[gixxergary]

Ive put in the paperwork at our bank this past week, for a new ST20. Not sure if were going to pull the trigger just yet, but the older sl20 we have isnt keeping up with the work load. I need another spindle soon. I like the new design in theory. Anyone have any opinions on this new machine???

Thanks,
Gary

[Donkey Hotey]

Based on the machines I've seen at Westec and Haastec, I'd say that I don't think the chip flow is as good in the new ST series machines. The SL-20 just drops them down to the conveyor area. The ST has the tailstock rails running horizontally and there is a lot of horizontal area to accumulate chips.

With all of that said, the Y-axis options really seem to boost the usefulness of live tooling on the ST series. If a lot of your parts were having second ops done in the mill, I'd consider those two options (live tooling and Y-axis).

In fact, I'd consider the ST-30 with live tooling and Y-axis. It buys you 3.0" bar capacity and I'm intrigued by the possibility of moving small milled parts to the lathe. Imagine loading up a 5-foot bar and making a run of small milled parts without having to open the doors. Mill all the features, using the spindle as the C-axis and part them off at the end. This obviously won't work on all parts but, if you have control over the design of your parts, it opens new possibilities.

[gixxergary]

The sl20 handles all of our work sizes. Actually, the 10 would handle 90% of it, but the 20 fills in all the gaps nicley, and has a 4k spindle. I wouldnt mind going with a 30, and going after some larger work, but were so busy with the smaller items, it just wouldnt be practical in the short term.

I was also concerned about the tail stock rails. Without a parts catcher in our sl, we use the typical plastic tote with holes drilled, to catch our small bar pulled parts. This doesnt seem easily accomplished with that rail system in place. The other thing I didnt like, was the elimination of setting 51 (door hold override). I know its a safety feature, but we do ALOT of 2nd side ops without coolant, and the thought of opening and closing the door to run a 4 second cycle is ridiculous. I know we can pull that bracket or key thing off, and just insert it into the switch, but why would they do that in the first place.

Any more opinions would be greatly appreciated.
Gary

[ken70ss396@yaho]

I have a new ST-20 and it runs great. I have no problem with chips getting on the rails and they drop right down on to the conveyor. There is plenty of room with the Tailstock setup. I have it setup with 12 tools and only have to change a few drills and boring bars. The 45 degree angle of the turret gives plenty of room also.I also opted for the auto tool setup probe (excellent) and the parts catcher works great.

[colton_m]

The shop I work at has graced us with three of these new lathes in the past year.

We also have two SL-20's (2004).

I can honestly say the ST machines are absoloutly more rigid. The design of the new tailstock works great. As far as chip flow goes, there are more places for the chips to build up in the enclosure but it doesn't really cause any issues for us. We run one of the machines constantly with a bar puller and as long as someone blows down the inside at the end of the day it never goets out of control messy. One problem we have chip wise is with the doors... tons of chips somehow get built up in the slot the door rides in and eventually prevents the door from opening all the way. Of course this can be solved by cleaning up haha.

The turret does seem slower then the SL lathes but I attribute this to the fact that it has 12 stations (as opposed to 10). We have the BOT turrets. The 12 stations are also a big help in our case because we machine a lot of castings and can rarely mount two tools side-by-side. With the ST machine this is solved easily.

The new safety features IMO are a pain in the ass, but that can be remidied in some round about kind of ways.

Also I find when running the spindle over 2500 RPM the ST machines are a lot quieter than the SL's. Granted I was not around when the SL20's were installed so they may have been neglected a bit, BUT the ST Lathes are definatly quiter at this point anyways. Which is nice when we have more than 10 machines running all at once.

I hope this helps, any specific questions just ask. We have both machines and run them all religiously.

- Colton.

p.s. using a tote or box to catch parts works fine in these machines, the tailstock rails don't come close enough to the spindle to cause a problem. The parts catcher also works great if you decide to add one.

[gixxergary]

Thank you for the responses! I am looking forward to the 12 station bot. My SL has the haas turret, and it is terrible. Everyday, I grumble to myself, I wish I would have bought the bot.

I do have one question. I noticed on the haas website, it claims this machine weighs in at 9,000 lbs. I believe my sl is 7500. The haas rep, said the website is wrong, and the st-20 weighs 12000. Is this correct? What does it really weigh? The freight quote I recieved was for a 12,500 load.

Thanks,

[KenFoulks]

I noticed on the haas website, it claims this machine weighs in at 9,000 lbs. The haas rep, said the website is wrong, and the st-20 weighs 12000.

9000 lbs is a base machine without options. 12000 lbs is an average of options and base with coolant tank. I believe a freight company will charge the same for either weight, it is the square and cubic footage that should dictate the cost.

[waer]

A problem ST20 (equipped with live tools) is that G77 cycle is not working although it makes no reference to this. Haas technicians shrugs Ask them or at best say that he is still working on this issue. That's only if you ask. If not, find out where you want to make a hexagon - for example-and notes that of the soft error.
Otherwise, it is a good machine for small parts.

[KenFoulks]

The G77 flatting cycle was developed in the Haas control before C-axis capabilities. It does not perform as well as a G112 with c-axis, which we recommend using instead.