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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    411
    Quote Originally Posted by mattinker View Post
    Irving,

    whilst you were editing your post, I was taking a couple of picks of my chuck and the "shims" that I'd used for my chuck! The first one is with the shims in machining position, and the second is with the shims moved out to enable the grind stone to "clear". I haven't read the article you found, it's not the same as the one I followed. I was not very pleased with the results, it was better, but as the scroll wear was uneven, it was only good in some places! It's worth trying! I bought a 10" four jaw not long afterwards, I use it for most things.

    Let me know how you got on.

    Regards, Matthew

    PS. I just read the article, it's all there!
    Matt, thanks for that... it looks like your shims are similar but lack the 'springy cut' therefore might not put the right loading on. I wonder if that's why your results weren't so good? I plan to give this a go, on the grounds it can't make things any worse The scroll on my chuck looks OK - at least to the eye

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    481
    mattinker once again nice work , I thought I would have a investigate into the Automation Artisan's Electronic Lead Screw (ELS) The simple way to automate your machinery http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...t=35519&page=5 and their YahooGroup http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/E-LeadScrew/ seems like a very nice setup.

    YouTube clips - Taper turning using Gingery Lathe and Electronic Lead Screw

    http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=RRaVIBhLgF0
    http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=qu0GTo...eature=related

    Spindle speed variation changes Lead Screw threading speed http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=dg87BDLhsP8


    mattinker seems the Americans were giving heaps of STICK because of you possible being French LOL , always wonder why the Froggies and the Yankies didn't see eye to eye. Some of the words have deliberately been misspelt LOL.

    Had to read the whole thread I had a giggle on the way on the first few posts. LOL

  3. #63
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Springy shims.

    Irving,

    yep, I suspect that your right, I maybe ought to re-try using springy thingies!

    Regards, Matthew


    Quote Originally Posted by irving2008 View Post
    Matt, thanks for that... it looks like your shims are similar but lack the 'springy cut' therefore might not put the right loading on. I wonder if that's why your results weren't so good? I plan to give this a go, on the grounds it can't make things any worse The scroll on my chuck looks OK - at least to the eye

  4. #64
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    ELS

    FPV_GTp,

    I've been following the ELS for some time, for me it's the way to go if like me you have a lathe that has no screw cutting gears. A good way to use the lathe on a simple basis, the CNC will come later!

    As a Brit resident in France, I'm not going to get into the French/American thing! The only thing I will say is that the two cultures are mutually incomprehensible, You have to have "lived" them to understand the them.

    Regards, Matthew


    Quote Originally Posted by FPV_GTp View Post
    mattinker once again nice work , I thought I would have a investigate into the Automation Artisan's Electronic Lead Screw (ELS) The simple way to automate your machinery http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...t=35519&page=5 and their YahooGroup http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/E-LeadScrew/ seems like a very nice setup.

    YouTube clips - Taper turning using Gingery Lathe and Electronic Lead Screw

    http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=RRaVIBhLgF0
    http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=qu0GTo...eature=related

    Spindle speed variation changes Lead Screw threading speed http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=dg87BDLhsP8


    mattinker seems the Americans were giving heaps of STICK because of you possible being French LOL , always wonder why the Froggies and the Yankies didn't see eye to eye. Some of the words have deliberately been misspelt LOL.

    Had to read the whole thread I had a giggle on the way on the first few posts. LOL

  5. #65
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Spring shims

    I decided that it was about time that I had another go at regrinding my three jaw chuck. Now that I have the four jaw, I have an alternative. The three jaw would be useful for the next bit of my build, the Electronic half-nut.

    The first photo is a bit blurred, but it shows the holes that I drilled in the shims with their saw cuts to allow flexibility.

    I had previously made the 43mm diameter (standard electric drill mount) tool holder mount.

    This time I used an electric drill, which seemed about as efficient as the air drill I used the first time.

    The results were better this time, at worst, I have 0,009" of eccentricity, which will do for the moment.

    I've got a lot of photos of making the Electronic half-nut. I'm not sure how to go about writing it up. So here is what it's all about!

    Electronic half nut.

    The Electronic half nut is a control that allows one to move the carriage (Z axis) from left to right and vice versa.

    The original specifications were:-

    “The Electronic Half nut is a 5K potentiometer. It has a total rotary 
travel of 320 degrees and is installed in a 1/2" hole and has a 1/4"
shaft.

The center position is equivalent to no motion and we'll call that 0
degrees. The lever attached to the pot should detent in this position.

Movement to +/-30 degrees on either side of center starts the carriage
moving at turning rate or Move Rate depending on whether the spindle is
turning or not. The lever should detent at this position against some
sort of spring that keeps if from easily moving further than +/- 30
degrees.

Moving the leaver against this spring tension allows the lever to go the
rest of the way to +/-160 degrees from center resulting increasing speed
up to maximum slew rate.

Releasing the lever will have the spring return it to the detented
position (+/-30 degrees) which brings the carriage to a stop.

The lever has to be brought back to the center detented stop'd position
before it will move the carriage again.

    When I started thinking about the problem, I didn't like the idea of a spring to bring the lever back to the stop position. I don't like the "feel" of a spring, so I made a heavy handle, which satisfies me both from the "feel" and the functional point of view. The handle returns naturally to the centre position. The detent positions +/-30 and stop/centre position, use a bullet shaped plunger under spring pressure that engages in depressions in the cylindrical housing.

    I wanted to make a control that was in keeping with my lathe, that would be sufficiently strong to not break easily. The 47K pot (in Europe 50K dosen't exist!) is plastic, extremely cheap and I suspect will need to be replaced before I use it, I have however made the handle in such a way as to never be able to put excessive pressure on in normal use.

    The last picture is a view of what my solution to the problem looks like. It's a lot of photos, so I think the best thing for me to do is to write it up a bit at a time.

    Regards, Matthew

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails chuck2.jpg   chuckgrind3.jpg   chuckgrind.jpg   ehk1.jpg  


  6. #66
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Electronic half-nut 1

    Hi,

    I started by making the body and the shaft for the Electronic half nut. I used a piece of 40mm diameter, 40mm long mild steel that was part of a heavy duty door hinge. It turned out to be very nice to machine! The bearings were two skate board bearings, 22 X 7, with an 8mm inside diameter. I had thought of putting a washer between the two bearings to separate them, but in practice, the two bearings needed no separation to be movement free.

    In the first picture, I'm drilling out the the block to 22mm, on the pot side, I had already drilled from the other side to 20mm and bored 22mmØ 14mm deep to take the two bearings. I left roughly 4mm at 20mmØ

    With my home made boring bar pics 2 & 3, I made a chamber, that will house the nut that is going to attach the rheostat to the handle. This didn't need to be very precise, just enough room to tighten the nut. I needed to leave enough metal at the end to be able to drill and tap the fixing screws. The bits of white tape are there to guide me!

    It's difficult to see, but the fourth photo, is intended to show the chamber.

    In the fifth image, I'm drilling for the three bearing retainer threads. Drilling 5mm for M6 thread.

    Photo number six is fairly obvious! Three allen head screws hold the bearings in place.

    The seventh image is of the shaft. This started out in life as a 10mm bolt. I cut the threaded end to leave enough to make my closing system I turned the end roughly 45° over about 2 mm. I chucked it up in the four jaw and drilled a 6mm hole to the depth of the thread. I then turned the piece round and turned the diameter down to 8mm, leaving about 6mm of the un-threaded 10mm section. I then threaded the 8mm section. The final operation was to make two hack-saw cuts at 90° to each other across the top of the 10mm thread.

    I had decided to make a closing system that puts equal pressure on all sides of the plastic shaft of the rheostat I wanted it to be as straight as possible to avoid excessive wear. In retrospect, a simple locking screw would probably be OK! The plastic pot just seemed so flimsy in comparison with it's mounting.

    The following five pictures are about how I made the nut. I didn't have any hex stock, so I just used an M10 nut. The first operation was to braze a piece of 2mm flat mild-steel cut roughly to shape to cover the hole. I then turned it to about 45° and drilled a 6mm hole through the blocked end, I was very pleased to have my three jaw for this! The final step was to "countersink" from the inside of the nut at 45° to give the closing action when screwed onto the end of the shaft.

    Image N° 13 is milling the "window in the side of the body, without it, there's no way to tighten the closing nut on the shaft!

    The next thing to do was to make the mounting bracket that will also hold the pot. Photos 14 to 17, 50mm angle, cut out by hand, drilled, the body threaded, the hole for the rheostat first drilled to 8mm and then elongated to accommodate the 10mm thread whilst allowing for the flats on the pot mounting.

    That's it for now, maybe get some more done later. Regards, Matthew
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 22mmdrill.jpg   homadebar1.jpg   chambering.jpg   body1.jpg  

    body2.jpg   body3.jpg   2.jpg   colletnut1.jpg  

    colletnut3.jpg   colletnut8.jpg   colletnut9.jpg   colletnut10.jpg  

    bodywindow.jpg   bracket1.jpg   bracket2.jpg   bracket3.jpg  

    bracket4.jpg  

  7. #67
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Electronic half nut 2

    Hi,

    to finish off the mounting bracket , I drilled two 8mm holes in the base and cut the edge of the bracket so that when its bolted in place, I can hook the cover on it. I used my shaper for this last operation, I haven't used it since I moved a bit over three years ago. I really enjoyed it! Photos 1 & 2.

    The handle was the next thing that I made. To make it return without a spring, it needed to be heavy. A piece of cold rolled, 15mm thick, cut of with the band saw Pics 3 & 4 As you can see, I cut out as much as I could with the band saw. To allow the detent mechanism to reach the outer edge of the body, I milled out part of the handle Photo 5. Two M8 threaded holes in the handle, one for mounting the handle and the other, for the detent screw. Photos 6 & 7.

    The first detent mechanism that I made was using a spring that I rewound around a wood screw Photo 8, I used a steel ball to engage in the dimple on the outside of the body. Photo 9 the spring was a bit short, but the ball was too slack, which meant that it was too sloppy. To overcome this, I made a bullet shaped plunger using the end of the bit that I'd drilled the hole with. Photo 10 & 11 I rounded the end of the plunger and cut nearly all the way through with my angle grinder. The new plunger was a much better fit. No more slop!. When I drilled the dimples , I got them in the wrong place, which meant filling them up with weld and re-drilling. Photo N° 12 is with the rough handle in place. The action was smooth and conforms to the requirements. To lighten the top of the handle, I milled the top so that it was thinner. Photo 13 milling, 14 the handle in place, having been cleaned up with my belt sander.

    The window in the body and the rheostat need to be covered up. Photo 15 is the piece of 1,5mm plate that I cut out and bent to a semi-circular shape, Photo 16, it would be possible to do this in the vice with a tube or a bar to bend it round, but as I have a pan break, I bent it by nibbles, moving the plate forward at each nibble. In the Photo 17, I've tacked the end cover in place, it has a 2mm 90° bend which will engage in the fixing bracket where I machined it with my shaper. The cover was ark welded and ground smooth. The photos 18 & 19 show the finished article in 18 you can see that I've added a stop to the left of the handle. In 19, the fixing screw that holds the cover in place also acts as a stop. These two stops are to prevent accidental damage to the pot if the handle is turned too far.

    The final photo is an exploded view with all the "bits" in place. You can see an error that I made when I made the window, I didn't leave enough metal for the cover fixing screw, the great thing about mild steel is that it can be built up with weld! I built up enough metal to put an M6 thread in place!

    That's it for now, regards, Matthew
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails shaper1.jpg   shaper5.jpg   cuthandle.jpg   cuthandle2.jpg  

    millrecess.jpg   drillhandle1.jpg   drillhandle2.jpg   spring1.jpg  

    spring2.jpg   detente1.jpg   detente2.jpg   asseblhadle2.jpg  

    handle1.jpg   handle4.jpg   cover1.jpg   cover2.jpg  

    cover4.jpg   ehk1.jpg   ehk3.jpg   ehk4.jpg  


  8. #68
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    off topic a bit! For those who were interested in refurbishing old chucks.

    Hi,

    when I trued up the jaws on my three jaw chuck, I was in a hurry and didn't do the outsides of the jaws. The other day, I needed the outsides of the jaws true for a job. (one of the reasons why I've been quiet for a little while!) I was really in a hurry, and came up with a solution that was quick and dirty but worked really well! The object of the exercise was to put an equal pressure on the outside of the jaws so that they could be ground true.

    Happy new year! Matthew
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails chuck.jpg  

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    6463
    Hi mathew, been following your build using the old Colchester lathe.

    I've got an old Colchester Bantam 5" centre height, (!0" swing for the Yanks), LOL, circa 1920/30 with the headstock cast integral with the bed casting.

    I restored it to working order as I needed it to machine with, and as it had a full set of gears it does screwcutting quite well.

    I bought it in UK in 1980 for 100 pounds, and also a new Pratt Burnard 10" 4 jaw chuck, and shipped it out to OZ when I emigrated there in 1981.

    The bed was badly worn, approx .30mm (.013") wear from the middle of the bed to the chuck, so I made a hand bed planer and recut all the vees and flats, a long story but if anyone's interested I'll bore you to tears with the details LOL.

    After the bed recut it will now turn and bore parallel over 150mm from the chuck face.

    One thing I will say and that is like worn tyres on a car, when a 3 jaw lathe chuck starts to go bell mouth it's time to chuck it out, even if it's a Pratt Burnerd or whatever.

    When the scroll wears, which is not apparent to the eye, the next thing to go is the slots which hold the jaws, at that point you start chasing your tail in an effort to get it to hold accurately, and no amount of jaw regrinding will really restore it to new.

    Now here's the solution and as far as I'm concerned the most reliable if you want to have accuracy to .001" total indicator reading, on all diameters.

    Buy a new chuck, I did just this, but not a Pratt Burnard, I bought a 150mm (6") Chinese one for $150 in 1984, having struggled with the original one that the lathe came with, and can say that almost 25 years later the chuck still holds work true, unbelievable, but I don't graunch the chuck by overtightening it on rough material.

    A three jaw chuck is a poor mans collet system, and if you overtighten it you can kiss it goodbye.

    One tip I used before when a chuck does get a bit worn and run out occurs no matter how you rework it, and that is to make the chuck backplate register a loose fit, at least .010" clear on the spigot diametre.

    This allows you to clock up a fussy bit of work and slacken the backoplate screws to allow you to tap the chuck body with a hide or lead mallet to get the job to run dead true.

    I'll be watching your posts to see the results of the CNC'ing project, love the photos.
    Ian.

  10. #70
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Chucks

    Ian,

    thanks for your comments and reply about three jaw chucks. As I'd already said, I bought a 10"/250mm four jaw indepandant chuck which has more or less super ceded the three jaw. I only use the three jaw for things that are chucked up and not taken out until finished. I will eventually buy myself a new chuck but in between times I'm making do! Like the idea of the adjustable back-plate, but the scroll wear is such that unless I need to do a lot of the same diameters, the four jaw is quicker to set up. Since the new year, I've been doing a lot of earning my living, (theatre machinery, and a junk TV series this time) so I haven't had much time to work on the lathe. I hope to get back to it soon, but I also need to work on my workshop, when the weather permits, windows and insulation which will mean that I can work more in winter. Also, the chimney for the forge/foundry/Kiln needs to go through the roof which will make it easier to heat my workshop!

    I hope to be able to buy an ELS soon, John, has been busy with other things. I have a PC ready with EMC2 (thanks to my son who has since setting up this machine for me has been completely converted to Linux!). I hope to go on an Auto CAD course soon, which will also be good for my money earning!

    One of my projects is to a CM4 plug to fit into the non standard taper in the spindle. I like working between centres and I have a set of ER32 collets which would be very useful for work holding.

    Thanks again for your comments, I hope to write some more soon.

    Regards, Matthew

  11. #71
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    1
    Hello,

    Impressive job. I'm thinking to do the same thing.
    Happy to find a neighbour on CNCzone. I live in La Courneuve.

    Stéphane

  12. #72
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    922
    just read the entire thing. Very good job- posting to many pictures is like saying gas is too cheap! keep em coming! i enjoy watching the process.

  13. #73
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    Thanks!

    Stephane 93,

    I posted a Private mail to you.

    Teyber12,

    it's the silly season in my line of work, so I can't see myself getting much done in the immediate future. It's a shame that I'm not further on as I'm going to need the lathe , I have some automated window displays that will require small runs of turned parts. I can't talk about that yet!

    Thanks for the encouragement! I've really enjoyed both the build up and writing it up which help me to analyse the process.

    Regards, Matthew

  14. #74
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    58
    I've just completed reading the thread over the last couple of days and it has been quite inspirational.

    Amongst other current projects, I am looking at converting a Myford ML 7 to CNC. Some time ago I saw an article where a chap had started to do this but it seemed to have dried up before it got anywhere. Apart from that I haven't seen much on Myford 7 series CNC conversions.

    I'm looking forward to an update on the Colchetser project and I will be looking for more pics and vids from you.

    Keep on in there!

    Nick
    Motors are fueled by smoke - when the smoke's gone away, it's damned hard to get them going again!

  15. #75
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100
    Thanks Nick,

    two things are holding up the "Colchester" project, work, (a series of animated shop windows, for David Lynch at the "Galleries Lafayette" in Paris) and i'm waiting for the "ELS" which will control the lathe initially. I'm looking forward to getting back to the project.

    Regards, Matthew

  16. #76
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    A big step!

    A big step forward.With the help of a friend, to compensate for my electronic inaptitude, we built my ELS kit! Not too difficult, the only thing that didn't work out of the box was the display, backlite on power LED OK, 5 volts where it should be, but nothing on the screen. I had begun writting an email to John, to ask his help, when Richard cried out, the backlite rheostate wasn't turned up enough! Problem solved!

    Many thanks to John for all he's put into the project! I'm away for three weeks, but have the extreme satisfaction of knowing that everything that is left to done, I can do on my own!! It may not seem like much, but it means psycalogical progress which will open other doors!

    Happy New Year, 2010 Matthew
    Attached Files Attached Files

  17. #77
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100

    the same as my post on the ELS forum, lets here from you guys, there must be more tha

    Bill,

    I'm pleased to have been part of your adventure! As you found the ELS through my slow build up log on cnczone, I went back and looked at the page (http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...t=35519&page=5 #50) where I describe building my power stepper motor supply. (I also looked back to the beginning of the log, nearly three years have gone by!) I see that I'd quoted the "Gecko" web site, where I'd found a very complete document on making power supplies. I looked it up and couldn't find it. The Gecko page has changed, I couldn't find the 4 or 5 page pdf that I'd used to calculate my power supply. I probably have it on paper somewhere. Maybe someone has a copy, it allowed me to calculate my transformer and condenser needs. The diagram is available, and part of the article. It was very good, I got my transformer from eBay, condensers in an ellectronic shop and the bridge rectifiers I had a packet I bought cheap a long time ago! Iwonder whether someon has a .pdf copy of the doc for making one's stepper power suppl.

    I feel frustrated by the lack of interest that the ELS seems to be generating, a small hard core has put a lot of energy into this great project. (Particularilly John Dameyer)

    Nothing is too difficult in this project, I now have everything that I need to wire it all together, I've chuck adapters, a face plate adapter a spindle extension for a morse five cone, other morse and SA 40 cones male and female to make, for tooliing for my lathe and my rescent accuisition a Clarkcson MKI Tool and cutter grinder. I would love to make the Clarkson work with an ELS!

    I'm going to the "Adirondaks" and "Conecticut" for the next three weeks. All I need to do is to wire up and get started! I hope to have it running for the summer, I could have used it last summer! building small machine parts for the "Gallery Lafayette shop windows" designed by David Lynch. Thou shalt not cry over spilt milk!

    Regards, Matthew

  18. #78
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    100
    I found the .pdf that I used to build my power supply. I think it came from the Gecko site, but it's not signed, if there's a problem with it, I will of course remove it.

    Regards, Matthew
    Attached Files Attached Files

  19. #79
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    131

    Myford ML7 conversion

    Quote Originally Posted by Ali Kat View Post
    I've just completed reading the thread over the last couple of days and it has been quite inspirational.

    Amongst other current projects, I am looking at converting a Myford ML 7 to CNC. Some time ago I saw an article where a chap had started to do this but it seemed to have dried up before it got anywhere. Apart from that I haven't seen much on Myford 7 series CNC conversions.

    I'm looking forward to an update on the Colchetser project and I will be looking for more pics and vids from you.

    Keep on in there!

    Nick
    Hello Nick do you take Model engineering workshop, as there was a complete article on converting a ML7 by Tony Jeffree it was in issues 138,139& 141, and I think there was an article later about setting it up with Mach3. hope this helps Cheers Colin.

  20. #80
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    3

    How did the lathe turn out?

    Matt,

    I'm new to the forum and am curious to know how this all turned out?
    Thanks for documenting what you did - makes me think that my old Clausing Mk3 may be a candidate.

    Karl Gabel
    Henderson, Nevada, USA

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