[9fingers]

Hi,
A mate of mine has a Piranha CM1325-3 8' x 4' 3 axis router which has some electrical problems.
I'm an electronic engineer and willing to have a look but I could do with some documentation on the electrical aspects of the machine.
Can you help at all or suggest where I might be able to download circuits etc.

I've yet to see the machine but the guy tells me it does not have a PC obviously associated with it. It does have a hand held unit with a USB stick containing a g code file. So it this hand held unit a G code interpreter with low level X Y Z direction signals sent to the stepper drivers?
Some idea of the machine architecture would be helpful to read up on before I visit site.

It has both 3 phase 440v and single phase 240 volt power connections. I assume the 3 phase is just for the inverter to drive the spindle and the single phase runs the controller and steppers?

Thanks In Advance

Bob

[pricklypunter]

The Piranha is sold by Radecal in the UK if you get stuck. The 3 Phase will be for the Spindle VFD and the Single Phase will be for the controller and associated motors etc.
The DSP controller could be one of several, so a model number off the label would be good to get from your mate. The G-Code is generated on the workstation, the files are copied to a USB Thumb drive and placed into the USB Port on the DSP. After selecting the appropriate file and possibly setting a couple of parameters from the menu the job runs right from the DSP.

What is the fault description?

[9fingers]

Thanks for your helpful reply Prickly.
So is the dsp likely to be in the hand unit? (that is where the thumb drive plugs in). I'm told there is also a PCB in with the stepper drivers which my mate describes as a breakout board so this could be an alternate location for the DSP.
Where would you expect the label to identify the DSP type to be? Hand unit or on this PCB/breakout board?
I'm OK with VFDs in principle but I wonder how the DSP communicates with the VFD? It could chat on RS 232/485 or simply put out an analogue voltage into the speed control input of the VFD? Hopefully the problem won't be there.

The symptoms were originally intermittent operation fixed by kicking the case with the drivers in (yes I know!!!) and then tracked down to the door switch. Now the problem has got worse in that there appears to be no power getting to the hand unit ( eg the display does not light up) but there is power to the stepper drivers. No info on the VFD power up status.
The single phase fuse is intact ( confirmed as I now realise as the stepper drivers are being powered)

I think my first step will be to look at the source of low voltage to power the DSP and take it from there.

Very grateful for your help

Bob

[pricklypunter]

Ok, first things first. The DSP is in the hand control. Most folks just call the whole hand control the "DSP". I seriously doubt that it is faulty. This connects to a breakout board which has an on board 5V supply (derived usually from the 24V machine supply) and uses high speed opto couplers and sometimes some schimdt glue logic to couple step and direction signals to the motor driver board(s). The VFD is often controlled by a pwm circuit on the breakout board, or a daughter card on the breakout board, giving you a 0-10V analogue control voltage out to the VFD, with the VFD being set in remote mode and the appropriate links fitted etc.

There is a list of possible things, but loose connections on the various supplies and driver boards and broken wires at the strain points in the hand control wiring are common, as are loose mountings on switches

It sounds like you're missing the supply to the DSP hand control, so a cable break or bad connection is the most likely culprit, however you may have a goosed 24V power supply feeding the breakout board. The drivers receiving power will not help your breakout board or DSP much unless they share the same power supply, which is unlikely, but they will put the motors into idle braking when the power comes on, even when no signal is actually being fed to them. The machine could use a single multiple axis drive board or individual modules and power supplies, I'm not sure which way they went. Oh and the label for the DSP model info is usually stuck on the back of it along with a barcode.

Hope that helps

[Sainty]

We don't kick it, it gets a gentle nudge with the foot!

Fancy seeing you here Bob. Looks like you beat me to it!

Thanks for you assistance pricklypunter.

Stu (CNC owner and kicker of electrical hardware )

[pricklypunter]

Thanks for you assistance pricklypunter.

No problem, glad to be of some use, don't forget to update the thread with the cause and fix info so all can benefit

[9fingers]

Excellent result Prickly.:cheers:
The machine owner popped up on this thread and solved it himself!
No he did not find a different place to kick it! but instead traced the low voltage supply to the breakout board and found a loose wire and now all is well and I did not even have to visit the machine.:banana:

Bob

[pricklypunter]

Result! That's excellent news Bob, glad it's all working again matey

I guess he'll need to find something else to kick now

[9fingers]

Result! That's excellent news Bob, glad it's all working again matey

I guess he'll need to find something else to kick now

Maybe I was being a bit harsh with the kicking bit but it is a busy commercial workshop and a machine down is not only not producing work but the staff are not being 100% effective so if gentle toe manipulation solves the problem then it is probably excusable to keep the job going.

I've still got to go out there again as there is a 4-sider in trouble which we are slowly persuading into action - no electronics in that one but mysterious interlocks instead.

Cheers

Bob