Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I totally misinterpreted the drawing. I really need to take a class on fundamentals of this stuff.
I recently installed a C10 BOB as I needed additional inputs for encoder and some proximity sensors. Perhaps using the outputs on that would be more productive than fighting the MX3660. Or perhaps I just should buy the other solenoids?
I may try wiring as per Maxspongebob’s drawing earlier in the thread. If I could at least get a consistent state on the relay that would be nice. Eventually I will be adding a few pneumatic actuators as well. Getting a drawbar or tool changer stuck in flux would probably be a bad time.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Here’s a video.
Note how the LED’s lit dimly despite being in an off state on the controller, then when the pin is activated they turn on fully. Also, sorry for the shaky video, I was recording and trying to touch my touchscreen on the controller.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FSOAfS...ature=youtu.be
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Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I have had a look at the video and see the LEDs are dimm when they should be off
Attachment 427110
whats the voltage between the SSR board input and common ground when it should be off ?
it could be either the MX3660 output is leaky
or possibly a earth loop is causing currents to flow along the SSR ground wire
and the resulting volt drop is just enough to switch on the LEDs to just start to light
do the solid state relays switch on ?
looking for information for the SSR board I found this -
Input control signal voltage:
0V - 0.5V Low stage (SSR is OFF),
0.5V - 2.5V (unknown state).
2.5V - 20V High state (SSR is ON).
John
1 Attachment(s)
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
if you have connected the MX3660 output between the +5V supply and the SSR input like this
Attachment 427118
try adding a 1K5 resistor between the relay boards ground and input
then measure the voltage across the resistor both when the relay is on and when its off
the voltage across the added 1K5 resistor will indicate the resistance of resistor shown in the MX3660 manual
if it is 1K as shown in the manual
when switched on
the voltage across the added 1K5 resistor will be about 3V ( depending on the loss acros the opto-isolators transistor )
John
PS
without adding the 1K5 resistor between the SSR board input and GND
the transistor relay driver could sensitive enough to be picking up stray signals that cause the dim light from the LED indicator
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
The SSR switches on/off, though sometimes gets caught in the unknown state, meaning the LED light in this video sort of flickers unpleasantly. I tried to catch it in the unknown state, of course it doesn't do it when the camera is on.
In the video I'm toggling Flood in mach3.
https://youtu.be/sjDd0g25Hrc
From the first video, note that output 3- on the MX3660 is connected to input 2 on the relay board (output 3+ is not connect to 5v+, only Output 3- is connected to input 2, this is visible at the end of the first video). The input 2 LED is lighting on the relay board despite the Output 3 pins being turned off in Mach3.
I haven't had time yet this evening to try the resistor between the ground and the input. My wife is ill, but once i get my 3 year old to bed I'll try to get out there.
I doubt a ground loop is an issue, I don't have any steppers or accessories connected as I am bench testing, also, my system was dead reliable before. I've added this SSR board, and the additional BOB (nothing is connected to it). But changes being changes, I suppose it's possible.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I get 0V (off) and 5V (on) across the 1k5 resistor. This solves the dimly lit LED issue when off.
The multiple output issue is persistent.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Good a small step forward - the 1K resistor shown in the manual must be a link or a low resistance
Most importantly you have to look after your self so your able look after your family
next questions
how have you configured the C10 jumpers ?
how have you connected the C10 BOB to the MX3660 ?
there must be a conflict between the C10 and MX3660
the C10 BOB is unusual in using pin 18 to detect the printer cable is connected
PS
ignore the second question I was thinking of the MX4660's second port
you can still try disconnecting the C10 to see if every thing works when you go back to the original set up
PPS
are you using 2 PC parallel printer ports , a motion controller such as warp 9 's Ethernet Smooth Stepper that emulaters 3 printerports or a uc300eth ?
John
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
The C10 is connected to the UC300eth-5lpt.
The behavior of the MX3660 outputs are consistent with the C10 removed or plugged in.
I have not even attempted to configure the C10 jumpers, I've been preoccupied with these MX3660 outputs. I'd like to be able to control a few items before I start worrying about the additional inputs that I needed the C10 for.
3 Attachment(s)
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I don't have an answer to all of the problems but
I have had a closer look at the SSR board and the G3MB Solid State Relay used on the board
and noticed there is not a "snubber " fitted across the SSR
a simple RC snubber is just a resistor connected in series with a capacitor
that is connected across the SSR's triac
Attachment 427182
others have a MOV added like this
ssr snubber network with a 220R resistor , 0.1uF capacitor and a MOV (metal-oxide varistor )
to clamp excessive transient voltages MOVs go form high resistance to low resistance
Attachment 427194
the SSR may not work correctly with some LED lights depending on the ballast used
or inductive loads
John
PS
this youtube video shows whats inside an ebay 25A Solid State Relay
that has snubber built in
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxEhxjvifyY
the circuit diagram is at 4:37
PPS
another snubber from amazon (very like the one from ebay found earlier )
Attachment 427200
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...26M8PYNT1YRNT7
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I think the hand writing is on the wall here. I need to buy the Fotek units. Continuing to mess with this relay board simply doesn't make any sense.
I certainly appreciate everybody's contribution here. It's been a real learning experience.
Once I get the new units and some time to tinker I'll update this thread.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I got the Fotek units connected up. I ended up installing four of them, all running on 5v, all connected to the four outputs on the MX3660.
I can switch them all on and off, but they all have a bit of voltage when off. My LED light flickers a bit when the relay is off, my box fan runs very slowly when the relay is off, both items function as intended when the relay is on. I'm sure I need a a resister from something to something else. My brain isn't functioning too well. My wife has been in the hospital since Monday and I've been juggling work and our three year old and everything else. The half hour in the shop sure felt nice though. I might even manage a trip through the shower tonight.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Shower is good. I'm sure your wife will appreciate it.
The thing about some solid state relays is that they never turn off completely. They leak a bit, especially the cheap one's from China. You could increase the load current and thus reduce the off state voltage at the output.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
My wife hasn't showered since like Sunday, she's been too sick to get out of bed for the most part. I don't think she noticed my lack of hygiene. She's improving though, she could come home as early as this evening.
The LED light I used to test with is basically on when the relay is off, though it flickers. It's about exactly the same as it was with the relay board before we added the 1.5k resister.
When you say increase load current do you mean just attach something larger to the load on the relay? With pneumatic solenoids and my coolant pump I'm not sure that's an option, not unless I add a incandescent light bulb in there or something.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Came across this video, same guy that was posted earlier with the tear down on the Fotek unit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=tzWz_guJHvY
So yeah, I'll have to test with my pneumatic solenoids to see how they behave. I can plug my coolant pump in and see what it does while I'm at it.
Given the LED's are such low draw I can see how the leakage powers them, the box fan was a bit of surprise.
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Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Hope your wife will get better soon
Don't forget to look after your self , I know how hospital visits can take it out of you
The Fotek SSR in post 30 has a snubber made from a 10nF capacitor and a 47 ohm resistor in series
which I expect has solved some of the problems but passes enough current to cause the fans to run slowly and LED light flicker
depending on the current via the SSR's internal snubber and the threshold voltage the LED's light and the fan starts to turn
you may be able to fix the problem by adding a resistor as a load
( you have to find a resistance low enough to reduce the voltage across the load without dissipating too much power as heat )
or
connecting either a 47nF capacitor or another 470nF +100 ohm snubber across the fan or lamp supply terminals
example snubber
https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/rc-ne...itors/2067869/
to prove a snubber can work
connect a spare SSR across the lamp
by connecting terminals 1 & 2 across the lamp / fan
you effectively connect the spare SSR's snubber across the load
John
PS
Attachment 427798
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
Thanks!
The main thing is that I have four distinct and switchable relays now, which is a huge improvement. I'm close to being functional again should I get the leakage worked out.
Any guess on what quantity of resistance I would need to control the leakage should I attempt that?
I can test with the SSR as a shunt this evening as well.
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
whats you mains supply voltage ?
120 V AC as in NA
or
230V AC as in Europe ( in my part of the UK my supply is over 240V AC)
with a 240V supply you could try 68K ( 68000 ohms) 1 W
John
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
I’m in the US, so 110/120 AC.
Edit: fat fingers, lazy proofing
Re: MX3660 with SainSmart Relay
for a 120 V AC supply you can use a 15 K (15000 ohm ) 1W resistor to test
for long term use use a 2W resistor
120/15000 = 8 mA
120V x 8 mA = 0.96 W
for 140V supply use a 22 K resistor
140 / 22000 = 0.006 mA
140V x 0.006 mA = 0.89 W
use a 2W resistor
John