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IndustryArena Forum > WoodWorking Machines > DIY CNC Router Table Machines > 5x10 CNC Router using CNCROUTERPARTS Components
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    36

    5x10 CNC Router using CNCROUTERPARTS Components

    I am hoping to start building a CNC Router within the next month. I will be using components from cncrouterparts.com for the XY&Z axis and LVL for the base. Cutting area will be 60” x 120”. The open area at the front of the machine is for a future 4th axis. Some of the other components I have which I plan on using are.

    Bob Campbell control box
    Rogers Machine encoder board
    US digital encoders
    Anaheim Automation 432 oz in Steppers
    2.2KW water cooled spindle
    Automation Direct GS2 VFD

    Here are a few screen captures along with a link to the Sketchup file. The drawings are a little rough around the edges as I am new to Sketchup and this is the first thing I have drawn with it.

    Any and all suggestions are welcome.

    Sam
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Image00001.jpg   Image00002.jpg   Image00003.jpg   Image00004.jpg  

    Image00005.jpg   Image00006.jpg  

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    1036
    Looks great. I suggest that you consider using CNCRouteParts's "High Z plate". Here's a link: CNCRouterParts. I think that it is much better to mount the Z and Y plates back to back especially on a large router.

    Hope that you'll post photos of your build.

    Don

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    36
    Thanks Don, I had originally planned on using the High Z but was concerned with the total weight of the Z. As it is now the Z will weight about 32 lbs and using the High Z I figured the weight at around 40 lbs. I was worried about wear on the Z axis nut. Is weight something I need to worry about on the nut?

    Sam

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    663
    Get a LARGE three-ring note book, keep copies of all documentation and progress notes in there.

    Make a detailed budget of your design, then make decisions based on that, coupled with engineering, motion, electronics and software considerations.

    With this large of a machine, unexpected costs can sink the best and most promising ideas very fast. [Or your marriage!]

    You are going to be stunned at the cost of fasteners; that is: bolts, washers, nuts. And stay away from metric-sized fasteners; Imperial sizes only. Go to the local hardware and look at prices of a nut, washer and bolt set; then start multiplying those prices by 10, 20 and 30. Taking smelling salts and oxygen with you to help with the shock.

    The moments of inertia calculations need to be done before the first part is purchased, especially considering the spans on the planned table.

    Make a space budget. Where are you going to build? Where are you going to store parts? Where are you going to store tools? Do you have all the appropriate tools? What are your occupancy costs: Rent [either actual or implied], electricity, fuels, taxes, maintenance of the facility. How is the electrical power to these spaces. Copper wiring and electricians are very expensive.

    Make a time budget, then multiply by two; by three is you are married; by four is you have pre-teen children. Teenage children will be ignoring you, but do cause problems if ignored, so if you have teenagers, multiply by five. If you have "friends" who are going to help, then multiply by six.

    For the time budget you have these phases for the base table: Planning and design, parts location, parts acquisition, construction, disassembly, reconstruction.

    Repeat for electronics, motion devices, motion control and software.

    Include time for the frustration, confusion, and overwhelmed stages!!!

    SketchUp is nice for conceptual drawing, but not for drawing for CNC work, especially if you are going to make items with any circular parts. Sketchup does not do arcs or circles, but represents them with short lines and meshes. Try Alibre.

    Controller software: MACH or EMC2, both have plus and minuses. One size does not fit all. Both will take more time than you realize. Add more time if you are a software engineer.

    Still in the game?

    Then good luck!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Posts
    253
    Great reply zool,
    the only thing I would add about being married, factor in 50 x the time if your wife is a b!tch lol and they're all like that at times

    Great looking machine sharbold, watching with interest.
    I'll get it finished sometime after I start it.....

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    36
    Zool

    Thanks for the information. You are absolutely correct in that there is a lot to consider and pricing can run away very quick, especially the small items. I am in fairly good shape as far as the materials needed. I everything except for the 5pcs of 6' rack and the 3 rack & pinion drives from CNC Router Parts.

    I am planning on building the machine in place which is a 24' x 26' area with 2 8'x8' overhead doors for access. The only other equipment in this area is a 18' PVC oven a large air compressor and a 2 hp cyclone dust collector which will be used for the CNC. As for the electrical I just wired in a 60 amp sub panel 10' from where the CNC will set. The sub panel is for the CNC and dust collector.

    As for family my only daughter is married and living on the west coast. My wife who is also my business partner will be helping me build the CNC.

    For drawing parts for the CNC I have DesignCAD & Turbo CAD and for generating the G-code I have Vector CAD-CAM, Vcarve Pro, and ArtCam. I will be using MACH to run the machine. Here is a screen shot of the MACH screen I have been working on for my CNC.

    robe_uk thanks for compliment.

    Sam
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails screen_shot_1.jpg  

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    8082
    I like that screen! Make them easy to substitute different "skins" at startup - with skins for cocobolo, purpleheart, padauk, snakewood, curly wandoo eucalyptus, Sidney blue gum eucalyptus, bocote, zebrawood, curly and quilted maple, figured walnut, and all my other favorite woods and they'll sell like hot cakes.

    CarveOne
    CarveOne
    http://www.carveonecncwoodcraft.com

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    663
    Sam:

    60-amperes at how many volts and what phase?

    In any case, 60-amperes is not enough!! You will find out when the CNC machine and dust collector are both running, and then the air compressor kicks on ... POW!!!! ...huge power drop, with ensuing computer shut down .. no power, even with a sub-panel. Sub-panels come off a main panel, and main panels are carrying a big load as well.

    Suggestion: Use a UPS [uninterpretable power supply] on the computer, with it wired to the e-stop so the machine stops if the power drops and the computer shuts down.

    You will be stunned at how many amperes a dust collector or air compressor draw when they start-up!!! Do hire a good industrial electrician to come and help you design the electrical system in your space.

    Though a 624 square foot space [basically a large two-car garage] looks pretty big, wait until all the"stuff" gets in there!!! Suddenly you will barely be able to walk through the place. You are aware that "stuff" divides and multiplies in the night!

    I had to move from a 2,500 square foot space to an 800 square foot space, and I am having a hard time, even though I have 18-foot clear ceilings, and have 15-foot by 8-foot by 42-inch steel pallet racks. Climbing up and down that ladder is getting boring!!! [I store all my exotic woods on the top shelves of the racks so C1 can't find them.]

    Your wife is going to help you build the machine??!! You sweet talker; whats your secret??!!

    Your MACH screen is the best one yet.

    C1: How come you are always at the head of the line when someone says "exotic wood"??

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    663
    Same:

    For your use, specialty wood products, I am wondering is these are large enough:

    Anaheim Automation 432 oz in Steppers
    2.2KW water cooled spindle
    Automation Direct GS2 VFD

    Given the curves you will be cutting and the loads that can put on steppers and the spindles, I'd think about steppers that are twice as large and a water-cooled spindle of around 5-horse power.

    You are in a low volume competitive market, so speed is your only saving grace.

    Here is one of my sub-contractors, these are BIG machines and he has a hard time, even with high-end jobs: About Us

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    8082
    Quote Originally Posted by zool View Post
    - snip - [I store all my exotic woods on the top shelves of the racks so C1 can't find them.]

    C1: How come you are always at the head of the line when someone says "exotic wood"??
    Oh, so THAT'S where you hid it. No wonder I couldn't find it. I could smell the exotic tropical wood oils in the air though.

    It's become a serious addiction for me. Sounds like we both may need to go into rehab sometime soon. Louie too. I think he has a worse case of it than either of us do.

    C1
    CarveOne
    http://www.carveonecncwoodcraft.com

  11. #11
    Not sure how much the Z axis weighs...seems like 32# is a little on the heavy side unless it is from a spindle. I have used mine now for over a year and no issues. I spray it once in a while with dry lube.

    I had a 5 by 12 machine that I ended up cutting back to 5 by 6 due to space in the shop. I run this machine 6-8 hours a day 4 days a week. Good setup Ahren has done with his parts.

    Sean


    Quote Originally Posted by sharbold View Post
    Thanks Don, I had originally planned on using the High Z but was concerned with the total weight of the Z. As it is now the Z will weight about 32 lbs and using the High Z I figured the weight at around 40 lbs. I was worried about wear on the Z axis nut. Is weight something I need to worry about on the nut?

    Sam
    www.FreeCNCPlans.com

  12. #12
    What is LVL?

    Sean
    www.FreeCNCPlans.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    371
    LVL = Laminated veneer lumber - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    It's a way to make a long strong wood beam.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    36
    CarveOne once I have my CNC finished I would like to add additional wood grain skins to the screenset.

    Zool It's 60 Amps 220 volt single phase. This is just for the CNC and dust collector. The compressor is feed from a different panel. I do have a friend who is a master electrician for a large manufacturing corporation and I will have him stop by take a look at the electrical just to be safe.

    The UPS is a good suggestion and I have plenty of those setting around not being used.

    The 624 sq. ft. is the dedicated area for the CNC and PVC oven. We have an additional 1200 sq. ft. of shop which we have been running the business from for the past 20 years. At time I wish is was more but we work with what we have.

    Our business is just my wife and I and we do everything from quoting jobs, ordering materials, unloading trucks, making the products, delivering the product, invoicing and sweeping the shop floor. We have been doing it for the last 20 years.

    We have been using 4' x 8' ShopBot which we purchased new in 1999 which has a 3 hp Porta Cable router motor for the spindle. We are still using the ShopBot everyday so this is what I based my spindle size on. Most of what we cut is 3/8” MDF and 3/4” PVC. The reason for building the new machine is that the ShopBot's cutting area is only 48” x 96” and we are finding ourselves needing 9' &10' templates more often. Shifting the sheet on the ShopBot works for now but will be nice to just slide a 10' sheet on the CNC and cut.

    Freecncplans Yes I have a 2.2kw spindle which weights 25 lbs plus a steel spindle mount weighting 5 lbs. Then add to that a 3/4” thick Alum plate for mounting the spindle to the carriages and the 2 carriages bring me in at 32 lbs. I like the idea of the High Z I was just worried about wear on the Z nut.

    LVL is Laminated Veneer Lumber which is used as structural headers in buildings.

    Sam

  15. #15
    Can you use a double nut? Maybe drill and tap an area on the plate above the current nut for a second one. This way you have two to share the load. I don't think you will have any issues with it personally with a single, but you never know.

    Sean
    www.FreeCNCPlans.com

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    8082
    Quote Originally Posted by sharbold View Post
    CarveOne once I have my CNC finished I would like to add additional wood grain skins to the screenset.
    I don't know anything about designing new screens for Mach3, so I don't know if it is possible to have skins like WinAmp and others audio players, but I like the concept of selectable wood grains in Mach3 and the ability to add more later.

    My second CNC machine started life as a 49" x 62" built into a 4' x 8' work table that was 36" high. It worked fine for the most part, but had some issues I didn't like, so I ordered steel box tubing and ended up with a 49" x 136" cutting area on a 4.5' x 12' machine. The box tubing came in 24' lengths so I just cut it in half. The table top is 32" high and I find that it is much easier to reach over to the center of the table or to load full sheet MDF onto the table.

    The unused part of the table is still useful as a work table.

    CarveOne
    CarveOne
    http://www.carveonecncwoodcraft.com

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    35538
    Did you ever start this project?
    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    36
    Gerry

    No but I hope to start the build by September. Business really picked up and I have not had any spare time since the end of April. I have all these parts and pieces laying around the shop it would be nice to have the work space back.

    Sam

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