[rwskinner]

I'm looking at a 94 model 4020 with 88HS control.
I'm a couple hundred miles away but recently made a trip.

What I know so far. Machine powered down for several months.
Power up and have a memory corrupt error and need to Zero Memory.
They say the battery dies and it lost the params?
Can jog the X,Y,Z and they sound good. Pulled way covers back or both sides of X and jogged to limits and ways looks good and oily. Could not see or feel any turcite under table but visibility was limited.
Removed front Y cover from table, jogged back and ways look good any oily. All lube lines are in place.

Can't do a tool change or turn on the spindle because I guess the params are lost.
Checked backlash with DI and using MPG.
0.004 on X
0.006 on Y
0.010" on Z

Hopefully thrust bearings?

So my questions are......
1) Whats your thoughts on the BL. I assume we lost the BL settings.
2) Memory Corrupt Error and ZeroMem a result of a dead battery or something more serious?
3) Does Fadal store the factory settings on the machine somewhere are am I hosed...?
4) Does anyone know of a reputable company familiar with the Fadal and the 88HS in the Houston Area that can check the machine and perform an inspection?

Thanks,
Rev

[NismoGT]

It may help if you put a location.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rwskinner]

Sorry, copy and paste issue.
North Houston TX

[rwskinner]

This is pretty much what both sides of the X looked like and about what the Y (towards the operator) looked like. They were oily before i wiped them down.
Opinion?

The old panel isn't the cleanest I've seen but not real, real bad. They have some probe adapters and WiFi to Serial adapters and supplies laying in the bottom as well.

[NismoGT]

This is pretty much what both sides of the X looked like and about what the Y (towards the operator) looked like. They were oily before i wiped them down.
Opinion?

The old panel isn't the cleanest I've seen but not real, real bad. They have some probe adapters and WiFi to Serial adapters and supplies laying in the bottom as well.

The ways look fine to me. MUCH better than the condition of mine when I picked my VMC40 up. You can check out my prior posts to see the condition mine were in. I am by no means even a novice in CNC but your cabinet and ways look fine.

I am in MD and dont have any suggestions for a person to inspect the machine.

[ianagos]

I should mention parameters are listed inside the monitor cabinet. It’s common if the machine is power off for a while to lose the parameters. You’ll also get the zero memory error if you pull the cpu card out of the card cage. It’s no big deal just look up Fadal zero memory procedure on the google. Also all manuals are available free.

[rwskinner]

Thanks. Zeroed the memory and entered the params with setp and got it to come alive.

I ended up buying it. The price was fair enough that it left a little on the side for replacing the thrust bearings, support bearings, and freshening up the drawbar. I'm still a tad worried because I can tell the table was fly cut at one time. Hopefully that horrid "Turcite" word isn't in my immediate future!

I should have it back this weekend where it will have to stay on the trailer for awhile until it dries out some and I find a way to unload it. A 12k forklift is difficult to find around my town and they run about $1K per day on rental by the time they add the delivery and pickup charges. It's a full day charge regardless how long we use it.

More to come in the following days.....

[mmurray70]

Thanks. Zeroed the memory and entered the params with setp and got it to come alive.

I ended up buying it. The price was fair enough that it left a little on the side for replacing the thrust bearings, support bearings, and freshening up the drawbar. I'm still a tad worried because I can tell the table was fly cut at one time. Hopefully that horrid "Turcite" word isn't in my immediate future!

I should have it back this weekend where it will have to stay on the trailer for awhile until it dries out some and I find a way to unload it. A 12k forklift is difficult to find around my town and they run about $1K per day on rental by the time they add the delivery and pickup charges. It's a full day charge regardless how long we use it.

More to come in the following days.....

Congratulations on the purchase. I have a 94 4020, the Turcite on the table does not go the full length of the table like on older machines. If the table is centered, you will just see iron on bottom of the table, but if you move to the end of the travel I think you can see an inch or 2 of turcite. Im glad they did it this way, the turcite is normally sandwiched completely between 2 pieces of iron and probably much less likely to separate from the table compared to having nothing below it.

Another thing to check in 94 is the flexible oil line going to table. In your pic that shows X axis ways/springs etc. The flexible hose should run in the channel just behind the front spring. It tends to pop out, get tangled and torn off. I replaced mine with a flexible cable carrier to be sure it wouldnt tangle again. I used mcmaster number 4516T45. Pain in the ass to do it, but the original design really sucks, you need to fix it properly at some point.

Your backlash doesnt sound good. Check thrust bearings and couplers. If you replace thrust bearings, verify the new shim puts enough preload on the bearings. There is a 0.001" shim supplied with bearings, but i found it wasnt enough for my new bearings. Remove the cooling lines from ballscrews while your at it, just run cooler to spindle only. The coolant leaks and takes out bearings. Also look close at couplers. They are weak on the 94's and tend to loosen up on the ballscrew. Consider adding another set screw 90 degrees apart and assemble everything with red loctite, put it between coupler and ballscrew as well, not just on screws. Not a bad idea to replace the rubber spiders, or if your cheap, cut and carefully bend shim stock around the lobes of one half of the coupler to tighten it up. I re-balled the Z and Y axis screws in my 4020, was fairly easy and made the screw alot tighter. After all that I have less then a 0.001 backlash now. Good luck with the machine, hope you enjoy it.

[rwskinner]

So I'm going to try and get a fork lift out here tomorrow and get this thing set inside the shop.

All I have is some solid 1"x3" rectangle bar I can use for the lifting slots in the base. The slots are 2x4 in the base.
Do you all think the 1x3 solid bar is stout enough? Planned to use some wood between the forks and steel bar to keep it from sliding.

Wish me luck.

Richard

[NismoGT]

So I'm going to try and get a fork lift out here tomorrow and get this thing set inside the shop.

All I have is some solid 1"x3" rectangle bar I can use for the lifting slots in the base. The slots are 2x4 in the base.
Do you all think the 1x3 solid bar is stout enough? Planned to use some wood between the forks and steel bar to keep it from sliding.

Wish me luck.

Richard

I heard that thick wall pipe is actually stronger than solid bar. I moved my machine with rectangular pipe because that is what the previous owner used with great success. No signs of excess stress.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ianagos]

I heard that thick wall pipe is actually stronger than solid bar. I moved my machine with rectangular pipe because that is what the previous owner used with great success. No signs of excess stress.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That’s interesting so are you of the opinion that a heavy wall 2x4” tube is stronger than a solid 2x4 bar? I have some solid 2x3 that I have set aside for when it comes time and I get a new machine. I figure solid could only be stronger than tube.

[mmurray70]

That’s interesting so are you of the opinion that a heavy wall 2x4” tube is stronger than a solid 2x4 bar? I have some solid 2x3 that I have set aside for when it comes time and I get a new machine. I figure solid could only be stronger than tube.

You cant take material away and end up stronger. Solid is always stronger for the same dimensions. That being said, not by as much as you would expect. And slighter larger hollow sections can be stronger. For example 1.25" dia tube with 0.125 wall is actually stronger then 1" solid.

Good luck moving it Richard

[NismoGT]

You cant take material away and end up stronger. Solid is always stronger for the same dimensions. That being said, not by as much as you would expect. And slighter larger hollow sections can be stronger. For example 1.25" dia tube with 0.125 wall is actually stronger then 1" solid.

Good luck moving it Richard

After more research, it looks like for stock of the same mass, will be stronger at a tube than solid...to a point. There are a lot of variables. But I’m sure your solid will be fine.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rwskinner]

It's on the ground and push into place on the jacking screws.
Is it okay to wire it for 240 3P and continue using the 500v MOV board so I can move it and get it unblocked and level?
I ordered a new board but it will be the end of week before it makes it in.

Richard

[rwskinner]

Question about the spindle motor. Nowhere does my machine say it's an HT, but, the original manuals that came with the machine shows it has a Freqrol Mitsubishi VFD but mine has a 20 HP Baldor VFD installed.
Someone hand wrote -HT in the parts manual. Was my system updated to a HT Spindle?

I was also told it had Rigid tapping but from looking at the Spindle card it doesn't appear to have RT.

Insight always appreciated.
Richard

[rwskinner]

A few pics and a few questions....

1) Do I have Inch or Metric screws? They are pretty course looking but in SetP it says Inch, but I did loose all the parameters and there is nothing regarding that in the pendant label. I do have 3/8" rubber lines running to the X axis but it was bypassed. Nothing going to the Y but it does run up to the spindle.

2) Stupid question - I have all the way covers off except the Y+. I have it disconnected from the saddle but how does it come loose from the enclosure?

3) Picture of my VFD. Looks to be an upgraded spindle and drive. HT ?

I got it wired and moved it around some so I could unblock it.

Lots of aluminum chips to clean out and sticky, gummy coolant.. Lube pump just blow air out everywhere. I guess that's coming apart next.

This machine did second ops in a turbine factory. I was told it sat idle for awhile after the machinist retired. It was there last Fadal. Everything else in there were pretty much Haas the new machinist runs a Haas and is lost around the Fadal.

[rwskinner]

The forklift they sent out wasn't the straight mast I was told, it was a telelift so about all I could do is get it off the trailer and sat inside the door. Then I used the old fashion method to roll it into place!

[mmurray70]

Looks to be metric screws. I think its 10mm pitch on X/Y if they are metric, easy to check with calipers.

Have a look at the spindle motor tag for HP to be sure. It probably is a HT but it is possible that the drive was changed, and they used a larger VFD because it was in stock, a spair, or a good deal or something. A larger VFD can still easily run a smaller motor. Also, the HT models have a air/hydraulic booster for the high/low range tensioners.

[ianagos]

Looks to be metric screws. I think its 10mm pitch on X/Y if they are metric, easy to check with calipers.

Have a look at the spindle motor tag for HP to be sure. It probably is a HT but it is possible that the drive was changed, and they used a larger VFD because it was in stock, a spair, or a good deal or something. A larger VFD can still easily run a smaller motor. Also, the HT models have a air/hydraulic booster for the high/low range tensioners.

Pretty sure the non ht models also had the hydraulic gear range from what I know.

Here is info on the ballscrew
https://www.fadalcnc.com/media/pdf/Ballscrews.pdf

[rwskinner]

Spindle motor - 15 hp Baldor motor.

Gear Change Mechanism - Pneumatic Solenoids and rollers.

Ballscrews - So I made 1 turn of the ballscrew moved me 0.394" so I guess it is metric screws at 10mm pitch.
I took apart the lube pump and cleaned it all out and got it working. When I press the solenoid manual button, pressure jumps up to about 180# and stays there for a few seconds then drops to zero. Not see much lube at the ways.
I guess I might as well replace all the lines and clean the manifolds while I'm in there. Anyone know what size lines those are and how much I need?

New problem, since I sealed up the lube pump, one of the air cylinders on the speed changer is blowing out the stem seal. Cylinders look like they are crimped together but I hadn't tried to take one apart yet.

Still cleaning!!!

Richard