[echesak]

Howdy folks,

I'm using the 4th axis on my 1100 for the first time. I've cut air on several occasions. But I want to try machining an actual part. The part that I have in mind is a simple piece, basically 5 sides cut into a round bar. The problem is that I can't figure out how to machine it the way I want. I'm using SprutCAM 9. I can get a rough profile of what I want, using rotary machining. But for the final pass, I want it to use the side of the end mill to do the final cuts, at full width. This is how I get a good finish on my 2.5D parts (taking a 2 thou finish pass at full depth).

Does anyone know how to get Sprut to do something like this? The lines on the top would be the projected tool path. The circle would be the tool bit. So we're looking in the -Z direction. It's not a pocket, nor a plane, nor a hole...


Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Eric

[Tormachmaster]

This is what I would use selecting the bottom lines or faces and setting levels if needed. In v10 not sure if it's the same in 9? If you just cant get anything to work I can do a quick program for you just let me know.

SprutCAM 10 User Guide

[echesak]

Hi, Thanks for the reply. Did your link have a specific page in mind, as I didn't see this, as an example.

So after choosing the lines, what operation would you use? I tried something like 2D contouring, but i'm not sure how to align it with the face (the 2D path is at some angle off the face). This give me some ideas though...

[Tbkahuna]

I have done something very similar but... I tend to use the brute force method... Here is what I did (using your example). Select the series of edges that define the profile like you show in your picture and set that as the 2D profiling path with 0 stock. Pick your tool Z depth for full depth of cut and the lead in and out that you want. I would pick the side and direction to climb mill it. Copy the profile process for the number of the sides you need to do. Generate the tool path and send it to the machine. I would edit the gcode and add at the bottom of each pass a G0 Axx degrees to index it to the next rotary position. That isn't exactly what you asked about, but I do that when I want to get something done right then. All but a tiny bit of the program is generated in Sprut and I can quickly make the part. I will learn something from your thread as well.

[echesak]

OK, so based on Torchmaster's comment, I did some testing. However, I did find a few things that have to be set-up for this to run right. Since only a line is chosen, Sprut doesn't know how to align the surface to be cut, to the axis of the mill bit. So the first surface needs to be manually aligned to the z-axis, using Transform --> Rotate. Once this is done, it seems to run correctly



In this image, the blue is the lines chosen for the cut. I set up the Rough Step Parameters and the finishing parameters. But it may also be better to rough this out, using one of the Rotary machining operations and finish with a 2D Contour.

I found another situation that might create come complications. It's a part like this, with a little shelf.



In a part like this, choose a 2D line, in an oblique view is impossible, along the plateau, on the left. But what I did is to view the part looking in the -Z direction and then choose the 2D lines. In this case, it took a couple different operations to get it completed. But it too worked out fine. Here's the first operation. You'll notice that the 2D lines are also on the top of the part. As long as the parameters are set, it doesn't seem to matter whether the top or bottom is chosen.



And the second operation.



And the result



That clue from Torchmaster was the key to getting this rolling. After this, it's clear that the operations are just like machining in 2D, with 2D contouring. Next is to give it a try. Maybe I'll give it a go this weekend.

[echesak]

Sorry, I'm not sure why the images are showing up as attachments, instead of being viewable in the thread...

Edit - Got it fixed.

[echesak]

Also, here's a shot of the lines, as I chose them for this operation:

[luv2ride]

I use sprutcam 7 but when I do something like this I select the line and then in the menu window that's open during machining (not the pop out menu) I adjust the a axis to whatever the rotational axis is i.e. 60, 120, 180... For a six sided figure. Same as others use top and bottom plane and other parameters as usual. Hope that's not too confusing.

[echesak]

I'm not sure I follow completely, but I do remember seeing someplace to adjust the rotation angle. I can take a look at this. I just need to try to remember where I saw it. .

It seems that these simple parts are not to difficult to program. But the part that I'm actually trying to machine is not cooperating in the same manner. It doesn't like some of the lines that I'm choosing for the 2D contour and thus, Sprut generates some strange tool paths (loops and such). I need to spend some time understanding why this is happening. I should have some time to look at this again later today.

Has anyone used a different technique than 2D contouring for an operation like this?

Thanks...

[sin_arms]

I've done some 4th axis work very similar to that, I couldn't figure it out easily so I wrote the code by hand, turned out really good. Not the answer you are looking for but it's a basic part and all you are doing is indexing so writing by hand might be an easy way to go.

[echesak]

I suppose that's an option, though I've never written anything from scratch. I probably need to get a little more versed in G-code, as doing things manually could be a real time saver. There are some projects where I'll spend far too long trying to figure out SprutCAM. In some instances, I could have machined the part manually faster. But I spend the time in Sprut, as I want to learn it's secrets.

Thanks for the alternate path option...

[luv2ride]

I'll try and get some screenshots tonight for you. If not you can send the file and I can try to work it out.

[luv2ride]

Here are some shots of a recent part that I am working on. You can see the relationship between the WCS and the degree of rotation in the 4th. The blue circles show that. The orange arrows either the edges or faces I used to cut and you can see the top and bottom levels I think. Look for the red circle and you will see where I put the angle for positioning the face. This is all in Sprut7 but hopefully it helps give you another perspective.

[Tormachmaster]

You have this part done right?

[echesak]

Seems pretty straightforward. That's really useful info, on the A_axis rotary angle.

I've done a couple programs in Sprut (9), that are drilled holes, around a 4th axis part. With these, Sprut figures out what angle to rotate the part, as I never input any angles. But this is the first for actually machining something. I made some modifications on my part, so I can select one 2D path.

The main place where I encounter problems is when there is a little shelf on the part, where there is not a continuous 2D path, or the 2D path extends into the part itself. I can get by with multiple tool paths, as long as I'm very careful about how they overlap to one another. But in some cases it's just generates looping or other strange tool paths. I'll post some more photos, when I get this worked out.

Thanks for the info.

Eric

[mountaindew]

Wanting some advise on 4th axis for 1100 from users. What Models do you think are best supported in PP and sprutcam - post?
If you were to buy new unit what would you get?
Was going sbl15 direction for while, but decided to learn and work more with mill and a 4th axis. See if I can figure out why so many cam programs are proud of this function
Any insights to models, accessories and sprut usability would be great!
M

[RoketRdr]

Wanting some advise on 4th axis for 1100 from users. What Models do you think are best supported in PP and sprutcam - post?
If you were to buy new unit what would you get?
Was going sbl15 direction for while, but decided to learn and work more with mill and a 4th axis. See if I can figure out why so many cam programs are proud of this function
Any insights to models, accessories and sprut usability would be great!
M

Personally I'm looking at getting the InTurn Mega 4th axis since the inventor has already worked out getting it to function with the Tormach. He even created a pendant for manually controlling as well. It's able to do 4th axis indexing as well as continuous turning for lathe ops.

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[lens42]

Do you have a link for "Turn Mega" 4th axis? It seemed to stump Google.


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[RoketRdr]

Do you have a link for "Turn Mega" 4th axis? It seemed to stump Google.


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WebPageMain. And look up Simpsons36 on Youtube to see vids. It's pricey but an awesome piece of equipment ready to run on the Tormach. There's also a few threads out there on the engineering behind it. Success! Mini Machining Center under Mach3 control - Video link

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[Tormachmaster]

Wanting some advise on 4th axis for 1100 from users. What Models do you think are best supported in PP and sprutcam - post?
If you were to buy new unit what would you get?
Was going sbl15 direction for while, but decided to learn and work more with mill and a 4th axis. See if I can figure out why so many cam programs are proud of this function
Any insights to models, accessories and sprut usability would be great!
M

I simply bought a 8" super indexer for the solid platform and made a adapter for the Tormach stepper motor 4th axis kit and I can say it is the most robust unit with a simple backlash adjustment and is dead on accurite. I could not be happier now it does take a lot of room and is very heavy but have had it for years with zero issues and you can hog on it with no worries. Very solid unit. Total cost was around a grand.