[Viroos]

Are there any Canadian owners here? Need some advise regarding the purchasing of the machine...

[kstrauss]

I have a 770 and am in southern Ontario about 60 miles east of Toronto. What is your question?

[Viroos]

I'm interested in purchasing the 770 machine. I asked a quote from Studica, the Canadian distributor of Tormach and received a price way beyond my expectations, including some "mandatory modification of the electrical components of the machine to ensure that the machine meets Canadian Electrical Code" and high freight cost. The price of the components is also significantly higher than those posted on the Tormach website.
Is it worth buying directly from Tormach? If yes, will the machine have to be inspected and modified?
P.S. I'm from Ottawa ON.

[kstrauss]

I purchased my machine directly from Tormach about 3.5 years ago. Tormach arranged for shipping to my door and Livingston handled customs clearance. There is no duty but you do need to pay the HST. You can do your own customs clearance but I decided that traveling to the border to look after things was not worth the effort. I paid for everything by credit card (I have a US$ MasterCard) and the amount was the same as is listed on the Tormach website plus I got 2% cashback from MasterCard. I can't locate the invoice but the shipping charges seemed reasonable at the time. Nothing special was done for electrical changes; it plugs into a normal outlet.

I would never use a Canadian "distributor" if it can be avoided. Typically they add significantly to the cost and provide nothing in terms of support. I suppose that they are some good Canadian "distributors" but I've never found one. Note that Tormach's shipping charges for small orders are *VERY* high. I've ordered many accessories such as TTS holders from Little Machine Shop who have reasonable shipping policies.

I hope that this answers your questions but feel free to ask more.

[Viroos]

Thank you very much! Will buy directly from Tormach

[Fenichel]

For what it's worth, my experience was the same as that of Ken Strauss.

Tormach is generally easy to deal with, but before you place your order, talk to someone at Tormach to verify specifically that what you order is all meant to work together. Their Web site is incomplete in this regard. For example, I asked for their advice and, following it, I ordered a coolant kit (Tormach P/N 31192) with my 770; it included a backsplash enclosure (P/N 31368). I learned only after delivery that the backsplash is essentially useless without the Machine Stand (P/N 31191) that I didn't order and didn't want.

[Viroos]

Thanks! Do they really send the small parts separately with UPS and the machine with a truck?

[Fenichel]

That's what they did with me.

[kstrauss]

In my case everything for the initial order -- 770, stand, coolant, 4th axis, some accessories -- arrived on the same truck. My issue with Tormach is that their minimum shipping charge to Canada is about $40. Any order shipped via UPS results in various additional "fees" of about $50. Small orders for stuff such as a replacement belt could ship via USPS for a few dollars. My solution is to order small shipments from Little Machine Shop and getting other stuff shipped to my son in Connecticut for his next visit here.

[Steve303]

...,including some "mandatory modification of the electrical components of the machine to ensure that the machine meets Canadian Electrical Code" ....

Did they tell you what the "mandatory" modifications to the electrical components were, or was it a simple ESA on-site inspection for the ESA sticker?

[Viroos]

That's what they wrote: "Also reflected on the quotation is the cost for the mandatory modification of the electrical components of the machine. This is completed to ensure that the machine meets Canadian Electrical Code and CSA Standards. Following this modification the machine is inspected and stickered under ESA and CSA accreditation"

[kstrauss]

I don't know if it is still possible but in years past one could get a special inspection from Ontario Hydro (I assume now OPG). You might want to contact ESAFE ( https://www.esafieldevaluation.ca/en/field-evaluation ).

[Fenichel]

When I got my 770 from Tormach in May of this year, I did not request, pay for, or receive any such stickers. Possibly

• the regulations have changed, or
• there is inter-province variation, or
• Studica is trying to rip you off.

[Viroos]

Well.. that's worrying... I just don't want to find myself in a situation when the authorities say to me "you cannot use this machine", especially if I ask them first...
What would you recommend to do? Just order the machine from Tormach and hope nobody asks questions about it?

[Viroos]

...that's what I got from Tormach: "Yes, you may purchase direct from Tormach, however we do not offer the Modifications that Studica offers. These modifications are required at Schools and larger businesses. While I am sure they are required in personal shops, I do not know that all customers have these changes implemented."

[kstrauss]

I suspect that the regulations are unchanged but mostly ignored for private users. My experience was the same as Fenichel when my machine arrived 3 years ago.

[kstrauss]

Perhaps ask Tormach to provide details of the modifications? Did they mention applying warning labels in French?

[Viroos]

Studica quoted that "ESA Modification and Inspection" = $1150. Seems like some larger work...

[kstrauss]

Or larger profit.

[Viroos]

Haha, that would be too much, really. I don't want to post here the quote I got, but I almost fell off my unicorn when I opened it ))