[Dstamp]

I am using V25.000 (build 996) on a Dell Precision M4700 w/ NVIDIA Quadro K2000M, with software installed on the only hard drive in the system (SSD).

The layer control seems unpredictable in the following way. I can select entities, select change attributes, select change layer and all appgears OK, however when I try to hide or display the layer that I sent the entities to it does not show/display according to the layer that I selected.

Also, I can click on the layers icon & set the active layer (shown by the red check mark) but I cannot click on the show/hide icon (black or white square to left of layer icon) to select which are displayed as described in the help menu.

Tried sample file "2D Sample' by adding new layer, selecting the arc in the middle of the part and modifying attributes to newly added layer, then turning off that layer, did not work.

Any insight on this would be appreciated.

DLS

[Machineit]

Not sure I understand completely, but I can tell you that you can not hide a layer that you have the red check mark on. You must go to a different layer then hide the other one the select it again. If you do that, the layer you have selected will be hidden.

Mike

[Dstamp]

I was hopeful that would work, but it didn't make a difference, added another layer (with no entities in it), set that as active layer (with red check mark) and tried hiding all of the other layers, they still displayed the entities that were on them without logical placement of which ones were on which layers.


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[mmoe]

It would be easiest if you post your sample file. I don't think it's likely to be your problem as your example seems quite simple, but keep in mind that there are selection masks that you may have activated by accident as well. I've done that from time to time and ended up wondering why everything I thought I selected didn't get the intended changes to their attributes, only later to notice that a selection mask is active. Just something to keep in mind. Selection masks are perhaps one of my favorite features of Bobcad and I wish they were in more CAD systems.

[Dstamp]

How do I insert / post a file?


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[mmoe]

Click on the "Go Advanced" button just below your reply text box, then to something like "Manage Attachments" where you can upload a file. For .bbcd files, you need to send it to a compressed folder (right click on your file, the select "send to" and "compressed folder").

[Dstamp]

Files attached (I think both are the same, as I may have saved the new one as the original file name).
TIA for the help & insight on this problem.

DLS

[mmoe]

OK, so the layer "Not Named" has nothing on it, so I'll guess that that is the one you added just for a blank layer. The layer "CAD" has one arc in a corner on it, layer "nn 2" has the circle on it and layer "nn3" has the rest of the entities on it. If I set "Not Named" as active (red check), I can then hide the other layers just fine by clicking on the black square to the left in the layer manager for each layer. This is how I've always done it. If I right click on a layer and select "Hide All", they all disappear as they should. If I right click on a layer and select "Hide", which I take it should hide that specific layer, the black check disappears the same as it would if you had clicked on it, but the entities don't disappear as they should. I'd say that it's a bug, but the work-around is simply to use the check box instead of the right click menu to hide individual layers. Hope that helps.

While it is a bug, I doubt it will get fixed as it's just not a major bug and there is already a built in way of doing the same thing another way. It's a shame that it's there, but not that big of a deal at the same time. I had never noticed it since I have always just used the check box, as I'm sure most users do which is why it probably never got noticed.

Edit:
V24 works like it should, but V26 still has the same bug. I'll submit a bug report for V26 and note that it's also in V25. I'm sure they'll sort it in V26 updates, but doubt V25 will get another.

[Dstamp]

Thanks, my system does not respond to clicking the black / white square, so I think I'm going to be using the mask feature to be able to hide/display entities.


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[mmoe]

Thanks, my system does not respond to clicking the black / white square, so I think I'm going to be using the mask feature to be able to hide/display entities.


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There should be another resolution to your problem other than that. I'm not sure what the cause is, but you are definitely not experiencing how it should be working. Is that a laptop?

[jrmach]

Dstamp,got to figure this one out.Don't give up yet.Layers are too important not to work right.I never tried R-Click,but you are correct that is broke.No biggy,,the reason I never used it is it adds one more click to the process.Much easier to just check box layers.Just for the heck of it open my file and see if the layers work.

[Dstamp]

Like the guy on Hill Street Blues used to say; 'Well I'll be dipped in brown sauce'.
Yes, the system is a laptop, but one that is designed and rated specifically for CAD applications and that meets the recommended requirements of BobCad (quadcore processor @ 3mhz, Windows 7, 8gig ram, dedicated graphics card).
I am in a time zone 13 hours ahead of Eastern Standard Time right now, so until now I was working from my home office with the laptop connected to an external monitor in dual screen mode. I've since arrived at my office and have tried the sample file provided by jrmach and it works as it should. I then opened the file I was working on earlier that I posted, and it too is working correctly. I will try again with my docking station and a dual monitor setup to see how that works.

Thanks again for the help, I will update in another 12 hours or so when I'm in my home office to confirm if the issue is related to the external monitor connected without a docking station.

Best regards,

[magicniner]

Dstamp,
I've tried your file on my system and the layers hide/unhide normally by clicking on the square.
I'm running V25 Build 996 on Vista on an old HP nc6400 laptop, are you using the latest drivers for your graphics adapter?

- Nick

[The Engine Guy]

Thanks, my system does not respond to clicking the black / white square, so I think I'm going to be using the mask feature to be able to hide/display entities.


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#

Tried both yours and jrmach examples, nothing broke that I can see, may be some mix up of how you are expecting it to work, right click and "Show All"/Hide All" does as you would expect, the single right click and "Show/Hide" only applies to the active layer, that is the one with the Red tick against it.
Selecting ANY other layer and then using the single "Hide" will hide whatever is on the Active layer, normally as you have found once a layer is selected as the Active one then clicking the Black check box will not allow you to hide the Active layer, using the single "Hide" command allows this !!

That`s how it works here and how I have always used it, much quicker and easier to hide the Red checked active layer using that method rather than moving the Active Red check to another layer.

Works for me anyway

Regards
Rob
:rainfro: :rainfro: :rainfro:

[mmoe]

#

Tried both yours and jrmach examples, nothing broke that I can see, may be some mix up of how you are expecting it to work, right click and "Show All"/Hide All" does as you would expect, the single right click and "Show/Hide" only applies to the active layer, that is the one with the Red tick against it.
Selecting ANY other layer and then using the single "Hide" will hide whatever is on the Active layer, normally as you have found once a layer is selected as the Active one then clicking the Black check box will not allow you to hide the Active layer, using the single "Hide" command allows this !!

That`s how it works here and how I have always used it, much quicker and easier to hide the Red checked active layer using that method rather than moving the Active Red check to another layer.

Works for me anyway

Regards
Rob
:rainfro: :rainfro: :rainfro:

You are correct that this is how it is working, but I'm not entirely sold that this is how it was meant to work. Let's say layer 1 is active, and I want to hide layer 2. If I click on the checkbox, it hides layer 2 as it should and clicking on it again shows layer 2. The visual condition of layer 2 is linked to the condition of the checkbox next to that layer. However, if I am active on layer 1 and then highlight layer 2 (but don't make it active), then right click and select "Hide", the object on layer 1 do disappear as you say, but the checkbox on layer 2 shows that it is hidden while the entities of that layer are not. I believe that the intent here was to hide the highlighted layer, which is why the checkbox goes to the condition it should when the layer is hidden, but for some reason active layer (which is not the highlighted layer) is what is hidden instead of the highlighted layer.

There is a bug there either way you look at it. Either the highlighted layer should be what the right click is working against and the wrong entities are being hidden, or the other possibility is that the wrong checkbox is being deactiated/activated by "Hide" or "Show". One way or the other, there is something that is not quite right. IMHO, it makes more sense that the highlighted layer is the one being modified by the right click, since there are times where I don't want to change my active layer but I want to modify one of the other layers. For example, if I'm working on a part of a drawing that is getting a bit hard to see through other layers, I may want to hide another layer, but continue drawing on the currently active layer. Obviously, using the checkbox is the easiest answer, but I think that highlighting the layer and right click + "Hide" should do the same thing, not something different. Either way, there's a bug to fix to make it consistent.

[jrmach]

You are correct that this is how it is working, but I'm not entirely sold that this is how it was meant to work. Let's say layer 1 is active, and I want to hide layer 2. If I click on the checkbox, it hides layer 2 as it should and clicking on it again shows layer 2. The visual condition of layer 2 is linked to the condition of the checkbox next to that layer. However, if I am active on layer 1 and then highlight layer 2 (but don't make it active), then right click and select "Hide", the object on layer 1 do disappear as you say, but the checkbox on layer 2 shows that it is hidden while the entities of that layer are not. I believe that the intent here was to hide the highlighted layer, which is why the checkbox goes to the condition it should when the layer is hidden, but for some reason active layer (which is not the highlighted layer) is what is hidden instead of the highlighted layer.

There is a bug there either way you look at it. Either the highlighted layer should be what the right click is working against and the wrong entities are being hidden, or the other possibility is that the wrong checkbox is being deactiated/activated by "Hide" or "Show". One way or the other, there is something that is not quite right. IMHO, it makes more sense that the highlighted layer is the one being modified by the right click, since there are times where I don't want to change my active layer but I want to modify one of the other layers. For example, if I'm working on a part of a drawing that is getting a bit hard to see through other layers, I may want to hide another layer, but continue drawing on the currently active layer. Obviously, using the checkbox is the easiest answer, but I think that highlighting the layer and right click + "Hide" should do the same thing, not something different. Either way, there's a bug to fix to make it consistent.

I was taught not to use the word "Bug"
But I concur,it is "Broke",,lol
I never noticed it before as R-Clicking was not my way.

[magicniner]

I was taught not to use the word "Bug"

A friend of mine worked for Microsoft in software testing, the team in charge of hitting release dates had the Mantra "It's Not A Bug, It's A Feature"
;-)

[Dstamp]

UPDATE: IDENTIFIED ROOT CAUSE
Thanks for all of the help, I would not have been able to work through it without you guys.
The root cause was the extended display setting when connected to a an external (Dell) monitor AND the external display is the one that Bobcad is active on.
When the external monitor is set to 'Primary Display' (when the task bar is shown on the bottom of it versus the other active displays) the selection of layers by clicking on the black/white box works properly.
When the external display is not set to 'Primary Display' AND Bobcad is active on the external display it behaves as initially described.
Moving Bobcad to the laptop display whether it is set to primary or not, allows the layer selection to work properly.
I was able to 'activate/de-activate' the problem by selecting the primary display.
Both displays are going through the NVIDIA card, regardless of which is the active one.

Thanks again for your help & Happy New Year.

Best regards,

Dstamp

[BurrMan]

I was taught not to use the word "Bug"
But I concur,it is "Broke",,lol
I never noticed it before as R-Clicking was not my way.

Yup, that's a bug!

Either the highlighted layer should be what the right click is working against and the wrong entities are being hidden, or the other possibility is that the wrong checkbox is being deactiated/activated by "Hide" or "Show". One way or the other, there is something that is not quite right. IMHO, it makes more sense that the highlighted layer is the one being modified by the right click, since there are times where I don't want to change my active layer but I want to modify one of the other layers.

I think at this point the bug is that the wrong radio is being switched. The way it's working is how it's always worked. BobCad is just raw that way, where you have to intentionally set the "active layer" or active UCS, etc., that you intend to affect.

But what you describe about "expecting" that the highlighted layer is what the users intent would be, I agree with. However, this would be a change in behavior from what has been. Some thought would need to go into it. It would change the workflow of others who have been using it for a long time. But like you point out, that may be one of those changes that would be desirable.

If you haven't reported this, I will. I would report it with the change you are describing as more desirable also....

[BurrMan]

UPDATE: IDENTIFIED ROOT CAUSE
The root cause was the extended display setting when connected to a an external (Dell) monitor AND the external display is the one that Bobcad is active on.

This is correct for your initial issue (and a little different from what we were just discussing, that came out of your initial post)

I to have the same issue you have. (You can see me struggle with it in some of my video's, because I make them on my extended, second display)

BobCad is aware of it, but it remains unresolved due to some other factors. When I first discovered it, there was only "1 other person" that could replicate it, and he worked for BobCad. We worked extensively to try and figure out a common/cause. And it remained undiscovered. (types of monitors. Driver versions. cabling. display configuration... etc... etc....

Since then ( a few years now ) you are the 2nd person I have seen with it. It does seem to be "NVidia" related, but the commonality with it, I believe is more deep rooted in the actual hardware of the cards, and a specific drivers interaction. Probably the only way to fix it would need an NVidia "partner" who can be in direct contact with the dev team over there and do some lower level testing within the NVidia system...

Anyway.....