[Hurricane21]

Happy New Year to All!

This is in response to two main threads that are circulating on CNCZone and Sawmill Creek.

First, we work very hard to provide the best quality and support in the community. There are also many other great companies out there such as Rabbit Laser, Epilog, Universal, Trotec on and on. It is this competition that is helping the entire industry to improve quality and lower costs. Free markets working the way they should.

As mentioned and admitted I did work for FSL prior to starting Hurricane Lasers. Let's just say that Henry and I had differing opinions on business practices. I did not have an non compete. I also did not have hundreds of thousands of dollars to keep fighting a frivolous lawsuit so our attorneys withdrew and therefore he won the suit. As mentioned by other viewers winning suit and collecting are two different things. Hurricane is in business and will continue to be. Perhaps I will have to pay a portion of what we make to the extent the law requires. But losing a lawsuit does not mean you have to shut your business. If it did there wouldn't be a business left in this country.

As for being what I call a Chinese box mover. We are not. We provide optics from Meller Optics here in the States vs Chinese Optics. This promotes less variance in the cuts and engraving and a longer life. We also are proud of our 2 year full warranty that covers everything including the tube. Nobody else has this. We also have a full time class room for education at no charge to our customers. And yes many people attend those classes or visit us for help when in town for fun or a trade show. So the cost of our lasers includes many aspects far beyond just the machine and these things cost money. We understand that we are making much less today than we can but we are about building a long term vision for the laser community. With almost 400 lasers delivered the past 2 years we are just beginning.

Second, every business has good and bad customers. We actually tried to deliver a laser to Gene and he refused delivery because it was a few days later than he wanted. I have offered repeatedly to deliver him a laser or refund his $10,000 as we agreed upon. His last call was he wanted a full refund or he would continue to bad mouth us on the forums etc. This is once again a public offering to Gene to take delivery of the machine as he ordered rather than continuing with his rants. If he does not want the machine sell it and buy another machine. Or just accept the $10,000 refund that has been offered. I will not be held hostage by a customer or anyone that agrees to something and then says they will badmouth me just to get what they want and did not agree to.

Thank you and Happy New Year!

John

[reflexx]

John,

I am also emailing this exact post to [email protected] and [email protected] to make sure you receive it.

Let's make this easy. You have my bank routing information. Please wire $10,000 by January 9th OR I can pick up a cashier's check (for $10,000) from you at the NBM Show in LA on Friday morning. Please let me know ASAP which you will be doing.

ROUTING INFO IN EMAIL.

If I have my "refund" by Friday, I will never speak a word about your company and stop the lawsuit. If not, we continue with the lawsuit for the full amount and sharing additional information I have found. You choose. I cannot make this any simpler.

Gene Sherman. (The "Gene" that John refers to in his post above. I guess I'm a "bad" customer?)

(email sent 4:36pm Nevada time, Tuesday January 7th)

The entire story here: http://www.cnczone.com/forums/vendor...ml#post1373604

[Bigbird48]

Its really too bad, I had given thought to actually buying a Hurricane even after this started, I'm thinkin John will resolve this and they will go on and keep their good name but this BS has dragged on so long no that if it happened to me it would literally put me in the poor house. I don't have 3or 4 K I can let somebody else use for 3 or 4 months. I don't think anything could make me buy a Hurricane now. Its sad because both Hurricane and FSL are a 5 hour drive and I could just drive over and see what they got and bring it home. I did that with FLS and you all know what happened there, and Now this with Hurricane. Don't kid yourself I'd lay odds Hurricane took that 13K of Genes and invested it in a short term bond , or a rising stock , or more machines to turn a few quick bucks on Gene's dime. All the companies use this tactic. Does anyone really think Genes money sat in the bank for 4 months?

Gessh Kaspar cut the Man a Check!!!!!!!!!

[LeeWay]

The only comments I will make is that I certainly hope you guys resolve the issues. I will also say that this is not the typical business transaction. Far from it actually. I can see both sides of the argument, but ambiguity from the start is no excuse for a lawsuit really. Both sides have blame and perhaps fault. It is a shame that it has progressed this far, but since it has, someone should give or it will be seen in a court somewhere. That means we all have to pay for it. Get it fixed, please!

[Bigbird48]

This should be interesting as Hurricane has publicly offered the 10K refund as of yesterday and now Gene has publicly accepted the 10K refund, so this should all be resolved very soon if both guys keep there word. Lets see what happens.

[Hurricane21]

Big,

Unfortunately when people threaten litigation everything changes. What would have been awesome is if Gene had accepted delivery of his laser a few days later than he was hoping to have it. He would have a laser and all would be well. If you have been in business and dealt with attorneys they always say do not handle things yourself for a reason. If send Gene a refund without an agreement he can then he continue to sue and make life miserable for us. As stated previously, hopefully the 400 + happy customers will outweigh the the few unhappy customers. Sadly most happy customers do not say anything.

Sorry that Gene hired an attorney and made this more difficult but at this point I need to make sure it is handled correctly to be done with it once and for all. If that takes some time so be it.

Thank you to CNCZone for the ability to have a public forum for the best interest of the laser community.

John

[Hurricane21]

Gene,

Thank you for the response. I have asked my attorney to review this in light of your litigation. Which by the way we have yet to receive anything on it. He is going to draft an agreement for your review to ensure that we have properly crossed the T's etc. Rather than leaving it all open ended and having further problems which I for one would love to avoid. He said he would have this to me by Monday and I will forward to you for review.

Hopefully this will all be behind us very soon.

John

[fixtureman1]

At this point I am with Bigbird about never dealing with hurricane. You could have refunded Gene his money way back but you decided to deal with a problem in a way that Makes me think that the support would be nonexistent if there was a warranty issue.

[reflexx]

John,

It is now Tuesday the 14th. I have not heard a word from you. No phone call, no email. I have no choice but to post here, because at least here you "reply." I did get your newsletter about your new small laser machine. So I know the email works.

Is this yet another delay tactic? How is this a "response to the community?"

We did send you a letter from our attorney in mid December. You claiming that you have not received it I cannot verify. I just know that we sent it.

I have given you opportunity after opportunity to make this right and you keep taking advantage of my patience. As I have said before, wire me the $10,000 you owe us and we are done. I am saying it here, publicly, on CNC Zone. We don't need to cross "T's etc.." You publicly offered the refund on the 7th, it is now the 14th. Wire transfers take ONE HOUR.

Yet again, I will be emailing this post to [email protected] and [email protected] to make sure you receive it. I did not receive any replies and I honestly don't expect to.

How much further do you want your companies reputation to go down the toilet? Let's end this. You know how. GIVE ME BACK MY MONEY!


Gene S.

[Hurricane21]

Gene,

Sorry but no this is not a stall tactic. I have a call in to him to get the letter for you. Unfortunately with threats of litigation etc from you and in light of FS laser posting crap my attorney says that we do need to cross the T's so I do not send you the 10k only to wind up in court again or with you continuing your threatened personal vendetta. Sorry that you complicated this. Please have your attorney email me the letter or provide a signed receipt etc. We have never had anything delivered to us from you or your attorney regarding your litigation. I am sure it would have been sent certified etc but an email works just as well.

Thank you.

John

[fixtureman1]

John if you write him a check and in the memo put paid in full and he signs it that is his agreement to the amount

[Bigbird48]

This is getting ridiculous John give the man back his money, there will be no legal repercussions from Gene. Everything is out in the open here, his offers your promises , You have a ton of witness's here , I'm sure if Gene ever did something he said he wouldn't we'd all go to bat for you just as we have for him. Cut the man a check and lets end this stupid stuff. Look at the hurtin your putting on your business. How many sales have you lost.

[reflexx]

One week ago, on Tuesday the 14th, I emailed John Kaspar a PDF version of the letter my attorney had sent in late November(!) His reply (the same day, in an email) was:

"Thank you. I will pass this along to my attorney to incorporate in his letter.
Hope to have this behind us soon.
John"

It is now one week later and not a word. I emailed him a reminder, but no reply. I have been in touch with several others that are having issues with Hurricane Lasers. In my opinion, this is the same bull$hit again. I just don't get it. So far, everything he says or does is the exact opposite. Is the "Hurricane Lasers response to the community" is just a delay? To swindle more money?

I'm still convinced (and so are many others) that this is a new stall tactic. We are at 4 months now.

Gene S.

[Hurricane21]

Gene,

I received your email on the 14th with your attorneys letter which I forwarded to my attorney immediately to incorporate with his letter. Tomorrow will be 7 days and of that 2 were the weekend and today is a Holiday for many of them as the courts etc are closed. So Wed - Friday as not quite as long as you make it out to be. I will bug him tomorrow to get me something.

John

[fizzissist]

Gene,

I received your email on the 14th with your attorneys letter which I forwarded to my attorney immediately to incorporate with his letter. Tomorrow will be 7 days and of that 2 were the weekend and today is a Holiday for many of them as the courts etc are closed. So Wed - Friday as not quite as long as you make it out to be. I will bug him tomorrow to get me something.
John

Good job, Hurricane!!
We all knew where you were coming from, nice to see the proof.

...... Courts closed so attorneys don't work?? Now THAT'S funny!!!

[Bigbird48]

Its been 4 fraken months John what the hell you talkin about 7 days

Gene,

I received your email on the 14th with your attorneys letter which I forwarded to my attorney immediately to incorporate with his letter. Tomorrow will be 7 days and of that 2 were the weekend and today is a Holiday for many of them as the courts etc are closed. So Wed - Friday as not quite as long as you make it out to be. I will bug him tomorrow to get me something.

John

[reflexx]

That "something" is what? A wired refund? A "something" that will drag this out even further? A letter to silence me so nobody knows what happened?

The courts? What do the courts being closed have to do with this? I've waited for 4 months!

I AM PUBLICLY STATING, ON A PUBLIC FORUM, THAT I WILL DROP THIS MATTER IF YOU REFUND MY $10,000

What more do you need? You're already keeping $3,328 pure profit for doing nothing.

GIVE ME MY REFUND!

[Hurricane21]

Bigbird,

I am not sure why you have taken such an interest in this thread. I can also provide you with at least 3 references in phoenix that love our support, service and quality. You have obviously never been involved in civil litigation, which is what this matter is, not theft. You might want to speak to attorney before ranting about things you do not know about.

Respectfully yours.

John

[fizzissist]

Bigbird,

I am not sure why you have taken such an interest in this thread. I can also provide you with at least 3 references in phoenix that love our support, service and quality. You have obviously never been involved in civil litigation, which is what this matter is, not theft. You might want to speak to attorney before ranting about things you do not know about.

Respectfully yours.

John

Well, John,
I've been involved in litigation. In Nevada as a matter of fact (unanimous decision in my favor by the Supreme Court of the State of Nevada), in addition to California, in a case that although it has been thoroughly adjudicated (by Mitchell Beckloff, btw), it remains open 2 1/2 years later.... I know about litigation, and more about the law than I care to.

.... and as a little tidbit, I got my first attorney disbarred in the State of California.

I'm following this because I think that you're full of it. There IS NO LITIGATION HERE!!!! A letter from an attorney, even threatening litigation is not litigation. A simple and prompt refund will prevent it. If you're legitimately worried about future litigation or liability, then a simple waiver is all you need. The prima facie evidence by the buyer posted here would easily suffice to get a case dismissed before it even got heard if coupled with a signed waiver.

Your buyer has already stated as much. Unless there's something included in his lawyer's communication to you not shown here...

My friend with a trophy shop has thought about a new laser.... She'll find this whole exchange interesting.

.... correction: My 1st attorney in the California case was not disbarred. He resigned so he wouldn't be disbarred.

[reflexx]

and the bull$hit continues....

John, everyone sees what your doing and you keep doing it. But I'll just keep sharing my side of the story....

You still have not replied to any of my emails and here you choose to reply to others and not me? Is this the customer service you are promising others?

So, let's (again) review your last post here for accuracy:

"Unfortunately when people threaten litigation everything changes."
What do you expect for withholding my money for months and hanging up and ignoring me, a thank you card?

"What would have been awesome is if Gene had accepted delivery of his laser a few days later than he was hoping to have it. He would have a laser and all would be well."
Yet again, you keep ignoring the issue of broken promises and ignoring me during those crucial days. AND AGAIN, it's NOT about your machines, it's about YOU, your customer no-service and your business practices.

"If you have been in business and dealt with attorneys they always say do not handle things yourself for a reason. If send Gene a refund without an agreement he can then he continue to sue and make life miserable for us."
I HAVE PUBLICLY STATED THAT I WOULD END ANY DISCUSSIONS ABOUT YOUR COMPANY AND WILL NOT PURSUE AN LEGAL ACTION! I am not like you, I keep my promises.

"As stated previously, hopefully the 400 + happy customers will outweigh the the few unhappy customers. Sadly most happy customers do not say anything."
Please John, bring them here. Have them post a pic and share some kind words. I would imagine that there are a few in that batch of 400(!?!) that would. How many years in business? Sell a machine every few days, do you? So what's the deal with refunding ONE machine purchase?

"Sorry that Gene hired an attorney and made this more difficult but at this point I need to make sure it is handled correctly to be done with it once and for all. If that takes some time so be it."
I made this more difficult? I call bull $hit again. If this is so important to you and your reputation, why are we at MONTH NUMBER FOUR?

"Thank you to CNCZone for the ability to have a public forum for the best interest of the laser community. John"
This is the one point were I DO agree with you. This post if definitely in "the best interest of the laser community." I think many are learning from my experience.

FROM YOUR POST ON JANUARY 7TH: "I have offered repeatedly to deliver him a laser or refund his $10,000 as we agreed upon." Two weeks have passed since your statement, and again, nothing..... A wire transfer takes about an hour.....

Dear John Kaspar, you keep delaying and I'll keep sharing my experience with your company. If you think that only people who post are the only ones who read this, you are very wrong.