[stude8]

I don't know if anyone can answer this question. I remember seeing the M code in a "secret Okuma" notebook. Does anyone know the code for an Okuma with a 3000 control that allows the turret to index Off the home position on the fly? We do this with our newer Okumas all the time, but years ago it was impossible without this secret code only used on a 3000.
Ex: G0X20.Z20.M?T20202
A pizza if you can tell me!

[rswdew]

Just throw the T code in there

G0X20.Z20. THE

Are you talking about staging the next tool while the current tool is running?

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[rswdew]

Oops...G0X20.Z20. T20
Stupid auto correct!

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[underthetire]

As far as I know on the early controls, index on the fly was part of cyc!e time reduction option.

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[stude8]

I'll try to explain better. Let me preface that this is an unsafe practice but I know there a code for it.
Machine would be a 2 axis LC-20/30/40.
First 2 tools are a CNMG rough and Dnmg finish tool right next to each other. (older machines are not bi directional) Those 2 tools I only want to retract .1 for index. Ok now the next tool is a 6 inch long drill. Whoops if I index there it will crash. Hence I have to set the #3 Z axis parameter way back to safely index. But then the index of the turning tools is way back in the Z and that is cycle time.

It could have been called "cycle time reduction option" but even Dayton had no idea what I was talking about.

[rswdew]

Ahhh you're talking lathese...I'm a mill guy.

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[Algirdas]

M66. it is an option.

[stude8]

If I'm not mistaken M65 and M66 is used on a 5000 control machine that has the option. It can not be used on a 3000 machine. Just for kicks I did try it on 6 of my machines and got the 2040 alarm. No such M code.
I wish I could find the document on the code.
If I have some time I could just input every 2 digit code that isn't in the manual till I find it!

[fordav11]

it is M66
it's an option called Cycle Time Reduction. It is explained in the manual.
Look at the datacard for your machines and you'll see if it has it.
If M66 is not accepted then you simply don't have the option. The End.

If you want the machine to index closer change the variable limits so the turret clears a minimum amount in all positions.
Also you don't have to go back to both X and Z limits, the machine will index as long as it is at one of the limits. So you could do something like G00 X50 Z1 and it will index there.

[stude8]

Fordav11 with all due respect I believe what you say is true for later machines ie 5000 controls forward. The older 3000 control machine manuals do not have any cycle reduction mention at all. The only options loaded by executive tapes were decimal point, A (angle function), G75, and G76. There may be others, but those are all I know about. I never saw a data card on any of our machines. I will keep looking for the documentation, but 35 years is a long time to keep stuff.
I do agree with the indexing positions you mentioned. Just trying to index on the fly.

[fordav11]

ah. 3000. oops missed that! I was thinking OSP-300 ;-)
so your control is old old old crap. ok....
I have a small OSP-3000 doc here. see the attached. read page 6 STROKE END......

[deadlykitten]

Does anyone know the code for an Okuma with a 3000 control that allows the turret to index Off the home position on the fly? We do this with our newer Okumas all the time, but years ago it was impossible

hy! a bit late, i know i just found this

if by "on the fly" you reffer to start indexing @ random position, while :
... turret is static - case 1
... turret is moving, thus ignoring T answer - case 2

syntaxes for osp300 may be something like this :
... case 1
......... case 2 without M65
... case 2
......... G0 X... Z... M63 T... M66 M65 , or
......... G0 X... Z... M63 G97 S... M42 M03 M08 T... M66 M65

about case 2, i don't recomended it, because :

1) you must be sure that turret can rotate 360 at [ X... Z... ], because indexing may ocure after the linear movement perfomed, as whell as before or during, depending on reaction time and linear movement duration; this means that you should consider the safe position not before the line that contains M66, but after, and in this case why use the M65 ? another variant would be using a linear movement long enough to be sure that indexing is done until 1/4 ... 1/2 of the linear movement occured, but this lead to far safe position, so you gain time because of the ctr, and you lose it because safe positions are too far

2) turret indexing is not dynamically repeatable, thus there are different shocks when indexing to same tool; this shocks are pretty big on a full turret, not to mention heavy tools; thus, when you add turret index inertia over turret linear movement inertia, result is a shock during non cutting, greater than the ( closer to ) forces during cutting

ctr is fast to setup; most time gain comes from good fixtures, special tools & holders, fast cutting specs ( generally bigger feeds ), etc; this enumaration takes time to implement, much more time than ctr

i said all this because "you do this on newer okuma all the time" most of the time do you craft uniques / low series or bigger series ?

so, if you are crafting small series, how do you declare the turret position before using the ctr codes ? do you use M65 or M66 ? kindly !

[stude8]

hy! a bit late, i know i just found this

if by "on the fly" you reffer to start indexing @ random position, while :
... turret is static - case 1
... turret is moving, thus ignoring T answer - case 2

syntaxes for osp300 may be something like this :
... case 1
......... case 2 without M65
... case 2
......... G0 X... Z... M63 T... M66 M65 , or
......... G0 X... Z... M63 G97 S... M42 M03 M08 T... M66 M65

about case 2, i don't recomended it, because :

1) you must be sure that turret can rotate 360 at [ X... Z... ], because indexing may ocure after the linear movement perfomed, as whell as before or during, depending on reaction time and linear movement duration; this means that you should consider the safe position not before the line that contains M66, but after, and in this case why use the M65 ? another variant would be using a linear movement long enough to be sure that indexing is done until 1/4 ... 1/2 of the linear movement occured, but this lead to far safe position, so you gain time because of the ctr, and you lose it because safe positions are too far

2) turret indexing is not dynamically repeatable, thus there are different shocks when indexing to same tool; this shocks are pretty big on a full turret, not to mention heavy tools; thus, when you add turret index inertia over turret linear movement inertia, result is a shock during non cutting, greater than the ( closer to ) forces during cutting

ctr is fast to setup; most time gain comes from good fixtures, special tools & holders, fast cutting specs ( generally bigger feeds ), etc; this enumaration takes time to implement, much more time than ctr

i said all this because "you do this on newer okuma all the time" most of the time do you craft uniques / low series or bigger series ?

so, if you are crafting small series, how do you declare the turret position before using the ctr codes ? do you use M65 or M66 ? kindly !

Thank you for your detailed answer however I'm referring to OSP 3000 controls such are found on 1980 model years.

I had a document from that era which explains what I'm asking. That is to index the turret as it's moving away from the part. Yes you do have to know what you're doing or bad things can happen. This is the reason Okuma says they have no knowledge of the G or M codes. I know the document exists but in the 30 years I've lost it. Maybe I should offer a reward!!:

[deadlykitten]

Thank you for your ... Maybe I should offer a reward!!

hy i posted today a thread, and i saw yours in the "similar threads list"

i know that u need infos on osp3000, not 300, but i did not replied from that perspective, but because you said "we do this with our newer Okumas all the time", and i was curios about what would you mean by "on the fly"

there are some tricks when "on the fly" is when "leaving from safe position to operation clearance" and other tricks, somehow similar, when "on the fly" is when "going to safe position"

so i was curios about "tricks", so to say if you don't mind : old dogs, new tricks

...or bad things can happen. This is the reason Okuma says they have no knowledge of the G or M codes.

i am not sure about that ...

generally local dealers are a bit unexperienced and maybe this seems vintage for them, but try contacting Okuma's tech centers ... all of them ? i would call

while i was writing an answer i saw that this thread is from 2014, but i did not wanna erase what i wrote, so i continued also i though that you solved this meanwhile, but ... kindly !

[bruno72]

Hey, i just wanted to get in on this..

Why would you even use the G-codes to provide extra options for indexing?

Normally from the 5000 and forward (haven't used the 3000 etc.), there's a STROKE END LIMIT in the sys parameteres, controlling the outer positions of the turret. Besides this, you just modify the VARIABLE END LIMIT to accommodate the outer turret position and thereby indexing position on the turret. If the VEL limit is set correctly (leaving enough room for the longest tool in the turret to not hit the front of your workpiece, you'd just go like this:

G00 X800 Z800
G96 M03 S200 T0X0X0X M08 M42 X? Z?
(PROGRAM)

The turret will automatically return to the VAE limits and perform the indexing and then return to the position where'd you like your program to start..

Indexing "on the fly" is not recommended and is a big NO-NO

[deadlykitten]

hy bruno welcome to the tribe

[bruno72]

Thx buddy!

I'm having a hard time finding a comfortable place in this forum. I've been working with the 5000 and U100 controls for years, and most of the questions + answers in here seem really awkward and not very well balanced.

Me, myself use a lot of spare time developing coordinate-specific macros for these controls, that can ease the day-to-day programming for canned cyclus and contour work; however I don't see, that that's what's really needed in this forum..

Am I just lost, or do I have to keep searching??

/bruno

[deadlykitten]

hello again mr Bruno

Me, myself use a lot of spare time developing coordinate-specific macros for these controls, that can ease the day-to-day programming

Very nice of you there are some guys arround here that also develop things in their own way stay arround and you will see

however I don't see, that that's what's really needed in this forum...

no no, is needed, trust me ... each thread in this forum is started mainly because someone :
... needed an answer ( like this thread )
... is sharing something

you can check the main idea of each thread in the 1st post also, some threads may develop in other directions

questions + answers in here seem really awkward and not very well balanced

depends who is asking and who is answering for example :
... if 2 guys know each other's skills, than discussion is pretty short
... if an experimented users reply to a new guy, than he may not have time covering all newbies question, and so on

Am I just lost, or do I have to keep searching??

... well depends what you wish to do

look, if you wanna share some procedures, just open a thread and put them there it may help others, and as well it may get analized by veterans

i have done that recently here, sharing stuff for osp3oo : http://www.cnczone.com/forums/okuma/...dures-use.html

one of the best / most experimented users also shared something in it kindly !

[stude8]

Deadly Kitten....Sorry but it's not a 300 control. We have those too and what you say is correct. I'm talking about earlier 3000 controls.

It was confirmed to me recently that it is possible to index the turret as it is traversing in the X, Z.or XZ axis. It does not have to be on the parameter limits. When a machine was purchased back then a release from damages had to signed by the buyer with Okuma. The machines are equipped with this capability. The trouble is everyone has forgotten what the G or M code is! I'm still trying to find out,

[deadlykitten]

everyone has forgotten what the G or M code is! I'm still trying to find out

... trip to Japan ?

---

or trials ? is easy if only one code is required ... if 2 or more, than combinations : etc * etc ^ 2

it may be a M code, rather than a G