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IndustryArena Forum > CNC Electronics > Spindles / VFD > Upgrade of Huanyang vfd
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
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    18

    Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Hi all!

    I've been considering if upgrading my 2.2kw Chinese air cooled spindle cheap vfd. I was just wondering what people have and what they think of it in comparison? If it's worth it? Can you notice any difference in torque in general an at lower rpms?

    Also what models do you have/recommend.

    I've been looking at the Yaskawa V1000. Has anyone been using this with this type of spindle?

    Thanks,
    Dave.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    15362

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by davemorl View Post
    Hi all!

    I've been considering if upgrading my 2.2kw Chinese air cooled spindle cheap vfd. I was just wondering what people have and what they think of it in comparison? If it's worth it? Can you notice any difference in torque in general an at lower rpms?

    Also what models do you have/recommend.

    I've been looking at the Yaskawa V1000. Has anyone been using this with this type of spindle?

    Thanks,
    Dave.
    That's a very good VFD, but this won't solve, your torque at lower RPM, you have a air cooled spindle which has a minimum speed, they are not much good for anything below the minimum RPM of your spindle, they have max torque at the max RPM, so when trying to use them at lower speeds the torque / Hp drops off quite quickly

    Water cooled can cut at lower RPM than the air cooled spindles 6,000 is there minimum, but only have a useful cutting range from around 7,500 to 24,000 RPM
    Mactec54

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    18

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Yeah I'm aware that the water cooled can run slower bit the torque is useless thats why I never got one. I am just wondering if a better VFD would give better torque that the cheap Chinese one at the lower RPM of the air cooled as I know the torque is not as good at the designed running frequency of 400hz. I'm assuming a better VFD is gonna impove things but it's weighing up if the improvement is worth the £400 and if its even noticable?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    5717

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    I wonder if a sensorless vector VFD would work on a high speed spindle. Much flatter torque curve. But would it fry a high speed spindle if you ran it too slow? I dunno.
    Jim Dawson
    Sandy, Oregon, USA

  5. #5
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    Mar 2016
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    18
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Dawson View Post
    I wonder if a sensorless vector VFD would work on a high speed spindle. Much flatter torque curve. But would it fry a high speed spindle if you ran it too slow? I dunno.
    I do believe that us what the V1000 is. I'm not 100% how it all works though but they say vector control is the new way to control motors instead of frequency variable drives which I think is what the Chinese Huanyang is.

    It uses computional power to monitor the feedback from the motor that's pretty much all I know haha! I could be wrong and I'm sure someone could tell me more who understands it better.

    What I'm wondering is if I use a better vector drive will I get a flat torque gradient so will I get constant torque throughout the speed range or closer to it than the Chinese drive at the lower RPM range like say 7500?

    I don't want to go below 7000rpm I know the spindle can't do it.

    It's just weighing up if what you get back for spending the money is worth it or just stick with the cheap drive?!

    I am hoping someone can tell me more

  6. #6
    ericks Guest

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    My advise....buy an Industry approved motor and drive

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    18

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    You're talking 1000's for one of those motors. I agree if I had the cash I'd buy a Haas spindle or even better a VMC 😂😂

    I'm just trying to squeeze as much as possible from a cheap spindle for as cheap as possible for a hobbiest. ☺

  8. #8
    ericks Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by davemorl View Post
    You're talking 1000's for one of those motors. I agree if I had the cash I'd buy a Haas spindle or even better a VMC 😂😂

    I'm just trying to squeeze as much as possible from a cheap spindle for as cheap as possible for a hobbiest. ☺
    I understand..... Currently i am using a kress spindle/router. Teknomotor is my choice for the new machine, it good value under 1000 Aud.

  9. #9
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    Mar 2016
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    18

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Yeah I have been looking at them, I think that's all I'll be doing as well. I can always dream haha! Maybe one day!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    15362

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by davemorl View Post
    Yeah I'm aware that the water cooled can run slower bit the torque is useless thats why I never got one. I am just wondering if a better VFD would give better torque that the cheap Chinese one at the lower RPM of the air cooled as I know the torque is not as good at the designed running frequency of 400hz. I'm assuming a better VFD is gonna impove things but it's weighing up if the improvement is worth the £400 and if its even noticable?
    As I said a better quality VFD will make no difference, it's all about your spindle motor, more than what the VFD can do, the torque curve can be adjusted, but those that do if you go to far you will smoke the spindle
    Mactec54

  11. #11
    ericks Guest

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by davemorl View Post
    Yeah I have been looking at them, I think that's all I'll be doing as well. I can always dream haha! Maybe one day!
    If i were you i would not buy the same drive. I looked at it's specifications and it does not look like it's approved anywhere! You will not be able to buy this product from a authorized supplier. If it is used in eg Australia and it causes your home to burn down then i am afraid you will have some difficulty.... Delta for example isn't my first choice but its approved here in Australia, in Europe and i am sure America too.... Just my opinion

  12. #12
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    Mar 2016
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    18
    Quote Originally Posted by ericks View Post
    If i were you i would not buy the same drive. I looked at it's specifications and it does not look like it's approved anywhere! You will not be able to buy this product from a authorized supplier. If it is used in eg Australia and it causes your home to burn down then i am afraid you will have some difficulty.... Delta for example isn't my first choice but its approved here in Australia, in Europe and i am sure America too.... Just my opinion
    Do you mean the Chinese one?

    I don't think I'll be getting another one to be honest. I think one of these

    https://www.motorcontrolwarehouse.co.uk/invertek-ode-3-220105-1f42-optidrive-e3.html

    Or the V1000.

    It's just weighing up the benifits of paying £200 more for the v1000 and will the more money be noticeable with performance?!

  13. #13
    ericks Guest

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by davemorl View Post
    Do you mean the Chinese one?

    I don't think I'll be getting another one to be honest. I think one of these

    https://www.motorcontrolwarehouse.co...idrive-e3.html

    Or the V1000.

    It's just weighing up the benifits of paying £200 more for the v1000 and will the more money be noticeable with performance?!
    Yes i mean your Chinese drive... When you buy a descent drive then the most important thing to remember is to check the manual to make sure you protect the drive with the recommended fuse or breaker size and type. Proper selection will save your drive in case of serious motor failure eg motor "short" or motor earth fault. Proper mounting or panel cooling is also vital, i see many guys mounting their drives incorrectly. The manufacturer will indicate proper ventilation and clearance distances....

    .....re the V1000, Yaskawa make very good drives

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    238

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    I had one of the Chinese vfd. It lasted 5 months before the dreaded E.lu.5 error that will not reset. I've bought one of these as a replacement.

    https://drives-online.com/inverters/vacon0020-1l-0009-2

    It was 3 times the price. But the company were really helpful. They have pre programmed it for me and included a wiring diagram and remote control. I'm told it is a very reliable drive.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    15362

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by potts43 View Post
    I had one of the Chinese vfd. It lasted 5 months before the dreaded E.lu.5 error that will not reset. I've bought one of these as a replacement.

    https://drives-online.com/inverters/vacon0020-1l-0009-2

    It was 3 times the price. But the company were really helpful. They have pre programmed it for me and included a wiring diagram and remote control. I'm told it is a very reliable drive.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    That looks like a well thought out drive with the cables Shield clamps in place
    Mactec54

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    238

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    That looks like a well thought out drive with the cables Shield clamps in place
    Hi mac.....

    In the end I was told to get a danfoss vlt fc51 as the above drive didn't go to 400hz. I thought I'd have no issues. However the pot only goes from 0hz to 200hz even though it's set to go to 400hz. I've entered the figures Danfoss told me. But I guess 200hz is the same as 12000 rpm. I'm now very frustrated. I wondered if it was down to the 2 or 4 pole settings but can't see a parameter for that.

    Any ideas appreciated.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    15362

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by potts43 View Post
    Hi mac.....

    In the end I was told to get a danfoss vlt fc51 as the above drive didn't go to 400hz. I thought I'd have no issues. However the pot only goes from 0hz to 200hz even though it's set to go to 400hz. I've entered the figures Danfoss told me. But I guess 200hz is the same as 12000 rpm. I'm now very frustrated. I wondered if it was down to the 2 or 4 pole settings but can't see a parameter for that.

    Any ideas appreciated.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    Strange they could not get you running correct, Danfoss make a very good drive

    Some VF Drives, the Poles are auto ranging as soon as the high Hz parameters at set, so may be nothing to worry about

    What do you have these Parameters set at

    3-02=

    3-03=

    4-12=

    4-14=
    Mactec54

  18. #18
    ericks Guest

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Not bad drives, we use a lot of VLT2800 and VLT5000 ones.

    You need to make sure you have set parameter 1-01 to [0] U/f

    otherwise you will be limited to a maximum of 200Hz


  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    238

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by mactec54 View Post
    Strange they could not get you running correct, Danfoss make a very good drive

    Some VF Drives, the Poles are auto ranging as soon as the high Hz parameters at set, so may be nothing to worry about

    What do you have these Parameters set at

    3-02=

    3-03=

    4-12=

    4-14=
    I believe I have 120 and 400.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    238

    Re: Upgrade of Huanyang vfd

    Quote Originally Posted by ericks View Post
    Not bad drives, we use a lot of VLT2800 and VLT5000 ones.

    You need to make sure you have set parameter 1-01 to [0] U/f

    otherwise you will be limited to a maximum of 200Hz

    Ericks you are a star that worked!!!

    If I press the Hand on button the supply doesn't run until I turn the pot. It then goes from 0hz to 400hz. A Brilliant start.

    Is it possible to replace it showing hz to rpm?

    I have wired my mach3 breakout board to terminals 18 and 20 of P.S. and this turns the spindle on and off from mach3. However it appears to have it running at maximum rpm and as the power supply has to be in auto start mode the knob doesn't work. The software up and down buttons don't change the spindles speed.

    Obviously doing something wrong here. Any ideas? Is it possible for Mach3 to tell the spindle what speed to run at and/or be able to vary the spindle speed from mach3?

    And hopefully last.....
    I bought an external box with an emergency stop button and rpm pot on it.
    I've tried wiring it to the P.S. but they don't appear to work. Once again Danfoss provided some instructions but they didn't work so if you can help me I'm ready to try your ideas.

    Thanks Jase

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

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