Problems configuring new Mach3 CNC Controller for mill

Hi,

My old control board seems to have given up the ghost (NCPod), and I have bought a replacement, a Mach3 USB Motion Card (JDSW51B): https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07H6JJG...roduct_details

The text in the installation instructions calls for the "RnRMotion.dll" to be installed, but the images show "BL-USBMach.dll".

After some initial problems trying to get my laptop (32bit Windows7), and Mach3 to recognise that the board was plugged in, and also trying the RnRMotion.dll, I ended up factory resetting the laptop and starting afresh, and trying the BL-USBMach.dll.

Now when I open Mach3, it can recognise the board and I am able to access options such as the plugin configuration menu.

Using the recommended setting from the instructions (motor outputs) to set the Direction and step pins all to zero and the ports for both to 1 for each of my 3 axis, I don't get any motion when I hit any of the Jog keys. If I set the configs be as per the settings for the NCPod then there is some communication/output. It is nothing like commanded though - e.g. if I press to jog in any direction either the X or Y axis the Z axis will stutter (very slow and noisy) in the -ve direction, and pressing Z axis jog in either direction results in no motion at all.

If anyone could help with the configuration here then that would be great, please. I've double-checked the wiring to the motor drivers and all seems as per the instructions for common Anode. If you have experience of using those settings for this board before and it has been successful then that is good to know, so I can rule that out and look at other potential sources of the problem.

Thanks,
John.

Have you set motor tuning for your motor?

Yes. I have set the motor tuning to be the same as I had previously

I feel like this is most likely a Mach3 configuration issue on the Comms side. I don't think I have a good understanding of what information needs to be sent over the USB - My guess is that Mach3 transmits to the control board a message with something like - send 50pulses to the X axis in the +ve direction, but I don't understand how the command board would know how to route that information to the correct stepper driver if there is no differentiation between the channels in the config. as a mentioned in the original post "the Direction and step pins all to zero and the ports for both to 1 for each of my 3 axis" (as per the instructions attached). Any help or insight into this would be appreciated from those in the know!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BandyPins

I feel like this is most likely a Mach3 configuration issue on the Comms side. I don't think I have a good understanding of what information needs to be sent over the USB - My guess is that Mach3 transmits to the control board a message with something like - send 50pulses to the X axis in the +ve direction, but I don't understand how the command board would know how to route that information to the correct stepper driver if there is no differentiation between the channels in the config. as a mentioned in the original post "the Direction and step pins all to zero and the ports for both to 1 for each of my 3 axis" (as per the instructions attached). Any help or insight into this would be appreciated from those in the know!

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There setup for that Board does not seem right, had it ever been running with those Port / Pin settings, each axis normally could not share the same pins unless the plugin has it different for each axis and it just needs to be checked in Mach3., this Breakout Board seems to be not a good choice, the red Eagle Board seems to be better.

Does the Board have the correct power it requires?

Thanks for the response Mactec. I noticed I didn't have the 24V supply connected to the Control board also earlier, so I changed that but it's still the same. I'm going to try to changing around the port/pin settings to see if I spot any sort of pattern that seems to make it work, starting with just one axis. Otherwise I'll ditch it and switch to the red eagle type board you mention, which I assume is this one: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08BJTB1...roduct_details

You have to watch this type of boards closely. They might have same pin number on different ports. They might have positive or negative output and if you supply more than 5 Volts to the board (like you said 24V) they might require resistors between the board and stepper drivers. In additional- some of these boards have open collector outputs without power .
I think your board needs separate 5Volts for the drivers and 12-24 Volts for PWM
Usually it would be in description but sometimes they send the board with generic descriptions for several different boards and you have to figure out which one to use. Or hey send you the wrong one… It happens. But in general it comes with config file for Mach3 . You run it and puts pins and ports in a right order. You still have to check all and do motor tuning.
If you post a detailed diagram how you’ve connected the board and your settings in Mach then it would be possible to identify the problem.
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/Sb349ab22...=800&hash=1600
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/S91daad2a...1000&hash=2000

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vlod

You have to watch this type of boards closely. They might have same pin number on different ports. They might have positive or negative output and if you supply more than 5 Volts to the board (like you said 24V) they might require resistors between the board and stepper drivers. In additional- some of these boards have open collector outputs without power .
I think your board needs separate 5Volts for the drivers and 12-24 Volts for PWM
Usually it would be in description but sometimes they send the board with generic descriptions for several different boards and you have to figure out which one to use. Or hey send you the wrong one… It happens. But in general it comes with config file for Mach3 . You run it and puts pins and ports in a right order. You still have to check all and do motor tuning.
If you post a detailed diagram how you’ve connected the board and your settings in Mach then it would be possible to identify the problem.
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/Sb349ab22...=800&hash=1600
https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/S91daad2a...1000&hash=2000

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This has really helped, Thanks. I've now got the board working to some extent.
I can jog the X axis in both directions fine and it responds how I'd expect. Unfortunately I'm not getting any response on the Z axis and the Y axis drives in the same direction whichever way I jog it using the keyboard. I'm using the same drivers as with my old controller board so I don't think there's a problem at that end, but I can't see any settings in MAch3 that might affect either of these problems.

The changes you suggested that made the difference were that I didn't have a separate 5V supply to the board, and also I found and used the config file (previously I was only using the plugin DLL).

I'll create a diagram of the wiring shortly

Diagram attached.
Is this sufficient detail.or is more detail of each connection at the pin/connector level required?

The driver for the Z-axis is a newer model. https://uk.robotshop.com/products/tb...r-motor-driver. It is wired in a common Anode config.

Other attached images show the settings within Mach3, as best I know where to check. The Ports and Pins is as the config file configured things automatically and aligns with the "instructions" provided.

Thanks for any additional guidance.

John

What language are you using? It looks like something mismatched….Any way, If you managed to make X axis work then we assume you connected all of them correct…
motors pins assignment doesn’t make any sense but they programmed it that way and there is nothing you can do about it… just follow there directions.
There is a System Hot keys assignment in Mach3 where you define axis and directions.
And don’t forget to save your configuration every time you make any changes.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/06...f?v=1618010744

You probably have poor kit - aka a poor board.
(and drivers, support, realtime stuff in probing, homing, everything).

It´s more complicated than one would think, and usb stuff is usually a bad idea.

Get a new board with ethernet connectivity.
Yes - it´s much more expensive.
Yes - it´s really worth it.

Pokeys is good and cheap.
Cslabs is the best and expensive.

Yes, it’s nice to have better boards, drivers, motors and rails. Not many of us have that much money… In a long run it totally worth it if you serious.
However, if someone just started to play around then why not. I would buy a card with parallel port connection and old PC with Windows XP it would be more reliable than USB and easy to configure.

Hi,

Quote:

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Pokeys is good and cheap.
Cslabs is the best and expensive.

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CSLabs is good for mach3 but still sub-par for Mach4....and really is not worth the money.

The Ethernet SmoothStepper by Warp9TD, $190USD is better value for money and works equally well with Mach3 and Mach4.

Craig

I don’t think we are helping by offering different boards… one still has to configure the settings…
I would start from the beginning: check the board name and mach with the USB driver, there is something fishy there…
Then install config file for your Mach3 it should automatically enter most of the settings as pins and ports, then tune the motors.
If this doesn’t work I would buy another board…

Hi,

Quote:

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I don’t think we are helping by offering different boards… one still has to configure the settings…

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Except that if OP had bought one of these boards, all of which are manufacturer supported, OPs questions would have been answered in hours....and here we are
days later still trying to get this board to run properly.

Quote:

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"RnRMotion.dll" to be installed, but the images show "BL-USBMach.dll".

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The reason is that they are the same board. This board was designed some years ago by whom knows who, and the .dll was written at the same time. Since then any number
of manufacturers have made the board....but they have absolutely no idea how it works or the how the .dll works....they just keep churning them out...and hapless would be CNCers buy them
only to never get them to go.

Craig

Thanks for all of the replies!

At this point I feel like l'm being pretty stubborn about trying to get the board to work. That set of instructions you sent through Vlod is way more detailed than the one I have and so I'm going to give it a last go, starting afresh with a clean install, following those directions closely. Then if it doesn't work I'll have to bite the bullet and buy a different board. this Pokeys one looks to be within my budget, seems to be recommended by you guys and comes with a level of support!: https://uk.robotshop.com/products/et...IaAi-5EALw_wcB.

I'm away with work now for a week unfortunately so I won't get a chance to try this for a while, but will post again once I have!

Appreciate the help.

Thanks,
John

Quote:

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Originally Posted by joeavaerage

Hi,
CSLabs is good for mach3 but still sub-par for Mach4....and really is not worth the money.

The Ethernet SmoothStepper by Warp9TD, $190USD is better value for money and works equally well with Mach3 and Mach4.

Craig

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? Really ?
The SS I had long ago was not good, had electrical issues, the support was never there, the setup screen was not correct, endless stuff.

The Cslabs stuff is very expensive -- but it´s also very good.
Had it on my lathe for maybe 7 years, and now on my new built big vmc.

Since brian of mach4 did not honour the old commitments, I even paid for mach4, 10+ years ago, before beta, I will probably move to cslabs sw.
There was a 100$ license fee for mach4 for all old users of mach3, (all machines) that I paid, a long time ago.
On asking, I was told they have no recollection ..
and no license for me.
As "hanermo" I was a mach2 user and commenter since about 2003 on the yahoo forum.
Bummer.

I don´t care about the money, I care about the sw and support and easy customisation.

Hi Hanermo,
CSLabs were very good, and still are as far as quality goes, to my knowledge. Their support for customers and their responsiveness
to bugs in the Mach3 plugin were legendary.

Then something changed, I think probably personnel and they went 'right off the boil'. About the same time they started to write their own CNC software and their
commitment to either Mach3 or Mach4 was just not there.

In recent times they have released one update to their Mach4 plugin in two years. Totally unacceptable for the money they want.

CSLabs may be good for their own software and has a good legacy plugin for Mach3 but is very sub-par for Mach4 and they don't support their customers like they used to.

Mach4 is a new product. Mach4Hobby costs $200USD and Mach4Industrial cost $1400USD. There is no upgrade path from Mach3 and to my knowledge never has been.

Warp9TD are the manufacturer of the Ethernet SmoothStepper and that follows an earlier USB connected SmoothStepper, now obsolete. The ESS is $190USD.
Warp9TD maintain their own forum for support and Andy, the tech, has been supporting customers for at least eight years, ever since I bought my ESS anyway.
He is active five days a week, and excepting the occasional holiday break has been for years. He regularly remote connects to a customers PC to diagnose and repair set-up faults.

I have been using Mach4 for eight years and it's steadily advanced and been developed and is now light years ahead of Mach3 in my opinion.

https://www.machsupport.com/forum/in...8176#msg278176

Craig

Hi BandyPins,
the Pokeys 57E you linked to is not the best choice for a CNC motion controller.

The correct model for you is the PoKeys 57CNC. It has at its heart the identical 57E, that is the same processor etc, but the CNC version has extra features required to make it suitable for
CNC use.

https://www.poscope.com/product/pokeys57cnc/

If you do end up having to buy a new motion control board, and I'm sorry to say I think the RnR board is a dog, then get the right one! Do not try to save pennies only to find you have another board
that does not work or work well.

Craig

Thanks for the advice everyone. If I do end up changing the board - is there a recommendation for an all-in-one solution that is reasonably priced and doesn't require connecting to a PC / Laptop? I had a brief google around using a raspberry PI for something similar but it didn't seem like something people do very much and it probably requires quite a bit of time investment to figure out how to get that going.