of the time and an inspector the rest of the time. I've been working on a Wenzel CNC CMM for the last couple of months.
Hey Joe
We are using OpenDMIS 2.8 but we have the Wenzel Xcite Manual CMM. I am very new to dmis I was a Zeiss guy at my last job.I am a former machinist, CNC programmer but with some health issues going all quality was the way for me. I am in a pretty big learning curve right now. But we might be able to help each other. you can e-mail if you like [email protected] Looking forward to hearing from you.
Best Regards Ray
New to CMM and OpenDmis would like like to exchange ideas ect.
Well, I guess there's three of us anyway. Yeah, so what to say. Well, for one, I get the distince impression that the guys at Wenzel and Xspect are learning this software at the same time as we are. One example that gives me that impression as as follows.
I often come across parts in our shop that have the centerline of the part as the secondary datum. On almost all of these parts there are features of size that are dimensioned to that datum. They are symmetrical features like walls or slots and the often have a maximum material condition called out on them. The last time I asked a question on the OpenDMIS.com help forum, I didn't really get an answer that I liked. Or, more to the point, it seems like the software wasn't designed to do what I need it to do. Here's the question that I posted and the reply:
I'm trying to make one feature out of two (hopefully parallel) planes so that I can apply maximum material condition and then a true position tolerance to that one feature. Also, I'd like to know the min/max deviation from nominal. The feature (in this case) is an open-ended slot but there are other times that I need to do the same with widths.
Joe,
The only way that I can see if measure an open ended slot is to create a slot with only nominal information for the nominal updated with your actual for the width. What you have here basically is a true position that you can't actually measure because there is no way position the Y positioin if the X were to be the height of the slot.
[--- UPDATED: 6/29/2009 3:06:51 PM ---]
Called the customer to clarify the question.
First question was how to measure open ended slot. Customer to email solution or file to clarify.
Second question was how to measure min and max width between two planes. Measured as a distance tolerance with a tolerance for min and a tolerance for max selected from the drop down menu.
I think it's very powerful software and the guys are very helpful and tolerant of my ignorance but it really seems like the software is in it's infancy. You guys havin' any better luck?
Make that 4 of us. Anyone have any experience with offline programming?
You know, Rob, I haven't tried programming a part completely offline but I'd imagine if you're good with your methodology, it wouldn't be a big deal. I'm not real experienced at Open DMIS so I often end up going back to the code and modifying clearance planes and such. How 'bout you?
Yes I find myself programming most everything we do in the learn mode and then editing and adding code afterwards. I just found out yesterday that in order to program offline you need the OpenDMIS Cad module. Something that we don't have. We have a couple of large quantity orders coming up and I was hoping to have them programmed prior to the first piece inspection so I wouldn't hold up the operators. Doesn't look like this is going to happen. I am also quite unhappy with the help files and the manual. Its basically a tool for definitions and not much on the tutorial side of things.....I had to learn a lot of things by trial and error....what about you?
Our company bought the Wenzel CNC CMM and controller. They bought a package deal, I guess, that included 3 days of training at Xspect Solutions' place out in Oakland, Ca., and a year of support. Myself and the main inspector went through the training together but we still spent a month, off and on, getting our first complex program to work and be accurate. That was WITH alot of remote desktop support. I'm not sure what you mean by not having the CAD module. Is it a way to draw the objects? We don't draw ours. We either get them from the customer or our machine programmer draws up a step file with Mastercam.
I am not certain either. But when I called and asked them about offline programming they told me that in order to program offline you needed to have their "CAD" module. They are supposed to have someone get in touch with us so as soon as I know I will post it here. We also had the three day training but in Detroit. I think it covered most of the basics and it was enough to get us started but like you we needed a lot of desktop support. We learned a lot of it on our own just by trial and error.
Open DMIS V2.8
<begin rant>
Open DMIS is the weakest CMM software I have ever used. Maybe I'm spoiled because I learned to program on PC-DMIS, but this software is just silly in so many ways.
1) No sensor angle changes during measurement
2) Doesn't maintain preferences like up/down digit counting
3) Occasionally flips features for no reason
4) Probe just stops working sometimes after an angle change. Need to close the software and reinitialize it
5) Creates code out of nowhere sometimes
6) No MMC on a slot. Say what? Really? REALLY???
7) No MMC on a sphere
8) Creates/adds phantom features to the feature tree almost everytime I start it
The list goes on...
I've been really patient with this software. The people at Xspect seem to think that part of my problems are a corrupted install. But of course they won't fix it unless I pay them. Why would I pay an SMA for software that is so weak? The MMC on a slot was the final straw. That's just assinine. I talked to some reps for the company and they confirmed that you can't put MMC on a slot, but if I updated my SMA they would pass it along to their programmers and they would add it. Really? Your going to rewrite and add to the program just for ME? What are there... 12 people that use this? Give me a break. Nobody has ever needed to put MMC on a slot? Looks like the guy up above sure did.
Just dumb. Plain dumb.
<end rant>
You know you can't do an open-ended slot either...or make 2 parallel planes a feature of size (to use MMC ;) ). PCDMIS huh? Were you not given a choice on the switch?
I know of 6 people now... :D
I remember the phantom features and CRDs from 2.8 It seems to be gone in 3.0.
I don't call tech support anymore. Whenever I do, they just answer my question with a bunch of other questions. It almost seems like they never have used the software themselves.
I was quite frustrated with the learning curve of this software. The classes are OK for getting you the basics of where everything is located but leaves you learning a lot on your own. After hopelessly searching the help files ( which are in no way helpful) and asking for tutorials (that I never received) I decided to take the program offline and learn how to program offline on my own. Frustrating and more time-consuming then it should have been we did accomplish the task.
As far as PC-DMIS being a better software....I have heard it go both ways with this or that being the better software. Being an application engineer for one of the big three CAD companies I can tell you that software is software and there will always be bugs. Some will affect others more depending on what features are used and how frequently. As far as tool angle changes during measurements it works for me when I program offline. the weird thing is it doesn't look right in the code. When I run the program it works. Since I installed the software I have not had a slot to check at MMC, only holes. However I am sure I will run into this sooner then later. I am going to share this thread with the people at OpenDMIS and hopefully we can get someone from there to join us to help explain some things a little better. Have a good day gentlemen and keep the comments coming....It can only help all of us get better and let the people at OpenDMIS know that we have concern!
No probe indexing (angle changes) when program is running? Really???
Have seen the software lockup after indexing, regardless of manual or automatic operation. However, the problem was with the PH10M, not the software. During an index cycle, the software waits for a successful clamp signal from the PH10M. If that signal is not received within a specific time frame, the software faults (in this case, locks up). Granted this error could/should be handled differently. Swapped out the PH10M with a known good unit, problem fixed! The questionable PH10M worked fine on the other machine, because WTutor (software on other CMM) will go through an unclamp-reclamp cycle 3 times before it times/alarms out.
Never stop ranting!!! Remember, it's the sqeaky wheel that gets the grease!! (just make sure it's not Vaselne!)
Hi there,
I am new to open DMIS & am currently learning how to use higher level language, i have currently come across the following problem and wondering if there is an easy solution.
I would like to write a variable to an external text file which is saved as a unique serial no and then read the variable back at a later stage.
cant find a simple solution to this, any ideas?
Thanks
Looks like this place is pretty empty... I've been trying to find an opendmis forum that is active. Anyone have suggestions?
I have a year of experience with opendmis on manual and automatic machines, and have received wenzel's advanced training. I can probably help with some basic issues for beginners and i would be willing to share the tips and tricks i learned from xspect. I know how to program offline with or without a CAD model.
so, if you're out there, please reply.
THANKS!
Jamriggsy, did you find the solution for your request?
I have done this part of DMIS code and I could give you the information.
doc michael-
i'd liket o see that code. i've been trying to figure out how to save excel output in a way that saves the date time and operator for each session rather than appending just the dimensions to one big file.
thanks!
$$ ----- Sample to write a prompted filename in a File ---------------
DECL/COMMON,CHAR,255,FILE1, file_in_folder
FILE1 = PROMPT/'Input Filename'
file_in_folder=assign/concat('C:\Filefolder\',FILE1,'.xxx')
DID(Parameter)=DEVICE/STOR,file_in_folder
OPEN/DID(Parameter),DIRECT,OUTPUT,OVERWR
Write/DID(Parameter), FILE1
CLOSE/DID(Parameter)
$$ -------------------------------------------------------------------
$$ ----- Sample to read variable(s) from a previous stored filename -------------------
DECL/COMMON,CHAR,255,FILE1, file_in_folder
file_in_folder = ASSIGN/'C:\FILEFOLDER\TEST.XXX'
DID(Parameter)=DEVICE/STOR,file_in_folder
OPEN/DID(Parameter),DIRECT,INPUT
READ/DID(Parameter), FILE1
CLOSE/DID(Parameter)
$$ -------------------------------------------------------------------
Hope this small samples helps to understand
I recently started using OpenDMIS 2.64 on a manual Hansford, and I've hit a snag. Maybe I'm overlooking something ... hopefully someone can help. I can't seem to figure out how to get it to construct a line between the centerpoints of 2 circles. I can drag circles in the feature pane to 'Points' and produce the midpoints, but highlighting 2 points and dragging them to 'Line' it does nothing. I can see the plus sign appear under my cursor as though it would be able to do this, but it doesn't work. Any ideas?
You have to D&D the 2 circle features from the database window into
"construction" menue item "bestfit"
Remember all what you can't find to construct, try it under "bestfit"
Aha! Thanks so much Doc. This was totally escaping me. I'll give it a try tomorrow.
anyone knows how to tolerate a perpendicular i have the open dmis version 2.4
I think jaja...
hello you can help me?
my name is miguel you know take the perpendicularity in opendmis 2.8?
thanks
Sup guys, I am new to this forum and like most of you I have issues with opendmis. I have taught myself up until now but am now at a stopping point. Is there anyone who can assist me on how to get a iterative alignment to work in this software?
I too am new to OpenDMIS and, unfortunately have been stuck with the oldest version (1.0) of the software. I was curious to see if anyone would know how to align a CRD system to circle features on a part. The part that I am trying to program is circular with thru holes at each quadrant that I am trying to align my CRD to. The problem is the CRD always is skewed on the XY plane causing my tolerances to be thrown off. All I want to do with this part is program it to align the CRD to the center of the part with the X and Y axsys' directly through the respective through holes.
If anyone could help me with this I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you.
The thing I do in that case is pick up the through holes and make a best fit line out of them. Then build your coordinate system from the top of the part as your Z direction/origin, the OD or ID of the part as your Y (or X) origin , and finally, the best fit line as your X (or Y) direction/origin*. *You'll have to set your OD or ID as your X and Y origin depending on weather your holes comprise your datum or the axis of the part does. Obviously, you can choose holes opposite of each other or (assuming the holes are equally spaced about the axis of the part) choose holes next to each other or even both sets of holes for your X as well as your Y. Guess it depends mostly on what features you need to align to but most likely the axis of the cylindrical part is most important. The best fit line will 'clock' your coordinate system even though it may not be the feature that you want to use for the origin of your datum. This make sense? Hope it helps.
Spent 4 years programming with PC-Dmis. I took 4 years off to raise my son and now I am back programming, but with Open Dmis. I would like to mirror a whole program. I am only seeing options to mirror features and cad models. Does anyone know how or if this is even possible with Open Dmis?
Sounds funky. So you want to make a mirror of a program? I'm trying to think of a case where I'd need to do that but can't imagine. I've made a 2-up program (to check two parts per run) but not mirrored. Mind sharing the purpose? Were you able to do it in pcdmis?
I would imagine if you have a left hand and a right hand part, you should be able to mirror the program of a left hand into a right hand??
Tolerance question. When checking for true position, does anyone know where to input the locations of the dimensions I want to check. Usually you have basic dimensions you apply, but I am not able to find it on Dmis under the true position tolerance.
Did you get an answer for this tolerance question yet? If not, here's my experience. The basic dimensions are already in the definition of your nominal feature. i.e. You've defined and saved to your features database/ DMIS code the nominal/actual of a feature or you've extracted from a CAD model a feature. The true position measurement function compares the nominal (basic) dimensions of a feature to the actual (measured) dimensions of that feature in relation to your coordinate system. There are features that will not work with the true position function. One of them is a cone. I think you can find in the help file all of the features that won't work but I'm not sure. Hope this helps.
Thanks for your help Joe. Question.... I would like to mirror a program, but have no idea on how to do it. The reason for it is I have a left hand and a right hand part. It's a big one and I do not feel like writing it from scratch. Can anyone assist me with this?
I'll see if I can try today. I'm guessing it all might start in constructions with mirroring all of the features but I think I recall an option to mirror DMIS code. I'm guessing you don't have a cad file(s)?
As of right now I don't. Thats something we are looking to the future on. I am currently running the right hand version of the parts and have the left hand waiting on me. Once I am done I will also try the different options in DMIS. There just has to be the option somewhere. Thanks for your quick response.
I did try the mirror dmis thing today. I mirrored about my final coordinate system in the xy plane and ran the program off line. It did in fact run upside down but the approach of the probe was through the part. I also tried the yz and xz planes but I couldn't tell what was going on. Your CMM is CNC isn't it? I mean, I'm assuming that you don't just need to mirror the nominal features to measure manually. Also, what version of opendmis are you running? Have you tried exporting your nominals as a cad file in ices format? I tried that today for the first time. I guess it would be useful in that you wouldn't have to generate new nominals but you would have to reprogram the hits and so forth. Just a thought. I was pondering the idea of just changing the positive x values to negative ones but then you have the approach vectors (I's & J's) to deal with if they are anything other than 1's and 0's. I did not try constructing mirrored features individually though. I'm also assuming you've created your nominals from actuals and cleaned them up in the code?
Joe,
Thank you for your help once again. The version of DMIS I am running is 3.21 . Sorry, but I do not understand exporting my nominals as CAD files in Ices format. I was thinking the same thing as too changing the "x" values, but my concern was exactly what you stated, the approach vectors. I have created my nominals from my actuals and did indeed clean them up in code. Since my nominals are set, I think I will give changing the "x" values a shot. I can always modify the approach distances, it's better than reprogramming the whole thing from scratch. But, if I have to I will.
The part I have is around 970 dimensions, obviously, I cannot get everything on the CMM. But I have programmed most of it. Here's an example of the size of my program. It's around 5000 lines of code for the 1st. operation. Roughly, 27 pages of output information. So you can see why I would love to have mirror image for the left hand part. I will let you know how it goes.
Thanks for your help again Joe. You rock.
Greetings everyone! My company just got a Wenzel CMM with OpenDMIS Neptune Version 3.0. Does anyone still run this version? I am trying to learn this with minimal training. My main question is if anyone has been able to get a star stylus to build properly? I have tried to get it to build as a parent with the down stylus and the other ones as children, but when I try to use it in a program, the active probe it the only one the CMM sees, and I cant get it to clear when going into an ID hole, other than manually mapping the co-ordinates...any ideas?
Thanks
Anyone have code to share..
I have made the switch from PCDmis to Opendmis and it was pretty simple. OpenDmis has a vey short learning curve if you are familiar with vectors, basic dmis code and understand basic cmm operation and how things are constructed/ viewed from a geometric standpoint. Actually been 10 years since using PCDmis and was surprised how quick I pick up OpenDmis. At first I thought it was a "simple" program compared to PCdmis but after a couple of months realized it can do just about anything PCDmis can..... and it utilizes native dmis code better than most. PCDmis, Calypso, etc. have much of thier code is program specific and does not help when needing to transfer to another machine/ program. Calypso reminds me when MAC came out compared to DOS.. A windows driven app that leaves the code behind the scenes. Great for an operator but does not teach the programming code side. Your kind of stuck using calypso if that is all you know. Learn dmis code and you can pretty much pick up any program code even if translated a bit different.
I have put together a file with all the different code examples for different things.. inputs, outputs, variables, cad models, etc. that I would share if there is an interest.