[bill south]

:idea: I have a question for those familuar with autocad and solid works. Or maybe I just need some good advice. I'm building a cnc milll for home hobby use and will use it for minor work on colt 1911 handguns. I have never taken a cad course and only have high school drafting from 35 years ago. I checked the local tech college and they offer a course in solid works and one in autocad. Each is a $475 course and runs for 6 weeks. The cost does not include the costs of the books or a copy of the software. And, I do not have the software for either of these! I have purchased (due to costs mainly) Turbocad pro and bobcad 19. My problem is that I can't afford either the time or money to take both of these courses so can anyone share an opinion as to which (if either) one would be the most benificial to this beginner??? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated!
billyjack
:cheers:

[Verfur]

cost being high at about $6000. for solid works. I would even look into Rino, it more economical or was last I check any way. I have freinds that use it and say its not bad for the buck but Solid works is the best of them for solids if we exclude CATI (for the number of zeros in the price tag).

John

[JerryFlyGuy]

BillyJack, I've worked with both for about 3 years [ 6 total] Since we've purchased SolidWorks and I took the re-seller courses, I haven't used AutoCad except for some very simple 2 minute sketch's. If your taking a course, you should be able to buy the whole SolidWorks Package [student edition] including all the FEA and motion add-on products,for like $300-400. I wouldn't buy AutoCad at this point. IMO that would kinda be like buying a NEW 1995 BMW off the lot today in 2006, for only $1000 less than the price of a new 2006 BMW, your starting off behind before you ever get it off the lot! Solidworks/3D design is the future!! AutoCad can do 3D stuff [ so they say] but when you compare it to Parametric solid modeling possible with Solidworks, Autocad looks like 3D design via tooth-picks and glue in comparison .

Btw.. I'm NOT Bias.... ( ok.. maybe I am )

Jerry

[ger21]

You can't really compare AutoCAD vs Solidworks. They are two different programs, with different intended uses. Buying a copy of AutoCAD is not like buying 10 year old software, btw. It is more powerful than anything else intended to do the same thing.

Also, when you ask for software advice, Soidworks users will tell you to buy Solidworks, AutoCAD users will tell you to by AutoCAD.

Now, I don't use Solidworks, I use AutoCAD. Most likely AutoCAD is not the program for you. AutoCAD's main purpose is 2D drafting. It can do 3D, and ACAD 2007, due out soon, add's a lot of 3D features. But it's a completely different way of working than a parametric modeler, like Solidworks. Most people that use AutoCAD for cnc, use it to make 2D .dxf drawings which they export to a CAM program. If that's what you plan on doing, there are plenty of $100 CAD programs that can do the same thing.

If you want to make 3D models, and you learn Solidworks, then the skills you learn will transfer to most other parametric modelers, as they are all very similar. And, as was mentioned, if you take a class, you can pick up a student version for very cheap.

[JFettig]

First of all, solidworks doesnt cost $6000, its more like $3k just the same as autocad.
Secondly, solidworks comes with a nockoff of autocad that works 90%(in my opinion) as good. So basicly you got 2 programs for the price of one.

I use to be an autocad man untill I learned solidworks and pro/e here at college. It is very hard to even think about going back.

Your choice kind of needs to reflect what you need to do. After you learn solidworks, its hard to go back.

My vote goes to solidworks, its awesome for modeling and it has an autocad type program with it. Its actually intellicad adopted by solidworks.

-edit- One more thing: Solidworks is pretty much a class in itself, it has some really nice tutorials and thats almost enough to get you going(if your creative and intuitive)


Jon

[sanddrag]

You can get a 2 year license of SolidWorks fot only $70. Incredible deal.

I find AuotCAD ver difficult to us .

I would take a good hard look at Autodesk Inventor. Not really the most popular in the industry but it is gaining ground and I find it easier to use than SolidWorks. Student license is about $200

[Verfur]

I went to tech school for Solid Works (defently worth the money) and a sales guy came in shot a pres. and handed out free PE editions of SW for free. AH but here is the catch the full version SW wile not work with the PE version (saved files). But hey free!! Now the good news for me was I could make the Solid and import it into A cam and viola start maching.

SW is sill the best (IMHO)

P.S. they said they were going to fix that hole in the new editions of SW.

So what does an office version of SW go for these days? Or does that depend on the State you buy it in?

[CNCAddict]

AutoCAD is a past generation modeler. For electrical wiring or floor plans it's ok. When there is nothing better AutoCAD is great, but Solidworks/Inventor/Alibre,etc. offer a HUGE benefit in productivity and usefulness for doing anything 3D. Even sketches in these programs are parametric, so testing out a TON of designs is very easy. You can even check linkages for interference and move them around on the screen in real time. This type of interactivity allows a closer understanding of your machine that a drafting program can only hint at. Parametric associative contraint based modelers are the future. IMO, AutoCAD should only be marketed at 2D applications, and even then its limited.

[WhiteTiger]

For your use, I'd suggest looking at TurboCAD. I used autocad for a couple of decades when I was gunmaking and smithing (started with 2d v2.11 acad ).

Made the switch a while back to TurboCAD and haven't touched my autocad since. I think you'll find everything you need in TurboCAD Deluxe v11 at a nice price that doesn't have you forking out for bells and whistles you will never use.


Tiger

[scottsss]

Solidowrks student edition. If you buy the student edition you will run into the problem that the full blow version can not read student edition files. I ran into this problem when I took it at the local junior colledge.

Also the software is only good for 2 year's.

If you look at Rhino3D you get a discount if you are a student. Plus it's the full blown software.

I've used AutoCad, Solidworks and Rhino. If I had my choice I would go with Solidworks. Reason being, I mostly work in 3D. Assemblies etc. I find Solidowrks easier to use and I do not have a long set of commands to remember. Just point and click.

Rhino I'm slowly learning and in some ways it is like AutoCad. You need to learn commands. But when I'm stuck I can go onto their wed site and under support access the news group. Post your question and, in an hour or so you get an answer. I've had every question except 1 answered.

As for the 1911 check out www.cncgunsmithing.com

I believe that he alread has a solid model available for a 1911. But the model was done in solidowrks. You can check out the site and see what he was able to do with the program.

[bill south]

Thanks everyone for the information. Tough choice but I did check on the solidworks student edition software. They require a "minimum of three (3) credit hours in a degree or diploma granting program or a full time faculty member of an accredited educational institution". My little 6 week course will not qualify (continuing education) so, no software. I did phone the college and bowed out. Maybe next year. So, guess I'll have to concentrate on Bobcad and maybe use the money saved from the course to buy the tutorial software which is (I think) available! :violin:
billyjack

[Skibbe]

AutoCad is more of a 2D program, yes... but don't forget AutoCad Inventor which is their 3D modeling product. If they are offering a 3D modeling course with AutoCad software, chances are good that it is AutoCad Inventor, not just straight AutoCad.

[CNCAddict]

Maybe you could get the free version of Alibre. It can do up to 25 parts in an assembly and it's good parametric software.

[keebler303]

I took a turbocad class in highschool and an autocad class in college. Now I have solidworks and i never use anything else. if you have a little time on your hands you can teach yourself. i am entirely self taught and i have done some pretty involved models. as mentioned earlier the tutorials on solidworks are excellent and they really teach you how to use the program. i am sure you would learn a lot in a class but it would be hard for me to justify the cost after seeing how easy it is to learn.

Matt

[HayTay]

Bill,

Check out the SolidWorks 3d Skills Program link to see if there is a Reseller near you that offers the 1/2 day hands-on introduction. At the end of the seminar/training you get to walk away with a FREE copy of SolidWorks Personal Edition software (and lunch was provided FREE, too!).

I know, I know, you can't open the models/drawings in the real version of SolidWorks (they do offer a conversion service if you purchase the full version, btw), the software expires after 90 days (a renewal is offered though), you can't use it in commercial or institutional environments, and a watermark is displayed on all drawings (not too big of a deal as it doesn't affect you if you just want to learn to use their software). The SolidWorks Personal Edition is usually one version behind the current release, also.

You can, however, do everything else that the full version does. What's even better is that you can save your drawing in DXF format from the drawing window (without watermark) for import into a CAM program!

The SolidWorks 3d Skills 1/2 day seminar coupled with SolidWorks fantastic tutorials gets you up and drawing/modeling quickly.

Nobody offered a seminar in my area (North Carolina, USA) when I was looking for a copy, so I wound up driving about 3 1/2 hours to another state and staying overnight to take a class. My FREE copy wound up costing me around $120 but I think it was well worth the time and expense. That's cheaper than the $475 + books + software for the Tech College course. I've spent more on software that is sitting on a shelf collecting dust. I'm still using my FREE edition of SolidWorks PE and learn something new everytime I create a model. One day I'll scrape up enough money to purchase the full edition of SolidWorks.

And, yes, I have used full versions of AutoCAD, DesignCAD, TurboCAD and CorelDRAW. I also tried a dozen or more demo versions of other CAD/Drawing programs including Alibre Express and Rhino3D. I find AutoCAD, TurboCAD and some others to have a fairly steep learning curve for the hobbiest with little or no CAD or drawing experience.

Not having around $3000 for SolidWorks I'd purchase either Alibre or Rhino3D. If I had $3000 I wouldn't miss, it would be no contest, I'd purchase SolidWorks without thinking twice about it.

My 2 cents,
I hope it helps,

HayTay