[tom tom]

Hello friends,

I teach in a community college and tell students to pull their pants up when their underwear is exposed. (I buy belts at yard sales and give these out as needed too!) This past year 2 students have "gone off" on me and I heard all kinds of stuff about their "rights", etc. as you can imagine. :argue:

My questions - and I will show these answers to my students first day and share these with my collegues - 1) what would you say/do if someone came into you place of employment looking for work and his underwear is showing?
2) what would you do if a previously properly dressed employee decided one day he was going to start showing off his underwear?

best regards to all,

Tom Tom

[ger21]

1) I wouldn't say anything, but he certainly wouldn't be getting hired.
2) Send him home.

[the4thseal]

That is simple.....Tell that person that there are a great many people that would like their job.they have the right to dress the way they want and you have the right to employ the people you want...everyone has the right to the consequences of their free will.

[underthetire]

Grab a handfull of hot chips and show em real quick what it feels like:idea:

[fizzissist]

As an employer, I would have to wonder...

If you don't have any self-respect and don't care what you look like, how am I supposed to believe that you'll care about the product you're helping me produce?

Sure, you 'may' have the right to proudly display your underpants. But I definitely have the right to not hire you for being proudly immature.

[ksanalytical]

I run a small business and have had a hand full of employee in recent years. Sagging pants has never been an issue, but rest assured, I've passed over applicants for less. One guy had missed a belt loop on his pants and didn't care to correct it after I mentioned it. Slovenly dress projects a message to the other employees and especially to the customers. As an employer I have the right to define the dress code within legal limits and last time I checked, sagging pants was not a religious statement.

I agree with previous statements that the employer would not tell the employee why they were not hired. It's never a good idea to give extra information in our litigious society. It's important for your students to know that just because their pants are not explicitly noted as the cause for being passed over, they may well have been.

I had a science teacher 15 years ago who commonly stood at the front of the class each time homework was assigned. She listed the pages to be read and questions to be answered, then qualified it with, "or feel free not to do the work. I need someone to mow my yard and take out my trash." As has been stated, we all have the right to experience the consequences of our actions.

[diyengineer]

Incorporate a dress code policy into your curriculum. If they don't wan't to deal with the "rules" then they fail. easy as that.

For "safety" concerns it can be easily justified to any educational board if challenged. I'm sure the insurance company would also be pleased to here the STRONG liability warning that you gave as well. If something did happen, you would have already warned them, and its laced into the curriculum safety plan. What if someone was walking and tripped on there own pants? what if someone was mid step and there pants got caught on something? Any baggy clothes should not be allowed in the shop whatsoever. Its a danger to them, and the other people around them. End of story.

I have been in enough shop classes to know how one is properly run. If they give you lip send them home, if they dont want to fail, they can pull there pants up and use a belt, or go home and never return.

I also own a business and would never hire some piece of $hit who cant dress correctly. Would i ever say why i didn't hire them? No, i don't have to give anyone a single reason why i did or didn't, just gives them extra ammo.

Hello friends,

I teach in a community college and tell students to pull their pants up when their underwear is exposed. (I buy belts at yard sales and give these out as needed too!) This past year 2 students have "gone off" on me and I heard all kinds of stuff about their "rights", etc. as you can imagine. :argue:

My questions - and I will show these answers to my students first day and share these with my collegues - 1) what would you say/do if someone came into you place of employment looking for work and his underwear is showing?
2) what would you do if a previously properly dressed employee decided one day he was going to start showing off his underwear?

best regards to all,

Tom Tom

[vidio1]

It displays a level of immaturity that is void of professionalism in a professional work environment. If they were able to secure work i'm sure their pay and benefits would never match their peers.

[littlerob]

I knew I would post a response to this as soon as I read the title. So here goes, I personally think the saggy pants are annoying and show a level of slovenliness that I am not comfortable with. BUT this is a school, where young people go to express themselves, by fashion and personality (oh yeah and learn stuff too). My point is that if it is actually a safety issue, and you are actually concerned, than by all means determine what is and is not appropriate and police it. If it is a personal irritation (as it is for me) I think as a teacher you have right/responsibility/whatever to allow students to dress whichever way they want. The responses to this thread have been advice on "justifying" your personal needs, because YOU don't like a dress habit.

My 2 ¢
Robert

[fizzissist]

Then there's these factors....

You're sending a message to your currently valued employees, like that crusty old toolmaker that makes jewelry, that you don't care who or what you hire. It's a message of disrespect for him. Or any other employees who take pride in themselves and what they do.

You're going to be expected to put some snot-nosed, pants around his ankle kid in front of a $200,000 CNC machine that's costing you $3500/month just to sit there?? I sure as hell would not. I don't care how good he can make me think he is at programming, set up, and operation.

I don't trust him.

How much time is he going to spend pulling his pants up, at the dollar a minute you need to be charging to justify his existence??

Finally, imagine touring prospective clients through your shop, hoping for that big contract.....only to have them see you're hiring skate-boarder mentality employees?? He can't pull his pants up but he's ISO 9000 compliant???

Who's kidding whom??

Odds are, if you look like a dumb f^@k, you probably are.

[Caprirs]

Years ago, a machinist I knew had a note taped to the side of his toolbox that read:

Women wearing loose clothing should beware the machinery. Women wearing tight clothing should beware the machinist.




In a education environment, the dress is not so important so long as it meets the needs of decency. In a professional environment, appearance can mean a lot.

I think that some young people get things backwards. If a young guy is a genius whiz kid who makes huge money for his company, the company is more likely to grant the kid leeway with his appearance. However, the overlooked part by many young guys is they have to excel first, then reap the benefits (flexible dress code, flexible hours, higher pay, perks, etc.) Too many people want the genius rock star treatment first and then assume the performance will follow.

[Geof]

Come on you stodgy old farts. Don't you ever remember being young and rebellious?

[diyengineer]

Come on you stodgy old farts. Don't you ever remember being young and rebellious?

I'm 24. I keep it classy. haha

[james45667]

Interesting question on the pants. I am 62, so way past the age when those pants came in style, which style seems ridiculous to me. However, I was young in the '60s when the hippie styles looked ridiculous to people my parents' age, and look ridiculous now to me, too.

There seem to be two issues here, though, or three. I work in a hospital, and we have some young helper types who have wild haircuts- bright red mohawks, for instance. Are hair and pants the same issue? In other words, would you be equally turned off by a hair style as a pants style? It seems to me that the pants would have another negative qualifier, that of loose clothing, and therefore a safety issue, that the hair would not.

I feel that as owner of a business that you have the right to refuse to hire anyone whose appearance does not reflect your vision of your own business. Does this limit that person's extent of expression? Yes, while he's on your time, in your employ. He can go home and wear whatever pants he wants, or not. While he's on the job, however, he needs to present a professional appearance, whatever that is in your view. Every job I've been on past my youthful labor days has had a dress code. Every one. Not one employer had to walk on eggshells trying to avoid hampering someone's means of self-expression. Not one. Here's how you dress. Period.

Does he have the right to wear clothing that might also be risky around turning machinery? Absolutely not. That alone can be your reason, should someone question you, not that you owe an answer: safety. The fact that you don't like the style can remain just a matter of private opinion.

[fizzissist]

Yale senior dies in machine shop accident - CNN

It's not like she was dumb.

[skullworks]

We once had a very good employee show up without his prescription safety glasses. Without the prescription lenses he was rather useless.

He spent the day wearing his "street" prescription glasses in the front office stuffing envelopes for a new product release announcement.

Another employee wore a long sleeved shirt that was to tight to roll up the sleeves. He was issued a broom, dustpan and mop bucket for his tools of the day.

Last example - employee came to work in Vans deck shoes. Was assigned tool room duty to inventory all the carbide inserts. I don't think he ever forgot his steeltoe again.

Its as stupid as trying to deal with a serious hazmat spill without any protective gear, and if they get hurt they expect the company to play (pay) uncle sugar.

[underthetire]

Might be an old fart to some, but even my 16 year old boy makes fun of them. And he is no gem of a dresser, wants to put gauges in his ears ( those hole things) and pierce his lip. I'll probably let him to, doesn't really bother me as much as looking at someones shorts.

[littlerob]

I understand the "impression" that kind of dress makes, I really do, since I am a "skateboarder". I just think that judging someone based on their appearance is a little well--uh judgmental. As a shop owner or supervisor or nagging mother you have the right to decide what is and is not acceptable. But this is SCHOOL not an employer!! My father who is 70, had some pretty real eyebrows raised at him in the 50's when he wore tight pants and a tee shirt, they teased him for wearing his "underwear" without a proper shirt, remember that Fizzisist?

@ James45667; there is quite a bit of discussion on the issue of hair;http://www.cnczone.com/forums/safety...ight=long+hair

[fizzissist]

I understand the "impression" that kind of dress makes, I really do, since I am a "skateboarder". I just think that judging someone based on their appearance is a little well--uh judgmental. As a shop owner or supervisor or nagging mother you have the right to decide what is and is not acceptable. But this is SCHOOL not an employer!! My father who is 70, had some pretty real eyebrows raised at him in the 50's when he wore tight pants and a tee shirt, they teased him for wearing his "underwear" without a proper shirt, remember that Fizzisist?

@ James45667; there is quite a bit of discussion on the issue of hair;http://www.cnczone.com/forums/safety...ight=long+hair

In high school boys were not allowed to wear T-shirts without a pocket. You couldn't wear white T-shirts, because they were underwear. You couldn't wear colored T-shirts because boys don't wear colored underwear.
Girls could not wear pants. (many boys agreed with this rule, whether or not the girls were wearing skirts...)

Were the rules stupid? Absolutely. ....BUT...... We were clean, and we were neat.
Even in my "hippie" phase I was clean, and the fashion didn't intend to insult, merely differentiate. At work, my hair touched my collar and did illicit the ire of my boss...who also happened to be my father...but there was an understanding that it got tied back at work, and safety was #ONE.

I have no problem with kids wanting to "rebel" and be different.....just like everyone else.... And really. I do think some of the styles are downright silly. Like the racoon look. But that's fine, they're not bothering anyone, and it helps them fit in with one another.

The underwear thing? I know a quick way to stop that style which is intended to insult, and only that.....Anyone wanna help??

Let us old guys pick a day to head off to the mall....wearing our pants around our asses....with our Depends proudly displayed. Just watch how fast THAT fad dies. Yeah, just see who gets offended with that one.

[ger21]

But this is SCHOOL not an employer!!

Which is where they should be learning that it's not always appropriate to wear anything you want. Kids wear pajamas and flip flops to school now. When I was in school, we weren't even allowed to wear shorts. I can't believe what parents let their kids get away with. But that's a different topic.