[bonesbr549]

Ok, got the upgrade all done and while checking tramming my spindle was off on the x travel by .002. I used the edge tramming guide and zero'd the lateral travel to dead on thanks to the tramming plate nut and a slow tightening of all the bolts

I then repeated the steps for the Y travel on the gantry as outlined in the edge manual, and found that its off a hair under or a needle off .001. To adjust that means loosening all the gantry bolts and trying to tilt it get it perfect.

My gut says thats not going to be easy and in fact I may wind up with that off by more. What say you have you found that you get it perfect dead on or is .001 acceptable. I'm kinda anal on that kinda stuff but wonder if its really going to be necessary.

[awerby]

What tolerances are you working to? Given that this is posted in a router forum, a thousandth or two of imprecision shouldn't be a big deal. If you're making things out of wood, variations in humidity will cause the things you make to expand or shrink a lot more than that. And I'm sure other losses of accuracy elsewhere in the machining process - tool deflection, backlash, microstep error, etc. are larger than that as well. I'd call it done.

[ger21]

Are you off like .001" at 2-3" away from the spindle centerline? If so, there's no way you'd ever notice that.

[Goonk]

Ha! Wow, I just started checking mine over the weekend and was excited that it was less than 0.010" out! I did a little shimming and have gotten closer, but I think I can get it better than where it is at (ran outta weekend). One thing I noticed is that just removing things and putting them back can change things a thou or two. I'm shooting for about 5 side to side (using an indicator on an arm). That will be plenty close for anything I will ever do. Oh, my machine is a Standard and I'm using a Bosch router. I have no idea how much the router is out either. Need to check that out of curiosity. I try to mount it in the same position each time. I'm not that patient. Close enough gets bigger after each assembly and adjustment! I'm using ~0.003 shims at this point - nothing drastic. Still not bad right out of the box though.

Tony

[bonesbr549]

Thanks feel much better now

[Goonk]

Glad to help!

For reference, I am using a TS ALigner tool that I bought years ago for my tablesaw. It has a 1/2" bar connected to an alumium extrusion that holds the indicator. The bar (rod I guess) is around 6" long an the extrusion is close to that. I have the rod chucked into the router (using a precision collet). I rotate the setup and record the readings at each 90° point. I just surfaced my new spillboard over the weekend. Along X (my 48" axis - two rails), I am within a thou or two. Across the gantry (my Y), I am still about 0.008 from side to side (180°). I haven't put much thought into it yet, but I guess that says I am around 0.008" over 10" or so. Not terrible, but the 0.0025 shim made a positive difference, so I think I can add a little more and get closer. I was going lay all of this out in CAD and figure angles and such, but it is really easier to add the shims and see what happens.

I surfaced the spillboard with a 1.5" insert bit with a 40% stepover. Along the X axis, it looks perfect, but along the Y, I can see and feel small steps. I'm still learning all this stuff, but it apears to me that if things are aligned better, you can make the stepover smaller and save milling time? Most of what I have done so far is fairly small and the surfaces have been pretty nice using the default stepover in VCarve,so I've been happy.

Tony

[nlancaster]

I built a 12in tramming gauge with 2 dial inidcators. Mine is trammed to with int .004 over 12 inches. Is that too close?

[Goonk]

Yeah, that's way too good...quit your bragging! Well, mine actually got worse last night. I had added a 0.0025 shim to the bottom pin the other night and I thought that got rid of some of the issue, so I added a little more. That's when things went nuts. I added a 0.005 and then I was off around 0.020! Then the Z slipped down a little so I couldn't get the indicator holder out of the router, cut my finger open on the shim on the mounting bracket when I was trying to push the Z carriage back up....yeah, one of those nights. Then it was too late to do anything and I was not in the right frame of mind anyway. I did remove the last shim so I could start over. The X is still good, so at least I have that! Frustrating! And now I'm concerned that my Z carriage os too loose.....again! I should have never started looking! I have a project in the shop that I'm finishing, so I couldn't make dust...that's when I decided to start tweaking....never should have done it!

Tony

[nlancaster]

Btw, this is the process I used to tram my spindle to the table.

https://youtu.be/DmuipSuDNAs

[LeeWay]

While those dual gauge setups are nice, they aren't required really. You can bend a rod with two bends in it. Insert one end in the spindle. Then you can sweep the other end. Check under the low spots with feeler gauges, layers of paper etc. When you get within the thickness of a sheet of paper, .003", then I would call it good enough. However if you want to keep going, then resurface the table at that point and start again.
The glass is a nice touch.

[Goonk]

I had better luck last night. After a couple of runs of shims, I figured out that something was not right. I think the router mount was moving when I tightened the bolts. So, I decided to start over...no shims and pressed reall hard while tightening. Wow, that resulted in just a few thou all the way around, so I am done.

I am using glass but with no shims. I use a large flat tip on my indicator. I couldn't tell any difference between the glass and the mdf readings. Also checked the runout of my router....it was around 0.001 or 0.002, so no issues there, thankfully. That's a Bosch 1617, btw.

So, I'm good for now. Still concerned about the Z not being tight enough. I took it all apart and re-tightened once already. It was dropping down on its own after I powered off before. We'll see what happens. I'm getting tired of tweaking the tool and and ready to use it more! I probably should have never looked! Ha!

[nlancaster]

What z-axis do you have? Is it the ballscrew version? maybe add a brake for when the machine is off?

[dgage]

What z-axis do you have? Is it the ballscrew version? maybe add a brake for when the machine is off?

What sort of brake are you referring to? Would something like this work - Energise to Release Electromagnet from Eclipse Magnetics

[nlancaster]

no, i was refering to a servo brake. Z-axis with servo, or heavy z-axis with steppers, when using a ballscrew can wind them selves down just based on the weight of the z-axis. I seem to recall a thread somewhere in the CNCRouterparts section talking about the z-axis drifting down after power off. The brake attaches to the z-axis stepper/servo and when the machine is powered off it brakes the screw to keep the z-axis from falling down.

[dgage]

Thanks. I doubt I will have that issue since I have the Pro linear bearing with CNCRP spindle but you have piqued my interest. Do you have a link to a servo brake so I could learn more about it? Thanks.

David

[ger21]

You can buy servos with integral brakes.

[LeeWay]

The simple solution is to just add a cam lock or latch on it. A simple hook on a swivel mounted on the side of the axis. Then when the axis is fully up, latch it over a stud. That would prevent any dropping down. If you forget to unlatch it, you will simply stall the stepper. Let the hook hang freely during cutting and there is no chance it will latch by itself.
Something like these or make your own.
Latch Hooks - Sea-Dog Brass - Hooks & Eyes - Cabin & Interior - Downwind Marine

[Goonk]

I had that issue and posted about it recently. The guys at CNCRP told me to go over everything and clamp the Z carriage down real good and tighten it up. That seemed to fix it. But, while I was tramming last week, I noticed it moved a little too easy and I thought it came back down after I manually raised it once or twice. I sure hate to take it all apart again. I'll see how it goes. The bearings that ride on the face of the bar are easy to tighten, but the bearings on the edge are not.. i wasn't seeing any issues, so maybe it is ok.

Tony