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IndustryArena Forum > CAM Software > Mastercam > Need to decide on new CAM software package...
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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    178

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    I use Mastercam for everything except 4 th axis work, and for that I use OneCNC which does 4th axis so well, and easily, with a great visualation too! I suppose it's pretty good for all the flat work, it has some good toolpaths that are easy to configure, I'm just so used to MCam I tend to stick with it. I also have a VF3 Haas with a 4th axis. If you're ever going to do 4th axis work, look at OneCNC. I always talk to Patrick at OneCNC west. The best support of any cam package I've ever seen!

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    424

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    Quote Originally Posted by sirgreggins View Post
    I just wanted to add my 2 cents. I use Autodesk Fusion 360 right now and I love it. Everything from simple parts with holes, pockets, contours, facing, etc. 3D toolpaths have also worked fine for me. It took some time but I'm making parts and that's what counts. I should have an opportunity to learn Mastercam soon and have a demo version to play with. It's a very capable piece of software but it's not intuitive IMO and a bit cumbersome. After I have some real experience with it I can do a true comparison. The fact that Fusion 360 is free for hobbyists and even businesses up to $100K revenue which is HUGE for me. Fusion 360 has 5th axis capabilities now and it's being worked on everyday. I won't tell you to go with one over the other. Thats a decision only you can make. For me, its fusion 360. But that could change after I get familiar with Mastercam. It's just much more cumbersome to start IMO.

    I agree completely. Very cumbersome. It works but it makes me feel like I'm litterally not smart enough or good enough to use it properly or well. If you want to invest a lot of money in training, a lot of mental effort for weeks months and years, and to struggle with un-ending, horrible feelings of personal inadequacy as you get some quality work done, Mastercam has totally done that for me. I don't have experience with other programs to know what the golden star in CAM is, but I wish I knew what it was because I would love to use a program that let me feel comfortable with my life, and that I felt confident in.

    Mastercam gives me the feeling that what CNC needs in the world is a solution to CAM, not a better or more capable machine. Capable machines are everywhere. Capable and well thought out CAM is difficult or impossible to find.

    I did invest a week of my life in Topsolid and paid $2000 for training and was prepared to pay $38,000 for a better solution, but at the end of that, I felt that Topsolid had some serious advantages and more serious disadvantages to Mastercam and I had problems with installing (getting it to run in Windows), and with toolpathing (I was unable to get toolpath) on a simple Y axis part in Topsolid (I was, as far as I know, doing everything right, but it was not posting toolpath). Topsolid had awesome CAD compared to Mastercam, but I needed it to solve WCS issues, solid toolpathing issues, and to be better and easier to work with for toolpathing than mastercam and that didn't happen.

    In mastercam the WCS is not something explained by mastercam. Many operations require 2 planes in a specific format and this is a source of many issues. The posts don't know what the machine can or can't do, so you have to constantly drive that with WCS input using a tool that I don't perfectly grasp. Stock relativity isn't automatic so that can produce code that isn't efficient or make you struggle with telling the software what you want done. On the multi-axis side you just have to be a straight up savant to drive toolpathing- and the program can do it but there might be 50-100 people in the USA who can actually drive it reliably, so the rest of the people are paying for it so they can do 2D dynamic milling. In multi-axis, a solid surface may have to be depicted using a surface mesh or something, in short it is the extra steps that mastercam needs for prep that are the hardest functions of mastercam that most limit its capabilities.

    Mastercam is like a keep in memory game where someone wants you to memorize an entire set of encyclopedias. It makes you feel like there literally isn't enough space in your head to keep the information there.

    I've seen Titan show one part that would have been totally impossible in Mastercam. I think they use Fusion 360 or the multiaxis version of that. That was a 3D part on a multiaxis lathe- AKA a 3D part wrapped around the C axis. Granted I don't know how people learn that product, or how easy that was to program, so it's kind of like an unknown.

    Training for mastercam is a minimum of $1000 a day, and if you wanted to support a machine shop ( a typical shop with multiaxis mills, multiaxis lathes, and EDM machines), you would adequately be trained by 40-60 days of training. That's $40-60K and your time which is probably also valuable. So CAM might be the largest investment you make if you do it right which you may or may not even have time or money for. There is a point where you become terrified of spending thousands of dollars a week and not absorbing information. If you didn't grasp it you just paid for ZERO.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    32

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    CAMWorks all the way! I've used BobCad, SurfCam, and MasterCam and nothing compares to CAMWorks for me.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    81

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    Have you guys tried Esprit? I've programmed just about every type of machine with Esprit and it works awesome for 4th axis, HMC's, Mill turn lathes, Swiss, EDM, etc. I think it depends on what you work with and get used too.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    424

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    Quote Originally Posted by cbr_speedster View Post
    Have you guys tried Esprit? I've programmed just about every type of machine with Esprit and it works awesome for 4th axis, HMC's, Mill turn lathes, Swiss, EDM, etc. I think it depends on what you work with and get used too.
    I have not tried Esprit, but I've heard great things. The most professional turning shop I know uses Esprit, they said the learning curve was a little intense, but that the software allows them to program triple turret machines with quality and speed. Consensus was Esprit was rock solid for mill turn.

    Compare that to mastercam, and mastercam Mill-Turn part handling is not posting good code for me- it doesn't really have a grasp of the Doosan TT1800SY personality (air blow sequences and the various unlock and cancel codes that have to be posted to make the machine code run), the chucks and holders aren't correct so machine kinematics are totally defective and disabled, the part eject is not simulated, and the wait codes are cumbersome and I don't use those either. They do token handling of some stuff you will almost always want to be handled the same. If I have to turn on coolant of various kinds on every operation, I'll just do that in CIMCO. I would much rather have default strategies in place. My machine has bed wash, high pressure on two sides, and high pressure through spindle on the sub- that's a lot of coolant alone to dick around with. Mill-turn doesn't support load monitoring so that's a lot of created CIMCO work.

    I would ask Esprit if they can take your code and produce part handling customization with that. Part handling and part ejects seem to be the largest shortcoming of various softwares, and you will never post code straight to a machine without the software being able to easily handle part handling and ejects.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    3

    Re: Need to decide on new CAM software package...

    OKAY, FOR ALL YOU NOOBS OUT THERE!!!
    i was many years a go, not more than a decade, new to this and was searching the world for info to direct me.
    Gibbs
    Esprit
    Edgecam
    Featurecam
    Camworks
    SolidCAM
    Mastercam
    DONT buy them right of the rip.
    Get demos and play with them, watch videos and tutorials on how its made.
    Gibbs is basic and quick but not complex.
    Solidcam is tedious
    Mastercam is very expensive and cumbersome mammoth like but works alright.
    Featurecam is fast and tricky( but still great)
    Camworks is fun and dynamic
    Esprit is flexible and neat
    Edgecam is solid and deep.

    If I had an option to pick again I will go with camworks, featurecam or edgecam.

    You pick yours.

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