584,802 active members*
5,071 visitors online*
Register for free
Login

Thread: Kira VTC 30

Page 6 of 7 4567
Results 101 to 120 of 133
  1. #101
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    314

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Quote Originally Posted by m1n1m View Post
    I need a new face mill of some sort. Not going to spend crazy amounts if I don't need to. Is there any recommended flycutter or facemill that is light on the machine? I'm running it off a 16A circuit (should be 32A) so I can't put full 3.6kW load on the spindle without risking to trip the fuse. Tripping the fuse will for sure ruin the endmill/facemill since Z drops a couple of mm at power down.
    I am partial to the Sandvik 245, I think it is a fantastic facemill for all around use. It is not inexpensive though.
    I have tried many other brands and configurations, none work as well as that one.
    Your power consumption would be in relation to
    1 number of teeth engaged
    2 depth of cut
    3 cutter diameter
    4 material
    5 cutter geometry
    6 cut direction
    (not in any order)

    So if you want to use a tool that leaves a good finish and has good life for a given material. You can reduce/change the other parameters

    a 2.5 inch diameter is a good size for 30 taper

  2. #102
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Sandvik 245 looks awesome but it was pricey Will def consider it! Now the new Fanuc OM-C controller prolly will arrive tomorrow so yesterday I made a scallop post of 500kB (25000 lines) that was supposed to machine in 1min 20sec. This is way more than the OMate control are capable of doing over DNC and most likely more than OM-C can do also. The purpose was to time the operation and observe the moves and to quantify the improvement. The Mate used 16 minutes to complete this job and it was stuttering as it moved due to beeing over the machines limit. It completed but if I milled in alu it wouldn't look great when it makes so many stuttering moves. Time will tell if the OM-C can improve this time and maybe even make it go kinda smooth. It's just a test anyways.. I won't be doing 3d surface work at 2500mm/min normally with it. Today I will pull the latest backups and remove the OMate control from my system making it ready to drop in OM-C when it arrives. I also tested rigid tapping. It works but the Fusion 360 post processor is throwing in a S500 M3 after the tool change. On rigid tapping it specifies in the manual that speed should only be commanded in M29 so I will have to figure out a way to rewrite post so it sets speed to zero. Since the S code is modal I assume it won't help that I just remove the S500 manually since speed is often commanded earlier on a job. Going to google it a bit later on.

  3. #103
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    314

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    I dont think this will help on the mate, but it looks to me as you might make use of it on your OMC. Fanuc HSM G08/G05.1 settings will your old eproms go right into the new control?

  4. #104
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    I've seen this but I'm not sure I can make post to work with it and programming it manually will be a PITA. It has to be activated/deactiveted often through the code from what I've read.

    I'm reusing the ladder but PMC is new. Getting help from a nice guy in here that flashed the PMC and servo eproms with proper software before shipping off the unit to me.

  5. #105
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Short update after yesterday’s retrofit. The OM-C went straight in, I had some servo whine but letting the 8X04 value sort it self according to motor type made it go away. Dnc speed increased from 16minutes to 11minutes on my stresstest so it’s a lot faster. Prolly hitting the lookahead buffer limit. I also made myself a quick macro b toolchange macro to confirm that this is now working. 128kb/320m memory also Now activates as it should. Will be back with some pictures and more explaining later.

  6. #106
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    The BT30 holder now machined on the new OM-C controller. It works a lot better than I thought from the synthetic scallop test. I don't have coolant yet so when I did the pocket without clearing chips with compressed air I got chip welding.. I managed to stop the machine before it went south, cleared off and started blowing away chips manually. Some pictures and a movie here. All this is milled with 5 tool changes and in one gkode file generated in fusion 360. Will try to post some info on the upgrade later this week for those interested in doing a upgrade like this.

    I'm going to order some coolant now on mondays but I'm green here.. I've heard a lot of good things about Blaser lube and I wanted to go with Blaser Balsocut 2000 at first then a friend of mine ordered Blaser B-cool 755. On paper this looks much better and has no chlorine. Can I go wrong with any of these? Do I also need some cleaner for the machine and a Jetmixer? The jetmixer from blazer costed about as much as 50liter of coolant so if I can do without I would prefer that..




    https://youtu.be/jMe5I39Ug7k

  7. #107
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Time for a update again. Still didn't have time to do a post on the OM-C upgrade.. Been using all my time off work on other things like the following pics and posts will tell :P

    As a follow up to the BT holder I was making I managed to screw up the orientation when fixing the piece to the vice so the chamfer was a bit on the heavy side I ended up facemilling the bottom off flat so the piece wasn't wasted and I have learned how I should not do things


    And then I decided to go for flood coolant. Since I have postponed the roof building many times I kinda had to get going now since there would be no space to build on later if I had a big coolant tank fitted at the rear of the machine. I raised it a bit up from 2.4meters and isolated it with some 5 and 10 centimeter insulation. After all was fitted I had my little helper join me painting it white. Still not done with the organisation of it but it's getting there



    And it's easter in the workshop
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_1976.jpg  

  8. #108
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    And more coolant preparation pics. The old tray was nasty stuff! I cleaned out as much as I could with chemical gloves by hand, cleaned it with rags and then soaked the thing in industrial cleaner before high pressure washing. This old coolant/oil mix was pretty hard to get off.. Wish I had a steamer!


    I found this nice thing behind a lot of dirt. It was completely covered in dirt so I didn't even realize what it was. Thought it was a cool thing to get back into shape so I spent some extra time cleaning it out.


    There was a leak from where the coolant ran off the machine and into the tray so I took it off, straightened the metal out so it had a better mounting surface and added some Tec7 sealent. No clue if it will hold up to the coolant but it was one of the more heavy sealants I had lying around ^^


    And like everything else on this machine there is a lot of small details that has not been looked after in the past. One of the bolts was snapped off on the motor coupling house on the coolant pump. There was a clear air gap between the motor and the housing so moisture will come in that way for sure if exposed. The bolt came out fairly easy so I replaced it with a new one and put sealer on the house. I also insulated the taped connections properly so it wouldn't cause a short/earth problem in the future.


    And the filters are cleaned out. This little tray is not stock but it's a very nice addtion. A picture in the next post will show why

    This is the coolant lines running coolant along the sides of the machine to wash chips into the conveyor screw. The valves had been shut so there was 5-6year old coolant accumulated inside. Imagine the consistence of that mix now.. It required a strong alkaline cleaner to get that stuff out. By the way I didn't go mental with this cleaning thing for no reason. I watched a Haas Automation video on youtube saying that a machine that had bacterial problems with the old coolant could come back to it's old state in 7 days if not cleaned properly so I figured better safe than sorry. One of the videos on their series can be found here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvyNUn2sp3Q


    The old coolant hoses looked like something that was picked up from a boat store. They where hard as plastic and I figured that it would just leak. Replaced the hoses with proper hoses that should handle coolant and more nasty stuff. I also added a T and a ball valve to a new wash down hose. Some kind of filter system will be added eventually but I want to see how the coolant works before I invest more in it.

  9. #109
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    The washdown hose mentioned in last post is just made from a regular garden sprayer. I'm looking for one in aluminum that can withstand coolant but I'm sure this $5 will last a while anyways. Really cheap and handy addition to the machine to be able to wash down the chips to the conveyor after use. When I was washing the tank I aslo emptied the tank into 25 liters buckets for disposal with this gun and the pump in the machine. Just had to rise the tray on one and so the coolant was higher over at the pump side and it was no problem to almost completely empty it with the internal pump.



    To clean out the machine I followed the Haas video in previous post. First I used water + alkaline cleaner and washed down the whole inside of the machine. I let this mix run for 2-3hours to clean out old hoses/lines. Then I emptied that mix and filled the tray with 2% mix of Blaser bcool 755 coolant and ran the machine for 2-3 hours washing down everything one more time. Emptied that out again and filled up with 8% mix of Blaser Bcool 755. The pain in this process was that the tray is so big that I had to fill it with atleast 50-60liters to be able to run the pump properly so I now have over 100liters I need to dispose. Someone told me that I can cook that stuff outside to extract all the water so it's easier cheaper to dispose I might do something like that. For now I just run to my neighbor to get some big cans to store it in


    Then the next problem was figuring out how the coolant was supposed to work from the machine control. The pump started running immediately after powerup the machine. This was a bit annoying so I had a look in the ladder program again. The Y49.3 output on the first line here is the coolant valve for the splash coolant and the Y048.1 is the main coolant pump. A short version is that they have used diagnostic 484 to setup how the pump/valve works. Like it was setup the pump was always on and the valve was triggered with a M08 command. I changed one bit (484.0) and then the pump and valve is both triggered by the M08 command only running when they are told to. If my valve was working it would make sense to have it like it was setup but I need to fix that before I can use it.


    When I added air to the control valve I discovered that it was blowing air into the coolant. After disassembly I see that there are at least two o-rings that are damaged so I either have to find a new valve or a new gasket set for this one. The O-ring I had stocked but the seal below the "piston" is probably special SMC part so I didn't find this anywhere on short notice. Will ask SMC for a gasket kit.

  10. #110
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    The addition of Blaser coolant was so nice. The machine is so nice and clean and chips is so easy to remove. Just had to add these two boring pics since I'm on a picture frenzy here anyways. Btw sorry if I'm spamming here but they would only let me add 10 pics pr post so I had to split it to include some more. My english is crappy so pictures says so much more


    I designed a tic tac toe game last night just to have something real to do testmilling on. The finnish with coolant is just WAY nicer than before when I ran dry. I'm still not dialed in on the feeds and speeds so I guess it can only improve from here. Wasting a ton of material since I don't have a band saw yet and I'm to lazy to manually cut big chunks of alu but it's a great way of doing test facing or test milling before I cut out what I'm actually making. The chip tray below shows how much chips there was from that board only. Really nice tho having it all back in that tray instead of having to vacuum down the whole machine inside ^^

  11. #111
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    How much oil is acceptable in the coolant tray? Most of mine goes into a separate chamber so it’s easy to pick up with a oil cloth but some seems to end up floating on top of coolant like I’ve read about around the web. I purchased a skimpy oil skimmer but I haven’t installed it yet since I lack a oil/coolant separator to extract all the coolant it pulls. If anyone has a tip on how to make a DIY separator similar to the one skimpy sells please let me know as it will take weeks to get one sent over from the US..


  12. #112
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Having a blast milling with the machine lately. This is a mold for a customer and I hope I can get a few more jobs so I can finance a renishaw probe solution. Is there any good aftermarket probes I should look for? I want one that can go in the tool changer and one for probing tool offsets. I think probing offsets would be the first thing then later get one to replace the haimer. Will have to aim for second hand since new is out of my budget.


  13. #113
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Welcome!
    I'm still new to this forum.
    Now I want to chase a KIRA VTC 30 machine.
    The x-axis ball point is defective.
    What size and type of spindle is in the machine, where can you buy new ones and go for it?
    Thank you in advance for your reply.

  14. #114
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Are you takling about the spindle bearing/clamping/holder of the motor? If it’s the motor you can get a new from Fanuc or from eBay but keep in mind that there are 3 different motors for this machine depending on option when it was bought. I believe it’s 6-8-12k final speed. There are also differences in encoder setup and more details between the motors so keep that in mind when searching for it.

  15. #115
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    I have a renishaw ts20 probe on it's way. It's originally for a lathe but I hope I can get it working on my machine also. This means that I had to test the high speed skip signal of the OM-C controller. According to the connection manual high speed skip is to be connected between 1-3 (0V) and 14 (hskip) on M12 connector. I soldered up a CAT5E cable onto these connections and fired a G31 X100 F100 command to see if it stopped. No luck... So I started reading all kinds of manuals and searched through the parameter manual without finding anything mentioning high speed skip signal. Then I googled some and found a thread where someone mentioned a 900 parameter that had to be enabled so I looked through the list I had of 900 parameters and didn't find anything. Since this guy mentioned a parameter I backed up all my stuff and set that parameter to test it. And bob's ur uncle! It's working and it now stops instantly. Now I just have to wait for the probe and the Renishaw MI8 interface and I can start play with it. Will do some reading about macros and see if I can make some ease tool probe macros to zero out my tools with.

  16. #116
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Hi,
    Thank you very much for your quick answer!
    I still think about purchasing this machine for four.
    The machine book is there, but the parameter is only in the machine, not on a separate media.
    How complex is the parameter archiving?
    Can you tell me the dimensions of the spindle on the X axis of your machine?

  17. #117
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Quote Originally Posted by kladany View Post
    Hi,
    Thank you very much for your quick answer!
    I still think about purchasing this machine for four.
    The machine book is there, but the parameter is only in the machine, not on a separate media.
    How complex is the parameter archiving?
    Can you tell me the dimensions of the spindle on the X axis of your machine?
    You can archive the parameters simply by taking pictures of the screens. It's really simple. If you hook it up to a computer with RS232 it's just to click output when you are in edit mode and you get all output in a file in your dnc application.

    The ballscrew? 25x12p for XY and 32x10p for Z. I got a quote for 185k YEN for the X ballscrew from kira. I never measured the lenght of it.

  18. #118
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Today I've fitted the TS20 probe to my machine and done some testing. My Renishaw Mi8 interface didn't arrive but I wanted to test it anyways so I had to connect it to the regular skip input of my machine (not high speed since it's 5V) and then use a 1kOhm pull up resistor to invert the input since it can't be inverted in the machine on OM-C according to my knowledge. I wrote a quick probe macro probing and saving the offset values from G54 to variables just as a test. It repeats to within +/- 0.00045mm so it's beating the machine accuracy probably. I will repeat the test once I get the proper interface on monday and see how it behaves on the high speed skip input.

    I hope I can mange to find a angle bracket for my probe as this makes it hard to probe the diameter of bigger tools.. Wish I had the proper renishaw tool height measurement macros.


  19. #119
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Hi!
    I have a question again.
    Is it possible in Fanuc to change the spindle of the X axis?
    With a 12 mm increase, I do not get a reasonable price axis in Hungary, but with a 10 mm increase.
    I hope you understand my question.
    Thank you very much

  20. #120
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    215

    Re: Kira VTC 30

    Quote Originally Posted by kladany View Post
    Hi!
    I have a question again.
    Is it possible in Fanuc to change the spindle of the X axis?
    With a 12 mm increase, I do not get a reasonable price axis in Hungary, but with a 10 mm increase.
    I hope you understand my question.
    Thank you very much
    25x10? Everything is possible i guess but its going to require changing the servo parametere and do servo tuning. I would say that if you don’t have experience with controls like this enough to know how to approach it I would rather import the proper ballscrew. If you can read up on the subject and save a lot of money on doing it then it might be worth it but keep in mind that it’s a lot easier to replace it with a similar part.

Page 6 of 7 4567

Similar Threads

  1. Need parameters Kira VTC 30
    By cic108 in forum Fanuc
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-06-2016, 02:55 AM
  2. Ayuda con KIRA KV3 MC
    By arturonaupa in forum Spanish
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 05-25-2013, 09:36 PM
  3. KIRA FANUC 10M
    By NEOKO in forum Fanuc
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 04-09-2010, 05:19 PM
  4. Tree/Kira VMC
    By rhinsen in forum Tree
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-30-2008, 12:39 AM
  5. Chevalier vs. Kira
    By ricardog in forum CNC (Mill / Lathe) Control Software (NC)
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-07-2006, 10:20 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •