Dyna 4000 and 2800- need help

Hi,

I have two machines here- I run a lab where we machine hard ceramics. They have been fitted with liquid cooled high speed spindles (54k rpm). The DM4000 uses the original programming language (SKIP??). The 2800 had been refurbed in 2000 by Dyna and uses their 4M machine control.

The DM4000 has been acting up where the machine will get "stuck in Y axis" when doing lower speed feeding and doing circles. Most of our machining is low speed feed. Say 10mm/sec down to 3mm/sec. Our maint. guy and I have been tearing into the machine and found other issues, like counter weight chains that were stretched to the point of breaking, rotted and broken oil lube line under the Y-axis ball screw cover, and some other things. We haven't been able to fix the "stuck in Y-axis" problem... I'm sure the lack of lubrication because of the broken oil line didn't help. It was probably run 5+ years like that. It has well over 100,000 hours of machine time on the clock.

Is it worth fixing? We were thinking of replacing the stepper motors and possibly the ball screws (tolerance has gotten loose) or maybe even retrofitting the whole thing. The ways are in good shape. Where can I get new steppers (name and model) and screws? Also, does anyone have a clue to the Y axis stuck problem? Is there a company (or individual) that will service these machines? Thanks for any input!

Check whit Dyna if they can help you:

http://www.dynamechtronics.com/

Roberto? He was no help. They generally won't even touch these machines- or least that's what they told us.

I am not familiar with the 4000 but it all could be retroed I am sure. Keling would have any and all the steppers and electronics. This would be a 1 off and as I am finding the info from Dyna is wrong. I have had and read information supposedly about my machines specs that are totally wrong. There are parts no one at Dyna has a clue as to why they are on my machine. They are original. I really think the people at Dyna are just servicing the machines they have a little stock on. Most of if not all of the present employees (I think there are only 3 people) have never seen many of these machines as they were made in the 80's and early 90's. Roberto is helpful when he can be. Would love to see pics of the 4000 if you got them. There are a few people here who have modified/retroed/rebuilt all sorts of Dyna's stuff.

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Originally Posted by Fastest1

I am not familiar with the 4000 but it all could be retroed I am sure. Keling would have any and all the steppers and electronics. This would be a 1 off and as I am finding the info from Dyna is wrong. I have had and read information supposedly about my machines specs that are totally wrong. There are parts no one at Dyna has a clue as to why they are on my machine. They are original. I really think the people at Dyna are just servicing the machines they have a little stock on. Most of if not all of the present employees (I think there are only 3 people) have never seen many of these machines as they were made in the 80's and early 90's. Roberto is helpful when he can be. Would love to see pics of the 4000 if you got them. There are a few people here who have modified/retroed/rebuilt all sorts of Dyna's stuff.

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We're finding out the same thing. I know our 4000 is an early machine. The stepper motors are PMI "synchrostep" a division of Kollmorgen, the controller is model a 40M. They are very robust, but unsupported and weak on the electronics end. I fear that if we can get a screw replacement, the machine is a goner. The accuracy we need just isn't there anymore.

I have one pic on hand of our high speed set up.

The ball screw should be available, just not readily from Dyna. You may need to get measurements from the one in the machine and call around. There are companies that rebuild ball screws as well.

I would think with just a little bit of research , a little time on the lathe turning down the end for a coupler. Should be pretty easy. Then of course all of the projects in my garage look easy too!:rolleyes:

Any ideas as to the places I could contact for a screw? I'm really not familiar with the machining world....Thx.

I have the screws out of one of my DM4400's. Let me know which dimensions you need and I'll post them.

Timothy

If you are needing your ball screws to be repaired, contact -
Ball screws can be repaired, when they are repairable, otherwise they can be replaced.

Precision Spindle & Accessories Inc.

www.precisionspindleinc.com tel. 519 671 3911
[email protected] fax. 519 652 5994

Well, we torn apart the DM4000. What a mess. Basically, the ball screws are worn out, the PTFE/bronze way slide material is almost non-existent, and the support bearings for the screws were toast.

SO, I just set up our refurbed (from DYNA) DM2800 mill to fill our needs. It has the PC3(?) or 4M control software, version 2.21 (1999). It has never been used before, just sat in storage. I managed to turn on the machine and run a test program successfully. It's 10x more quiet than the DM4000's stepper motors!

My next question is: Since I have all of my programs written in SKIP (000-999) code, is there a way to run those with the 4m software? I'd hate to go through all my popular programs and rewrite them in G code especially since I don't really know G code all that well. I also, will the old style height probe work with this software? Since I use very small tools (20 mils) I need to use a very delicate probe switch.

Thanks!

The 4M control has a user parameter for running G/M codes or the older SKIP conversational code. To be honest, I have no idea if that actually works. I'd proof run the programs in air to be safe.

If memory serves (which it often doesn't), the touch probe is the same but Dyna changed the wiring slightly. I cannot recall but I think the old probe is a normally open switch and the "new" wiring is set up for normally closed. Or the other way around. Or I'm completely off again.

I found the user parameter! It's similar to the old language, but not completely the same. Writing the program on the machine PC is kind of easy anyway.

As for the probe, that means I need a new one. Nuts!

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Originally Posted by Caprirs

The 4M control has a user parameter for running G/M codes or the older SKIP conversational code. To be honest, I have no idea if that actually works. I'd proof run the programs in air to be safe.

If memory serves (which it often doesn't), the touch probe is the same but Dyna changed the wiring slightly. I cannot recall but I think the old probe is a normally open switch and the "new" wiring is set up for normally closed. Or the other way around. Or I'm completely off again.

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My BobCad has a post processor that outputs the code (conversational for my Dyna) now getting it into the machine that is a different story.

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Originally Posted by jth877

As for the probe, that means I need a new one. Nuts!

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Not necessarily. You may be able to just swap some wires on the probe or the machine.

Might have one that was sent with the machine after refurb. It has a red LED that lights up when the back is in contact with the bed. None of my DM4000 probes do that. They look identical.

Dyna said they would make my old probes work for $100/ea. If it's as simple as swapping wires, I'll compare my old with the ones that work and see if I can tell what they did.

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Originally Posted by Caprirs

Not necessarily. You may be able to just swap some wires on the probe or the machine.

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Originally Posted by Fastest1

My BobCad has a post processor that outputs the code (conversational for my Dyna) now getting it into the machine that is a different story.

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We actually bought BobCad a few years ago thinking it could spit out a G-code and we could then transfer the file to the 2800 PC and run it. We are going try that next week when the guy the software is licensed to returns from vac.

The post processor for the Dyna DM2400 outputs conversational. The 1 I use anyway. G code is for my Mach machines.

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Originally Posted by Fastest1

My BobCad has a post processor that outputs the code (conversational for my Dyna) now getting it into the machine that is a different story.

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Did youbhave any success with loading your code to the 2800?
I'm thinking about getting one with the 4m controller and wanted to know if I used Master cam to program would I be able to load onto the Dyna?