Help for the future, can I return to a better place.

Hi all, right I am after a bit of advice, I have the opportunity to leave my current employer with a redundancy offer, for the last 30 years I have worked my way up from a network installation engineer to a network design engineer within the data/tv/telecoms industry. Been here for 30 yrs but at 51 and having always said I left real engineering but real engineering has never left me I am looking to see if I can spend the last 16yrs of my working life back in a job I loved and had a passion for.
Before I joined my current employer I work for a great company called Morfax ( sadly closed down years ago ) this company was involved with making the required components for the aerospace industry, the MOD and Formula one teams, we used to provide work jigs, programming and part proving for British Aerospace along side our own production runs of various MOD related products.
For example I was involved with making parts for the GR5 Harrier jump jet, Exocet missiles, Goal Keeper anti missile ship defence systems and my main project I worked on was the Wheelbarrow which is a remotely controlled robot designed for bomb disposal, as seen on TV when checking over IRA bombs.
My training consisted of a year at the EITB (Engineering Industry Training board) centre in Purley south London, where we learnt broad based skills in all aspects of machining and mechanical skills along with day release to Carshalton College to study City & Guilds in Mechanical Engineering Craft studies. After that year was completed I then did my time on the shop floor learning the required skills in Manual milling, CNC milling/operating/data input, I continued on day release to college to pass my City & Guilds and also pass the EITB certificate of engineering craftmanship which I guess all adds up to a good old fashioned apprenticeship. Most of my work was carried out on ( what is now so basic it is scary ) a Bridgeport VMC CNC and also a manual Bridgeport.
I have always watched from a distance as the world of engineering has changed from punched paper tape and manual ISO code input from drawings made by humans on paper to todays industry where CAD CAM runs the new world of machining and thought DOH! why did I leave, so now I am thinking can I find a way back in which is where ( if you are not asleep yet ) you can help me.
So far at home I have purchased a desktop cnc, purchased some good books, loaded fusion 360, loaded CNC emulator Sinutrain for Siemens, SSCNC and good old CNC simulator pro all of which will keep me busy in the evenings. I also intend to pay for some training with a company like AMRC or CNC solutions etc to get hands on experience again.
Do you think this old engineer has a way back into the industry and have any tips on how to achieve my goal or do you think get back in your box old man and let the youth build an app to take your place.

If I read your post correctly you are in the ITC industry but have a former life as a physical Engineer (making stuff and what-not and want back in) - right?

First I'd say, have a job to go to before becoming unemployed. Even if you reckon you should take a "holiday break".

After 40+ years in the electronics and ICT industry and not as young as I was when I started, I too became redundant (another story for sure) and have found that today, regardless of my history and exposure to all things ICT including the "birth" and "aging" of those such as Microsoft, Apple and even Cisco, nobody cares. Companies today seem more (or only) interested in taking on half dozen (high-flight risk) University folks and training them (with tax breaks and refunds) to keep maybe one or two and repeating the process. At more than 60, seems I'm too old for ICT employment anymore even though I know how it all works from electrons and magnetic flux induction to pixel! Even today magnetic storage has or is rapidly becoming redundant and slower, like me!

As far as machining re-careering goes, can't say I've been in that directly but I'm guessing unless you have contacts in those areas, similar conditions might exist if HR departments are involved and filled with younger folks. I'd guess with modern machining technologies and so-forth hiring departments would use similar selection criteria as per the above. An exception might be an experienced "oldie" looking for Employees who appreciates another "oldie" and recognises what amazing knowledge, skills, flexibility and abilities are embedded in us "oldies" :-)

Personally, I've now had enough of ICT and am currently in a home based start-up using CNC to "make stuff" - to provide a new and different but interesting future and make a few $ to maintain the "bad habits" :-)

Best of luck with whatever you decide fits your needs!

Cheers,

LOL....oh boy, do I relate to this scenario.....I got retrenched at 60 after 40 years in the engineering business, and to last out the last few years before official retirement I had to apply for work to get social support money, but as I was considered a long past it's use date dinosaur, even basic machine working was now beyond me.....apart from getting a part time mornings only job as a welder and turner, I didn't qualify as a desirable asset to any company I applied for.

The main problem for golden oldies is that the World passes you by when you get stuck in one job for an eternity that does not progress your skills and keep you up to date with current work practices, be it on a machine pushing handles/buttons etc, or in an office doing high end data entry or CAD designing...….the current influx of new blood with up to date ideas, even without experience, is what the World has evolved to.

At 51 you "might" make a transition to your soon to be Modern Real World, it just depends if you know people or happen to be in the right place at the right time and you're just what they're lookin for..…….but don't hold your breath...….most people go forward in their juvenile years with a firm and learn their ways and can't adjust to other work practices once the edge of their expertise has worn down as the years pass.

A lot depends on your commitments to living....that is, money in the bank Frank…….or if you have financial commitments that still need to be regularly serviced, you will be pushing sh!t uphill with a sharp stick most of the time...…..but if you don't have those problems and are reasonably funded.....house paid off, car paid off and working still, no ex wife problems or girl/boy friends etc. then you "could" take a new approach to what is on the table and perhaps retrain to function once more.

Going dead cold into a DIY home based business, making parts for pennies with oldy machinery at home, is a dead end exercise with practically no hope for financial affluence unless you have inventory skills and the ability to make prototypes cheaply......maybe for other people too...…...that could be a penny earner as many people have brilliant ideas but no skill or expertise to achieve them.

Best of luck, I made it in one piece, and am 81 now so I must have done something right.

BTW...... in the mid 70's I worked for a small firm in Bristol, before emigrating to OZ to seek my fortune, making parts for Nato planes etc....I made parts for Concord too and many of the jet engines that commercial and defence aircraft used.
Ian.

At 51 you should be able to get a job with your history without any problems in fact it is a good age to be looking for a new job, take the redundancy offer, ( you probably don't have a choice ) you may not get another chance to get the redundancy offer again

Why is the company offering you redundancy???

Don't spend the redundancy if you take it, make safe secure investments with in your bank with it

Get another job right away doing anything that you are comfortable with until you fine what you want to do until retirement

Mac, I wouldn't be too sure on that age score...…..at 50 you are either too old to start again, especially if you're yesterday's news, or too young to retire and do anything you want to do if you can afford it.

UK is heading for the Brexit thing so there might be a significant change in the manufacturing sector, that means there might be a glut of over qualified workforce applicants if/when the manufacturers down size to be more flexible, who will be glad to just get a passable wage for whatever they can get.

I would definitely take the money and run ……..then get into top gear with all the options you can handle.....securing your outgoing commitments would have to be a first priority.
Ian.

Agree with Ian, take the money and stroll away as a winner.

I "survived/"declined"" several redundancies with each "package" much worse than the previous and figured the next one may be even worse or an alternate to be offered relocation. Not wanting to re-locate, it could have boiled down to having refused a viable Company offer and end up for me getting nothing but the boot. No thanks!

Have much enjoyed my "2 year holiday/sabattical break" I reckon I should have had and did take with absolutely no regrets there but the loss of your income quickly gives you the "wet fish in the face" reality of just how expensive day-to-day living has become these days.

I don't reckon anyone past about 40-45 is considered "young" by a 20 something HR person.

Cheers,

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Originally Posted by he1957

Agree with Ian, take the money and stroll away as a winner.

I "survived/"declined"" several redundancies with each "package" much worse than the previous and figured the next one may be even worse or an alternate to be offered relocation. Not wanting to re-locate, it could have boiled down to having refused a viable Company offer and end up for me getting nothing but the boot. No thanks!

Have much enjoyed my "2 year holiday/sabattical break" I reckon I should have had and did take with absolutely no regrets there but the loss of your income quickly gives you the "wet fish in the face" reality of just how expensive day-to-day living has become these days.

I don't reckon anyone past about 40-45 is considered "young" by a 20 something HR person.

Cheers,

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If you have a good education and job /people skills and are prepared to work the jobs are there no matter what age you are, age has nothing to do with the hiring process, experience and education counts not age

You been in UK lately Mac?.....there's a storm brewing and that ain't good for the job market especially if you're on the look for one with high prospects......sometimes you just gotta take what's offered.

Personally I would take whatever money is offered.....a bird in the hand etc.....and then put out the resumes like there's no tomorrow.

One of the big problems with "settled" people is they aren't prepared to move away from their immediate neighbourhood.....that is one big drawback on the widening circle of job opportunities...…..some people won't even relocate to another country, that is how deep rooted the home familiarity can get and the older you get the less chance you have to get a job and a new home at the right price...…..it's almost like dragging a wisdom tooth out with a piece of wire round a doorknob.

The biggest problem is staying in one job too long....five years was my longest until I moved to OZ...... job loyalty was to my immediate employer as long as he/they paid better than the next place, then it was 17 years on an upwards spiral and out to lunch with a packet.....never looked back.
Ian.

"If you have a good education and job /people skills and are prepared to work the jobs are there no matter what age you are, age has nothing to do with the hiring process, experience and education counts not age"

Nice theory :-)

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Originally Posted by he1957

"If you have a good education and job /people skills and are prepared to work the jobs are there no matter what age you are, age has nothing to do with the hiring process, experience and education counts not age"

Nice theory :-)

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No theory about it that's the way it works, I have employee's and that is how we hire people, willing to work have a good skill set and education, works every time I have hired workers that are over 70 years old's

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Originally Posted by mactec54

No theory about it that's the way it works, I have employee's and that is how we hire people, willing to work have a good skill set and education, works every time I have hired workers that are over 70 years old's

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Here in OZ that's most definitely not the standard!

Now that we have gov subsidised slave labour with the "Internship Program" the situations only gotten much, much worse.

Most employers are happy to hire a barrel of monkeys, pay a pittance, take the grants, and then rotate every 6-12 months.

Bit hard to compete when it's a race to the bottom!

Sigh...so true...….fings ain't what they used to be...….I would not hesitate to say that anything that is related to electricity from sustainable renewable sources has to be the job pool of the future.

If you cater for the high roller industries like electric cars, domestic power requirements and anything that relates to making clean energy, you surely must have a job that will grow for your foreseeable future.....it just ain't going to go away...…..somebody has to clean all those solar panels, so straight away there is one job waiting to be done, not necessarily with a mop and bucket approach, but with a brain wave moment you could do it with a clever idea.

I fully expect the spread of EV recharge stations, soon to be on a mass scale, will generate a whole service industry that will grow like bamboo in a warm wet climate......anticipating a trend for the future and being at the forefront is the way Bill Gates et al made their pennies., but you have to have the courage to bite the bullet and make a right angle turn in your life path if you want to be there.

Philosophy, maybe, but awesomely true in it's context.

BTW, when is too old to start again a hurdle?....if you draw a line in the sand, then this is the beginning of the rest of your life.....in 20 years time you will look back to this moment and think how you would have done it differently if you had the chance all over again.....don't lose the plot......time to think with your head not your heart.
Ian.

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Originally Posted by aarggh

Here in OZ that's most definitely not the standard!

Now that we have gov subsidised slave labour with the "Internship Program" the situations only gotten much, much worse.

Most employers are happy to hire a barrel of monkeys, pay a pittance, take the grants, and then rotate every 6-12 months.

Bit hard to compete when it's a race to the bottom!

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To push buttons you only need a robot monkeys are not needed

The internship program is a payed for not only by gov, but the student also, they still need a qualified teacher or guide, if you are educated in one of the many fields then you can be that teacher, education is key in this case and willing to work

All Programs — Australian Internships

https://internships-australia.com/

I don't think Mac has grasped the fact that once you are a matured worker and set in your ways with old school technology, and especially if you are in a rarified work environment, you will find that jobs as you know it are for those that have climbed the pile and got to where they are, but to change horses mid stream and get to another pile and near the same top.....you are looking for gold under a haystack in the dark...….at best you will have to take what's offered...…..like it or lump it.....that is the fact of life these days.

As I said, you must be flexible, not only in your ability, but in your mind too......people employers are the judge of what they think you are worth to them...…….at the same time you must be confident on your ability to perform.....don't take second best...…..if you have the time, use it to browse the offers.....the winds of change are going to be blowing with Brexit.

Best of British.
Ian.

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Originally Posted by handlewanker

I don't think Mac has grasped the fact that once you are a matured worker and set in your ways with old school technology, and especially if you are in a rarified work environment, you will find that jobs as you know it are for those that have climbed the pile and got to where they are, but to change horses mid stream and get to another pile and near the same top.....you are looking for gold under a haystack in the dark...….at best you will have to take what's offered...…..like it or lump it.....that is the fact of life these days.

As I said, you must be flexible, not only in your ability, but in your mind too......people employers are the judge of what they think you are worth to them...…….at the same time you must be confident on your ability to perform.....don't take second best...…..if you have the time, use it to browse the offers.....the winds of change are going to be blowing with Brexit.

Best of British.
Ian.

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That is where the education part comes in, if you are an old mature worker that has not kept up with technology then you are a lost case, and not employable, it's called the want to work, you can not get complacent in the work place or yes you will be left behind and not have a job

The Op is only 51 and educated in more than one area if you can't get a job it is his own doing

Mac, what you say is perfectly right in one context...……..supposing you are highly placed in an organisation and perform as required to the best of your ability..... that is, as far as it needs to perform within that organisation.....being over qualified in any field is a recipe for time wasting getting there.....you do need to live as opposed to being a continuous study student...... and frustration at not getting ahead with that extra knowledge you have gained and may never need while you are employed in that organisation.

It's a prime case of too many chiefs and not enough Indians scenario......have you heard of the expression, "The higher the top, the longer the drop"....nothing is forever.

We will never know the true extent of the situation as it's a private thing, and with a job market as fluid as it is, job satisfaction and reliability are poles apart when it comes to sourcing another job that may mean relocating to areas not of your choice.

People are by nature creatures of fixed habits and relocating is something not to be relished unless it is something you plan on anyway....apparently not in this case as it's a situation that will eventuate anyway like it or not.

I'd love to hear the outcome of this, but I don't think we'll hear more as it's a hypothetical on the cards happening not a dead certainty.
Ian.