[MillTurn Maniac]

Hello, I hope some of you can shed some light on an issue I am having with my employer. I am a Journeyman machinist (20yrs experience) who is also nearly finished with my bachelors in Manufacturing Engineering. I have spent my whole career in small to mid size job shops and short run production servicing primarily the aerospace and medical industries. My area of expertise is mainly in programming multi axis mill-turn machines and 4 and 5 axis milling machines. I also occasionally write code for cnc grinders. Over the years I have used multiple software packages with my main focus on NX/Unigraphics for both solid model creation (parts and fixture design) and generating G code for the machines. The company I work for has been bought out by a larger corporation who has increased our manufacturing capacity greatly over the last year(nearly double) as well as nearly doubling our sales. Currently I am under scrutiny regarding my abilities. I am the sole programmer for a shop of 62 machines running nearly two full shifts. 3/4 of the machines are twin spindle twin turret mill-turns with Y axis (9 axis) we also have 4 5 axis milling centers. I average about 15 to 20 new part numbers per month of new programs. We specialize in tough to machine "super alloys" (inconel, cobalt, titanium etc) with tight tolerance features. I have also created post processors for our CAM system for all of our different machine types. To give you an idea of our size we ship roughly $1 mil in product per month give or take. At this point due to my ever increasing workload I just sit in the office and write code, I rarely get to go out to the shop floor and "prove out" programs, there just isnt time. The scrutiny I am under stems from the fact that my programs often need "tweaking" or edits due to unexpected tool performance, finish issues, speed and feed issues, or just tools that dont work out how I invisioned. My employer has determined this to be unexceptable and that programs should be sent to the shop floor "green button ready" operators and set-up guys make no edits. I have expressed my feeling of being overwhelmed at times due to my workload combined with our newly expected lead time of 4-6 weeks from bid acceptance to shipped product (often times needing special tooling designed and/or outside surface treatments). The main response I have been given is to insunuate that I am not using my time effectively or that I am just not "up to the task". I apologize for the long post but I am very frustrated and wondering what other professionals take on my situation. Does this situation sound reasonable? They are also insinuating that if they have to bring in another programmer then I am "over paid" (my salary is in the 60's and I generally work 6 days a week at the moment, half days on Saturdays).

Whats your take guys? Should I "suck it up" or does this situation sound unreasonable. Whats a reasonable expectation for programming accuracy and creation speed?

Thanks for reading my long post, I am very interested in your responses.

[timlkallam]

I have been a cnc machinist 20 years , I have my own shop and make
a good living.
Not near the ability you have just lathes and mill no 4 and 5 axis.
I can honestly say i have never written a program by hand or with cam
i didn't have to tweet NEVER. What hes asking you to do is impossible.

It sounds to me your at the very top of the cnc programming profession.
Your boss is an idiot .If you left that company they would have a very
hard time replacing you.

If you wanted him find out your value call in sick make up an excuse
that won't get you fired and stay out of work for about a week.
Thats what it will take for you idiot boss to realize how valuable you are.
I had and employee do this to me when he came back i gave him a raise.

Tim

[davy182]

I agree with Tim. I am not in the complete same situation but my one week off should be coming up shortly.

[Tkamsker]

I agree take 10 days off and Then Start sowie ...

Gesendet von meinem SM-N9005 mit Tapatalk

[ianglover]

I program twin spindle twin turret mill/ turns and sliding heads, I have never seen a program other than very simple components that does not require 'tweaking' it does seem your boss is not an engineer, I am sure with your abilities that there will be plenty of players that will gladly employ you. A good discussion with your boss is called for, it's unacceptable to expect your program's to work with no alarms or even typos. I find even cad/cam program's need tweeting even more than the ones I write on the PC.

[scooby1doo1]

I'm just a glorified button pusher now, all our programmes are done on software. Viricut is used to check the programmes before they are loaded to the machine, but even these have faults.

Our main programmer did all the millers, other programmers do lathes/grinders/ and what not.

I'm a miller and we do need minor things editing, but this is mainly just speeds, feeds, approach moves to avoid clamps/jigs V blocks.

But even if you use the same material the speeds and feeds still may need tweaking, surely this is the operators job.

Most the programmes are for maching jobs a few hundred tonnes, so the machining time is weeks and some times months. Not sure how long they take to model and programme, but noway can he do the amount your getting through.

Our programmer programmes for 8 millers, and this is to much so now a turner is now helping out. They work 5 days a week on call if needed, but may come in on a weekend to sort anything out. But this might be a few weekends a yr at best, I really think you are a perfect case for over worked and under paid and sounds like your not valued, that's the prob with some company's they don't no what they have to it's to late.




Sent from a GS4 using tapacrap

[underthetire]

IMO, unless your in a hollow somewhere deep in the Ozarks, and considering your not pumping yourself up here, 60k for the main shop programmer is way underpaid. In any shop in this area would be almost double that for multi function machines. Taking our 20% out from high living expense here, you should still be at 6 figures. Your boss can not replace you for what he's paying you now.

sent from me

[MillTurn Maniac]

I appreciate all the replies. As I have said, I have done this for a long time so I think I should have a pretty good idea of what is realistic but I am also always interested in pushing myself to "the next level". I have been getting so frustrated lately I just wanted to bounce the situation off some other professionals in the field to make sure I'm not out of touch with what is possible or attainable. My past employers have always been happy with my performance and I even did some contract programming for a while and had fairly good results. I agree that my pay is actually a little low but my area was hit very hard during the "great recession" so my pay has yet to fully recover back to pre 2008 levels (I was forced to change employment at the worst time when my employer at that time closed). Every shop around here is begging for skilled machininst or any skilled help for that matter and finding a programmer is nearly impossible. When the "Corparate guys" flew in to town to evaluate or performance and they dragged me in "on the carpet" and impied that I am over paid and "not meeting expectations" I nearly blew a gasket.

I can run, set-up and program any machine in the shop ( and I do that occasionally on weekends when I want to test new ideas or cutting strategies) and I have chosen to continue my education at a prestigious engineering school where I have maintained the Dean's List every semester since the beginning and yet I have people who fly in once a month who rarely if ever see the shop floor criticising my performace. I think they read an article or talked to a software sales rep who told them program creation is easy and should be edit free.

I'm thinking its time I dust off my resume and reach out to some of my contacts in my area. I really wish companies would see the value in their employees, both on the floor and else where. Instead they all complain about not being able to find and keep good help.

Thanks again guys for the input.

[MillTurn Maniac]

As for "puffing myself up" I try to be very humble in regards to my abilities. Along with my programming abilities I have done contract work where through sub programs, variables, and custom macros, etc I have taken existing part families and combined up to 74 different part numbers into one main program where the scheduler could type in the part numbers and quantities to machine and the machine would run that partnumber and quantity before switching to the next one and then continue on. No seperate program selection, no uploading and downloading only job for the operators is changing tooling when prompted, loading/unloading material and checking dimensions/surface finishes. The program would also probe the stock to make sure it was the correct size and loaded on the fixture correctly. During the run the program would check for tool breakage, tool life detection and in some cases probe part features for either SPC data collection or to make tool comp offsets and automatically rerun tools if a feature was oversize/undersize. I have set up a few companies like this for near complete automation and "lights out" manufacturing. I'm by no means a "genius" but I love this stuff, its not only my work but also my hobby(thats a little sad to say lol). This is why I'm so frustrated over my current situation. I think the day is drawing near when I should attempt to start my own shop. I'm just unsure about the "business side" of things.

[m98custom1212]

I do the same thing but not that many machines.

I feel the same way they think anyone can programs these programs and the first program will blow out fairy dust and magic will come out of the unicorn.


Really, you need a pay rise into the 100's and another programmer learning from you making the same as you are now. Anyways, take two weeks off for vacation and see how that goes. I would leave my job to learn from someone like you.




"I'm thinking its time I dust off my resume and reach out to some of my contacts in my area. I really wish companies would see the value in their employees, both on the floor and else where. Instead they all complain about not being able to find and keep good help."

I hate to say but that needs to happen

[victorofga]

theres a sharp difference between machinist and operator..

operators need ""green button"" code, and better not to change anything..

machinist must test or looking trough the code before run.. even reevaluate if there a way to make better..

that's why machinist has higher wage...

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on other side there must be some agreement with your employer.. he might told it you on the front and you didn't realized what he asking actually..

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its very hard to say good advice.. one thing is sure.. to be responsible for 60 machine that's hard..

first thing you can do, measure up your ACTUAL situation..

can you find at least two another shop to paying this wage you?
because a machineshop with 2-3 machine can not squeeze out this wage..

you have an exceptional knowledge, but let me say a bad example, a woodshop couldn't use it..

first sit down with your employer and tell them machinist out in the shop has to check on code regardless who made it..

if there are operators, then other machinist can check on code.. but from desk I don't think its possible to writing a 100 percent code..

but again before you do anything... just play safe... sure you don't ending up in the unemployment office.. they don't have 60K per month for you..

[1234567]

One person programing sixty two machines? Look for a new job.