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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Posts
    63

    Re: Artcam replacement

    Quote Originally Posted by Schoembie View Post
    Hi Aubrey, I would love to know how you manage to create a proper 3D Grayscale from a photo? Which software are you using?
    Hi
    There are any number of ways to do it.
    GIMP, Photoshop or any other image processing program can do it.
    Blender can but Blender has an almost impossible learning curve unfortunately.
    (for me anyway)
    Programmatically I have done it in using the Microsoft "Visual Studio" development suite.
    If I were to make a serious attempt to emulate the ArtCAM process I would use PHP and the Imagick library processing functionality simply because I "speak" fluent PHP and use it every day.
    The fact that most web servers are FAR more powerful than my PC also makes the PHP route far more attractive.
    However it is not simply a case of making it Greyscale and using the image to generate the height-map and then generating the tool path G-code.
    If it was then that would be easy (relatively speaking anyway).
    For example if we took an image of a Japanese Geisha girl and did a simple Greyscale conversion and used that to generate a tool path then consider this:
    Her face is white which then translates into a shallow cut.
    BUT her lips are a dark red which converts to a grey that is pretty dark.
    A dark grey translates to a much deeper tool path which would mean that her lips would be indented and that would give a ridiculous looking result when machined.
    ArtCAM somehow got around that using a processing step between generating the Greyscale and generating the tool path.
    That process probably takes a look at the surrounding topography and somehow figures out that if a darker area (the lips in this case) is surrounded by a much lighter area (the white face) then the Heightmap for the lips needs to be inverted.
    In other words it needs to be shallower than the "face" and "stick out" of the "face".
    This is what they have gotten right in ArtCAM (and other expensive utilities) but I have not been able to find an open source project that has this sort of algorithm.
    Once I know HOW they do it then emulating the process in PHP, Visual Studio or whatever would be relatively easy.
    It would involve some pretty convoluted decision processing in the code but that is what computers do for us.
    So what we need is someone who has the knowledge of just how the conversion from Greyscale to Heightmap works and to share that insight with us so that we can carry on and get this thing done.
    The "obvious" approach is to establish the outer perimeter of the "face" and invert the direction of sudden and large changes towards the darker greys - that would work on the lips but what about the eyes?
    On the eyes the makeup is darker than the face but the eyes are in fact recessed into the surface of the face so there a "simple single" processing rule would not give the required result.
    Everyone needs to remember that humans recognize that it is a face and "knows" that the lips protrude and the eyes are recessed but all a computer "sees" is a shade of grey for one pixel.
    We need an algorithm that will allow the conversion process to do what a human does so easily and that is where the difficulty is.
    Computers without a program written by a human are infinitely less intelligent than even an ant so somehow we have to be able to "tell" it what to do programmatically.
    ArtCam and others have figured that out - we need to know HOW they do it.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Posts
    11

    Re: Artcam replacement

    there are numerous softwares to use now, litefire, openbuilds, benbox, and few others, I received my software from Neotronics SA, however there are some free versions and paid versions.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Posts
    35538

    Re: Artcam replacement

    ArtCAM has re-emerged with a new name, CarveCo.

    They had an introductory offer of $1600, but the regular price is back to what ArtCAM Pro used to cost.

    https://carveco.com/
    Gerry

    UCCNC 2017 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2017.html

    Mach3 2010 Screenset
    http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/2010.html

    JointCAM - CNC Dovetails & Box Joints
    http://www.g-forcecnc.com/jointcam.html

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    14

    Re: Artcam replacement

    In my experience it's all about file extensions. what is compatible with what u used to drawing in may not be transferable to ones cam programme.
    Also trying convert raster to vector on certain artwork.
    One need good simulation of work to be carried out.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    6463

    Re: Artcam replacement

    Hi, after the time has passed I've lost track of what is wanted, and going back and reading the previous 24 posts is a bit time consuming.

    Are you trying to produce a 3D image file from a 2D photo, sketch, image etc ….whatever....using an art interpretation program to interpret the grey scale range as the high and low points for a carving or machining exercise?

    Humans do it automatically once they recognise the 2D object as something that is familiar in the real 3D World......it's all a matter of highlights and shadow as my art mistress used to impress on me when I was at school and I couldn't for the life of me sketch a human face and give it substance......cartooning in 2D after a crude fashion yes, but actual 3D representation to the eye...….Uh Uh...you need to be a born artist to do that.

    But I may be completely off the track...…..supposing you create something, and this is where you are dealing in the abstract and not an actual photographic image.....and as it is not an actual "thing" that occurs in Nature but in your mind, you can imagine the shape even though it is an abstract form because you created it with highlights and shadows to represent the shape and so it is recognisable......but not only to you but to anyone else who can interpret depth by shadow and highlight density.

    If you draw something with Fusion 360..... for example a ball.... it's a wire frame drawing with many points of interest for interpretation..…...you can only give it shape in 3 planes and therefore it has substance in a pseudo 3D format......it's the program that constructs the multi wire form in 3 planes and automatically presents it with shadow and highlight values that you will recognise.

    To then make it on a machine the drawing program needs to break it down to a set of G code values for the total wire frame points that the machine control program understands.

    I would say that if the scanned 2D picture with shadows and highlights is not totally recognisable by the program it will not translate to a 3 D image when you try to carve it or machine it...….but you could hand carve it as a sculptor or an artist would because we have a more superior brain than a CAM program and do a literal translation of the object as we see it.

    BTW, the picture of a Geisha girl's face, even though completely white, WOULD translate to a 3D image because it would have subtle highlights on that white area that indicates the contour of the face, but the eye is not that sensitive to the highlights, it's the brain that interprets them to give you the image, and any scanning device has to be sensitive enough to detect those highlights too and so construct the contour file.
    Ian.

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