X2 Z axis options?

I took a chance on a used ground ballscrew complete with bearing blocks. Looks and feels really good, can't wait to see how it performs. The plan is to use it for the X2 Z.

Which of these 2 ideas looks more feasible. The first is the Syil approach as shown here. http://www.jeffalbro.net/cnc/syil-x2/syil-x2-03-800.jpg

The other is a side mounted approach as shown in the attachment. You'll have to imagine the screw ~1/2" further rearward and a heavy flat plate bolted to the ballnut to move the spindle.

The side mount is simpler to make but I suspect Syil went through the extra work for a good reason.

Hoss' setup is similar to the Syril setup except his is reduced by belt and pulleys. Im sure he will chime in later so he can tell you how it works. Im going to be using a similar setup to his on my X2

Hoss's design drives the nut directly and the screw is only supported at one end. It's very similar to this http://www.stirlingsteele.com/files/rightviewZaxis.jpg
The directness of this design is appealing.

I was considering copying Hoss but some of the suppliers he lists are difficult for Canadians to deal with.

Hoss--if you're reading this--

Have you given any thought to gathering up the pieces and selling them to DYI'ers ? Not just the Z bits but a few other of your designs also. If the customs bit is troubling I might have an offer for you.

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Originally Posted by cyclestart

I took a chance on a used ground ballscrew complete with bearing blocks. Looks and feels really good, can't wait to see how it performs. The plan is to use it for the X2 Z.

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Did yours come with the flange on the ballnut? If so, this is going to be much easier for you. I went with the Hoss/Stirling approach, but to me, the Syil actually looks easier. I chose the "center lift" over the "side lift" method because I was worried the "side lift" would bind.

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I was considering copying Hoss but some of the suppliers he lists are difficult for Canadians to deal with.

Hoss--if you're reading this--

Have you given any thought to gathering up the pieces and selling them to DYI'ers ? Not just the Z bits but a few other of your designs also. If the customs bit is troubling I might have an offer for you.

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What parts are you having trouble getting?
Send me a private message and we'll see what we can do.
I've helped a guy from Australia that needed bearings from Mscdirect and Ebay.
Not complete kits but parts he couldn't get shipped down under.
He shipped them to me, then I repacked them, filled out the customs stuff and forwarded them on(for a fee naturally).:)
Cost him more for shipping but at least he was able to get them.
Hoss

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Originally Posted by dleroi

Did yours come with the flange on the ballnut? If so, this is going to be much easier for you. I went with the Hoss/Stirling approach, but to me, the Syil actually looks easier. I chose the "center lift" over the "side lift" method because I was worried the "side lift" would bind.

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I agree with preferring a center lift over side lift. Not crazy with the Syil lifting from the rear for the same binding issues
but it seems better than a side lift.
Kdntools has a real nice design that lifts from the center in the front but doesn't give you the ballscrew coat rack like ours.
Would take a bit more work to fit the ballnut inside the head like theirs.
If I was doing it over again, I would do something similar but would mount the ballnut on the outside of the head
with the screw passing through.

In the land of Oz we have very limited suppliers and parts are much cheaper to import than buy local. I didn't think of using an import agent :) so worked around it with what I had available.

I fabricated an extended column and used double ballnuts. The screw runs down the centre of the column and there is a second ballnut under the one in the photos. It has been in use for quite a while and has performed well. Just something different for you to think about.

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Originally Posted by hoss2006

If I was doing it over again, I would do something similar but would mount the ballnut on the outside of the head with the screw passing through.

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Hah! That's exactly the idea that came to me while doodling during lunch break. The ballnut flange is 2.6" (2.2" where a flat is milled) but changing the spindle to belt drive might allow room on the topside. I'm going to experiment with the side mount first simply because it's quick to do. First sign of difficulties it's on to plan B.

As far as the parts, I'm making a list and checking it twice. You'll be left in peace til' after the holidays. Tacking on an extra charge is expected as you do a lot (maybe to much) for this community gratis.

dlerio
The flange is visible in the picture from side view. From a top view there are 5 holes .2" in diamter.

Rod
You posted while I was posting in slomo. Had to look twice to be sure it was really an X2 :)

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Originally Posted by cyclestart

dlerio
The flange is visible in the picture from side view. From a top view there are 5 holes .2" in diamter.

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I saw the flange in that picture, but I wasn't sure that the picture was of your hardware.

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Originally Posted by cyclestart

Rod
You posted while I was posting in slomo. Had to look twice to be sure it was really an X2 :)

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The head and column is an X2 but the rest is a hybrid or is that a kind way of saying mongrel. :)
I really wanted to have the ballscrew down the centre of the column to protect it from swarf and to get a cetral lift on the head. I had originally planned to do the Hoss design but getting afforable bearing is a problem over here. I'm sure there are other ways of doing it and I just threw this design in to feed your ideas.

Another option for the thrust bearing for the Z axis is automotive wheel bearings.
I was getting a pair for my truck (97 Dakota)and noticed how similar they are to the Mscdirect.com bearing.
I checked for different models and found a couple that had similar dimensions.
It really just needs to have an ID about 1 inch or so.
Then just match the mating parts to the bearing diameters.
I should have written the part# down but it was only $8.99.
Just looked up a 2000 CHEVROLET S10 PICKUP rear wheel bearing at Partsamerica.com for example.
It's dimensions are
BORE= 1.4016 in.; OD.= 2.2520 in.; WIDTH= .6980 in. for $8.98.
Could be made to work.
The more common the vehicle the cheaper the parts should be.
Just another option. Check your local Napa or PepBoys.
Hoss

P.S. Found this 2000 FORD F-250 SUPER DUTY PICKUP tapered roller front wheel bearing that would be better and it's only $6.24

FWIW - I did my X2 like the Syil. 1/2" plates bolted to the sides of the head, extending behind the column, where I used an X3 leadcsrew, nut and nut mount (*very* nice quality parts for *very* cheap). I cut the nut in half, and made it screw-adjustable, for near-zero backlash. I have a 2.5:1 toothed belt reducer, and a 270 oz-in motor. Works just about perfectly, and was very easy to do. I much prefer this arrangement to mounting the screw next to the column, where it will be exposed to chips, etc. With the weight of the head, I'm not convinced a ballscrew is needed here. On mine, I completely removed the spring arm, and just lift the head directly with the motor, and it works just great.

Regards,
Ray L.

Hi All, This noob here is also leening toward Hoss' Z-axis for his to be done CNC of X2. Hoss, if you are still tuned in, I have a Question. Your parts list shows a 2 1/2 inch D X 2 inch steel rod for the Z-Axix mount. How much of the 2-inch length is actually used. Is 2 inches long to provide for chaching in the lathe head.

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Originally Posted by whoafat

Hi All, This noob here is also leening toward Hoss' Z-axis for his to be done CNC of X2. Hoss, if you are still tuned in, I have a Question. Your parts list shows a 2 1/2 inch D X 2 inch steel rod for the Z-Axix mount. How much of the 2-inch length is actually used. Is 2 inches long to provide for chaching in the lathe head.

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The 2 in length is to give enough stock to make both the upper and lower flanges.
The upper is 1.485 long and the lower is actually 2.0 in dia. x .250.
Hoss

Thanks for taking the time to reply,
Wilfred

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Originally Posted by HimyKabibble

With the weight of the head, I'm not convinced a ballscrew is needed here. On mine, I completely removed the spring arm, and just lift the head directly with the motor, and it works just great.

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If you have seen S_J_H's X3, he is also using an ACME for the Z. Given the quality of his builds this is a working solution without any doubt. The problem is I'm developing an addiction. More speed, More Speed, MORE SPEED! Logic has nothing to do with it. ;)