[ksanalytical]

I looked for a better place to put this with no luck so here it lands simply because I know there are IH owners with Glacern vises.

Has anyone noticed that Shars.com has started selling eerily similar vises to Glacern? I wasn't naive enough to think Glacerns products were American, but I'm surprised they aren't exclusive.

Does anyone have any thoughts on quality based on experience with Shars (I've purchased from Maritool instead based on "perceived" quality). Their prices are certainly a step below Glacern.

http://www.shars.com/products/gallery/8140/

vs.

http://www.glacern.com/gpv_615

Ken

P.S. Anyone else notice also that the Glacern "March Madness Sale" ended just in time for the "Tax Burned Reversal Sale" to begin with even lower prices?

[mactec54]

Hi ksanalytical

You got it Shars is the same vice & at a better price, there tooling is also better than Martitool, I brought a lot of Martitool tooling, because he tells lies he won't get anymore of my business, he told me all of his tooling is made in the USA, it is not, all of his toolholders come from China, & is not as good a quality as the tooling that Shars is selling, Shars are also selling Kurt vices

[Davenco]

Hi mactec54,
I was actually also interested in buying a vise. I cannot decide between buying a glacern vise and a shars vise. Are the two really the same vise? Have you bought both vises and seen no difference?

[TClarke]

Hi mactec54,
I was actually also interested in buying a vise. I cannot decide between buying a glacern vise and a shars vise. Are the two really the same vise? Have you bought both vises and seen no difference?

As of last week, I've seen both in the flesh, as a close friend of mine who often buys vises by the pallet load has both, and they're not the same. They probably look alike because they're both kurt clones, but the glacern has noticeably better build quality. I will see if I can get snap some photos if he hasn't sent the shars vise back already.

Take a look at the attached photo... looks like they glued on a cardboard label and it's coming undone. The pic shows a different model, but I noticed the same problem. Ignoring the superficial flaws, it was still evident that the shars vise isn't made up to the same standards.

[TClarke]

Anyone else notice also that the Glacern "March Madness Sale" ended just in time for the "Tax Burned Reversal Sale" to begin with even lower prices?

IIRC different stuff was on sale last month. They have a list on their site that changes every month.

[BobWarfield]

Glacern tool quality is awesome. Even if they use the same forgings, I would bet on Glacern's Quality Control--the owner is a real stickler.

As for Maritool, they're another great vendor. Mactec, I don't know what you think you heard, where and when, but I've never seen Frank Mari make any such claims. His tooling is great too, but I mostly buy endmills from him.

Nothing wrong with Shars either. I've bought a lot of things from them, and they can be a cut above the usual import stuff. However, Glacern and Maritool are both a further cut above in my experience.

Cheers,

BW

[Runner4404spd]

i will second the kudos for frank Mari. i have used alot of his stuff and its really top notch. it may be true that not all of his tooling is USA made but it is of top notch quality. i haven't used any of the glacern stuff, but really when it comes down to it, i think i would rather have a Kurt anyway. i bought 3 of the 6300 vices and couldn't be happier.

[mactec54]

Hi TClarke

I'm sure there are different model vises that they have, but Shars & Glacern come out of the same factory & the quality is the same for both, amazing what a different name makes

[TClarke]

but Shars & Glacern come out of the same factory

You know this from experience or speculation? Both vises are clones of a Kurt 3600. Of course they'll look the same. What you end up with when you open the box is a different story.

Even if they came from the same source (which I'm sure they don't), based on what I've seen with my own eyes, that would mean that shars gets the factory rejects, hence the lower price. It's also hard to trust their accuracy claims, considering they post similar accuracy specs on their website even with their cheapest vises (which many other members have confirmed to be false).

It has nothing to do with names, it has to do with hard evidence. I've seen both vises. They're not the same.

[mactec54]

BobWarfield

I have more than 40 cat40 holder from Frank at Maritool & only had to send one back for quality problem, He replaced it straight away, the problem I have with him he tells lies as to were his tooling is made, I asked him every time I called him where was his tooling made, he said it was made in USA,His shop in IL, We know now that none of his tooling is made in the USA

[mactec54]

TClarke
I have both so I know what you are saying is incorrect, & I have also the kurt 3600 vices as well that is the reason I put the photo of the 3600 its half the price of what we payed for the Kurt 3600

[Davenco]

Ken, I'm glad you started this thread. I was hoping to get some objective advice as to which vise I should go with. Now it's becoming exceedingly obvious that mactec54 is affiliated with Shars. I don't care if he works there -- I'm suspecting due to constant spamming and broken up English -- or if he's an unsolicited shill, but it's leaving a rather sour taste in my mouth.

Stepping away now...

[BobWarfield]

BobWarfield

I have more than 40 cat40 holder from Frank at Maritool & only had to send one back for quality problem, He replaced it straight away, the problem I have with him he tells lies as to were his tooling is made, I asked him every time I called him where was his tooling made, he said it was made in USA,His shop in IL, We know now that none of his tooling is made in the USA

Mactec I'm skeptical given that Frank was admitting publicly and in writing he imported the toolholders back when he started selling them:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...olders-124659/

Frank is a man of integrity in my experience.

Sincerely,

BW

[mactec54]

BobWarfield
I'm not sure were you are coming from with your link He says that he imports some but mostly makes them here in the US, which is not correct, he may make some things here in the US but everything we have had from him has not been made in the US, there has been nothing much wrong with the tooling he is selling, Just what he told us

It just that we though that we were getting US made tooling as that is what he told us we were getting, & it is all made in China

What happened to support the US manufactures & that's what we thought we were doing

[BobWarfield]

BobWarfield
I'm not sure were you are coming from with your link He says that he imports some but mostly makes them here in the US, which is not correct, he may make some things here in the US but everything we have had from him has not been made in the US, there has been nothing much wrong with the tooling he is selling, Just what he told us

It just that we though that we were getting US made tooling as that is what he told us we were getting, & it is all made in China

What happened to support the US manufactures & that's what we thought we were doing

You stated you had a problem with him telling you his CAT40 toolholders you'd bought from him were made in the US. He says straight up in that post that he imports the CAT40 toolholders. You can't get much plainer than that.

mactec, I don't have anything further to say. Mari is in black and white and you're just shucking and jiving. I don't believe Mari ever told you all of his tooling was made in the US. I think he has played it straight from the beginning.

Sincerely,

BW

[mactec54]

Davenco

I have 2 very nice machine shops & buy a lot of tooling of all kinds, We are not affiliated with Shars in any way, (AS YOU SAY) & have brought very little from them, but what we have brought has been very good quality & we know up front what you are buying

So no spam here Davenco

[ksanalytical]

Gentlemen,

I really appreciate most of these comments and I think they shed light on a very important product group. Items manufactured internationally with US quality control and perhaps even value added in the US. I just bought a bunch of Hertel end mills on MSC and was surprised that something as nice as they look was made in Korea.

I should have mentioned earlier that I just received my Glacern 6" precision vise and it looks amazing. My IH order has not been filled so I can't comment objectively at all though. Glacern has this down to $400 (I paid 430) now so I'll concede that the warm fuzzzy feeling I get while watching their videos is easily worth the extra $30. I can't comment on Shars, but Glacern was very responsive via email. If I had cash to burn, I might buy a matched 615 just for kicks. The thing really is beautiful.

If Shars is quoting specs on their cheaper vises which are not accurate, it would make me skeptical about their version of the higher end stuff as well.

If they sold BT30 toolholders I'd be loading up on those too!

Ken

[ksanalytical]

Interesting info from the Glacern site...

"Vise castings are made in Taiwan from 80,000 psi ductile iron, and are then finish ground, assembled, and inspected in the USA. This allows us to combine affordable pricing with guaranteed quality and accuracy. All vises carry a limited lifetime warranty against defects in materials and workmanship."

Ken

[TClarke]

Interesting info from the Glacern site...

"Vise castings are made in Taiwan from 80,000 psi ductile iron, and are then finish ground, assembled, and inspected in the USA. This allows us to combine affordable pricing with guaranteed quality and accuracy. All vises carry a limited lifetime warranty against defects in materials and workmanship."

Ken

Hey ken, yes, glacern has had that info on their website for as long as i can remember. It used to be on their home page.

[Davo J]

Shar's spammed another forum not long ago when there advertising didn't go through quick enough. They showed this beautiful picture of a 4" vise then under that they pictured the 6" vise. The castings on the 6" were crap and the jaw key was crook and every one let them know what they thought. that tread has since been taken down.
I have not heard a bad word about Glacern, with there product or there service.

There is a thread going on PM at the moment, and this is StreetSpeeds comments from it.
Quote
I can't comment on their vises, but I now buy basically all my tool holders from them. Their prices are more than fair, their quality is plenty high, and their customer support is far better than any other tooling company I've worked with.

Quick story: I had a Technik's mill chuck that started to run out .003". I sent it back to Techniks about 6 months ago for them to take a look at it. They finally got it back to me last week and said "We're not sure what's wrong, but you probably messed it up, so we're not going to replace it. We will sell you another one at a 10% discount." I politely said F U.

So I ordered Glacern's mill chuck, which is $100 less. Unfortunately, at 60 ipm and .350 deep with a .625 endmill in aluminum it pulled out, messed up my part and trashed the end mill.

I e-mailed Sol and told him about it, expecting him to say "Well, don't push it so hard." Instead he told me that is totally unacceptable. He paid the shipping for me to send everything back, gave me a prompt and immediate refund on my credit card, and sent me an ER32 holder for free for my troubles. I have no doubt they'll work the bugs out of the collet system on the mill chuck, and when they do I'll buy another in an instant and give it another shot. And he'll probably sell me that one at a deep discount.


Moral of the story: Glacern, good people. Buy from them.
Unquote

The full thread is here
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb...y-them-201627/

A Glacern vise review
http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/sho...t=glacern+vice

And this is what you get when buying a cheap one
http://www.docsmachine.com/projects/4vise/4vise-01.html

Dave