[Sparky_NY]

I decided to post the retrofit I am doing of a V2E3 bridgeport with a Boss 8 control. It is a servo machine with powertron servo's.

I have a series 1 manual machine I retrofitted a couple years ago with steppers/gecko's and mach3 control. Although I have been pleased with the results of that retrofit, the machine has horrible Y axis ways, badly scored. The V2E3 was owned by a friend who bought it new in 1985 for his shop and has not used it for years since he upgraded equipment. I got the V2E3 in trade for electrical work connecting his new haas machines.

The original game plan was to remove the steppers, drives, ballscrews and head from my stepper machine and transfer the parts to the V2E3. The V2E3 ways were like brand new and that was what really appealed to me. Well, after getting the V2E3 in my garage and looking things over it became clear that putting my old steppers on it would not be a simple matter. After much thought and research the decision was made to just retrofit the V2E3 from scratch using its original servos and new electronics.

Although the V2E3 was in operating condition, I decided to replace all the electronics and use Mach3 for control. Mach has worked out well on the stepper machines retrofit.

I will make seperate posts detailing the retrofit and its various steps.

I did not take a picture of the V2E3 prior to stripping it down but found a pic on the net which shows what the machine looked like before I started.

[Sparky_NY]

I went over the machine and became familiar with its hardware. The X servo motor had its encoder broken in one of the machines prior moves. I pulled all 3 servo motors and ordered all new timing belts for good measure.

Next, I pulled all the electronics out, and removed both of the LARGE control cabinets from the machine. The decision was made to reuse the rear cabinet that originally housed the oil pump and various electronics with 2 seperate doors. I cut that cabinet in half just under the upper compartments floor to get it to a size that would fit in my congested garage easier. The electronics cabinet for the retrofit will not be mounted on the mill but on the wall next to the mill for space reasons.

The original servo power supply is being reused with additional capacitors being added to get to the level of filtering recommended by the new drive manufacturer. I "snuck" the 4 additional caps up inside the underside of the original supply. The new caps are just visable under the left bottom of the power supply. The servo power transformer is mounted to the floor of the enclosure as is the 120Volt output transformer from the original machine. One of the original assemblies, a power supply that provides +5 +12, -12, -5 regulated was reused and mounted in the upper right corner.

Just under that low voltage power supply is a smoothstepper pc board that will be used to interface to the laptop running Mach3. Two breakout boards will mount in the same area, a C10 and a C11 type breakout board. Researching the matter found that using the parallel port to drive the servo drives would be pushing the speed limit of the parallel port and thus the decision to use a smoothstepper usb adapter was made.

Here are a couple pics of the cut down enclosure with the servo supply at the top, the transformers, etc. Also a pic of the V2E3 after the original cabinets were removed and the machine cleaned up.

[Sparky_NY]

I researched the possibility of reusing the existing servo drives and studied the schematics but found it was not a workable idea. The normal servo drive functions are not solely on the drive boards but scattered about 3-4 boards. The drives were NOT NC400 drives that some bridgeports use but bridgeports own design I believe.

I researched the possibilities for new drives which are very limited due to the powertron servo motors being high voltage and current. I stumbled on a newly available drive just by accident and after carefully looking into them decided they would be the "hot ticket". The drives I decided to use are marketed by cncdrive.com under the model name Dugong. These drives have more features, better programming software, better protective features and are quite a bit cheaper than the other choices out there. Their programming software even allows real time monitoring of performance and uses a standard usb interface. The drives (4 pcs, one for future knee power) will be mounted along the ceiling of the enclosure on a 5/8 alum plate for heatsinking.

Here is a link to their website for more info on the drives: http://www.cncdrive.com/

Here is a review of this and other drives which originally called my attention to this new drive.
http://www.machsupport.com/forum/ind...c,12233.0.html

Balazs Klincsik, of cncdrive.com has been extremely helpfull in answering my many "dummy" questions and concerns. Servos are new to me.

As for encoders, there is a fairly new encoder out there that is capacitive rather than optical and has selectable resolution, known as AMT103 which is marketed by Digikey and only costs $30 !! The famous "Marris" of gecko drive fame highly rated these encoders here in the forum and that finalized my decision.

I took apart the one encoder that was broken and quickly realized that the powertron servo motors are not made the same as most. There is no shaft protruding out the end for purposes of driving a encoder. The encoder uses the motor endcap as its frame along with a removable "hub". That hub has 2 bearings that hold the end of a helical coupler inside the motor. The helical coupler has a integral 1/4 shaft turned into the body of the coupler. That shaft does not protrude out the end of the housing, the optical encoder disk mounted to it with a screw into a tapped hole in the shaft center. The encoder PCB screwed up against the hub. If you remove the hub from the motor end cap you are left with about a 3" hole in the endcap. I decided to order conventional new helical couplings which I will mount the same way but put a longer shaft into the one end so it protrudes beyond the cast hub. I can then machine the hub flat and mount a thin aluminum plate on it to which the AMD encoder can be mounted and then reuse the original encoder cover assembly.

Here is a link to the AMD encoder: http://www.digikey.com/scripts/DkSea...me=102-1308-ND

Here are some pics of the motor/encoder/original helical coupling etc. which should help make things more clear. The one pic shows the black AMD encoder next to the motor endhub, its only slightly larger than a quarter!

[Sparky_NY]

My servo drives have been shipped and are on the way. The helical couplings to mount the encoders are also on the way. I will post more pics and info when they arrive and I get them mounted up.

I snagged on fleabay, for just over $100 , a brand new AB brush servo, 40lb torque! with other ratings about the same as the powertrons except slower at 2500rpm. I set this under the bench for future use in powering the knee.

I have a stepper powered 6" vertex rotary table from my other retrofit that I will use with the V2E3 using a gecko stepper drive and small power supply.

Suggestions and comments are of course welcome.

[CNCISME]

Hello Sparky this is my second post..... just did one at the clubhouse.
I also have a BOSS 8 and hope to do a Mach 3 conversion so am glad to see you are here to lead me through the jungle. Seems like there is enough info here to help convert stepper machines but not so much here on servo driven units like ours. My uncle is an E.E. and a novice machinist .... he has a BOSS 9 R2E3 that he is thinking about converting to Mach 3 ..... so far he is still just a big lurker here.... hopefully in the future he will be more of an asset !!!!

Well ... so anyway glad to see you are making gains with your Machizing!

My machine belonged to a tech school and also is in exceptional condition and well worth investing in to make more efficient and easy to operate.

[Sparky_NY]

Looks very nice. Did you get the maintenance manual with it? That has the schematics etc. and comes in handy. The machine is a fast 250 IPM in stock form and might do even better with aftermarket drives.

Hey! Just for kicks, what is the serial# of your machine? (its on the top of the knee, in front). Mine is 125 and I ran into another fellow that has 112. These are pretty rare machines and I suspect they started at #100.

My helical couplers came today for the encoders, but I am tied up for the next couple days. I'll get them mounted though by the weekend and post some pics.

Hello Sparky this is my second post..... just did one at the clubhouse.
I also have a BOSS 8 and hope to do a Mach 3 conversion so am glad to see you are here to lead me through the jungle. Seems like there is enough info here to help convert stepper machines but not so much here on servo driven units like ours. My uncle is an E.E. and a novice machinist .... he has a BOSS 9 R2E3 that he is thinking about converting to Mach 3 ..... so far he is still just a big lurker here.... hopefully in the future he will be more of an asset !!!!

Well ... so anyway glad to see you are making gains with your Machizing!

My machine belonged to a tech school and also is in exceptional condition and well worth investing in to make more efficient and easy to operate.

[Aplus]

Sparky_NY I sent you a PM about your Encoders. Can you check your PM's?

[CNCISME]

Hey! Just for kicks, what is the serial# of your machine?

Sparky my S/N is 193

There has been a V2E3 on fleabay for over a month .... buy now price is something over three grand. Also there was one just sold in Michigan from the cnczone classifieds and I may be able to contact the buyer because I talked to the seller over the phone a few times .... that one sold for $1000.

My mill came with all four manuals and some extra schematics also. My machine has the Erickson quick change and flood coolant along with about $300 worth of NMTB 30 holders . I paid $1750 for it but it does alarm when you rapid in Z so I need to do some fixing .... I need to get a phase converter first .... and am trying to decide whether to go rotary or electronic (but not static).

Hey just for fun do you know what these cost new? Mine was purchased by a vo-tech early in 1985 ..... I am wondering if Bridgeport gave the school a special price .... but the price they quoted the school in a letter dated Oct. 1984 was $25,995

[redford1955]

i also have a bridgepoprt V2E3, ser. no. 295. the shop where i worked purchased it new in 1984. with roto-phase, tooling package, spray mist, and chip guard, the price was around $32,000.
we have retrofitted it a few years ago with Mach 3 and Rutex 990 drives. we use it for 3D machining of aluminum and it has been very reliable. probably runs about 500 hrs. per year.
i am anxious to see how your mill turns out with newer drives and smooth stepper. i may have to upgrade it again.

thank you
keith

[Sparky_NY]

I received the minature helical couplings I bought on fleabay and got the one encoder/motor done. I only did the one motor for now, it had its encoder broken during storage anyways.

I was originally going to reuse the metal hub that housed the BEI original encoder but it proved to be more trouble than just making a new encoder mount. I went to the lathe and turned up a hub similar to the BEI encoder hub, used the same 2 flanged bearings in the hub and dropped the bolt pattern for the AMD encoder into it along with the 2 holes to hold the original BEI cover assembly with its connector. I put a piece of 1/4 shaft into the helical coupler and attached it to the motor shaft in the same manner as the BEI was mounted.

For now, I set the AMD to 2048 line encoding. I couldn't decide to use 1000 or 2048 line but seen that the ajax retrofit for the stock bridgeport servos uses a 2000 line encoder so that is what made me decide to go with 2048 lines (count actually, there are no lines in a capacitive encoder)

The dugong drives I have ordered come with a single ended to quad line driver board, very tiny that can mount in the encoder end cover. I will reuse the original bridgeport cables (twisted pairs inside) and connectors.

Here are some pics: The new helical coupler with 1/4 shaft installed,
the newly turned hub assembly, the AMD encoder and finally the entire unit with the original BEI cover installed. With the BEI cover installed you would never know there was something hotrodded under the hood.

The drives should be here in a few days, then I will power the one motor up (less belt at first), get it dialed in and test it on the X axis. Assuming all works out well, I will then modify the other 2 motors in the same way.

[autorouter34]

[QUOTE=CNCISME;692142]Sparky my S/N is 193

hi CNCISME, the v2e3 mill from michigan that you mention. did you talk to a man name BOB MURPHY. i recently bought a v2e3 from BOB MURPHY in Saginaw Michigan. he post it on craigslist for $1000. the mill is a little dirty, but still run great. i just made a serial cable to connect to port B for loading cnc program. the v2e3 can only take around 600 line of Gcode or 12000 character. i also run large program with 25000 line of Gcode through DNC link and it work great. i still have all the information on the serial cable and DNC link program if you need it, just email me.

[CNCISME]

Hey Autorouter Bob is the man and you got a buy ! .... I was thinking of buying that V2E3 so I would have spare parts but instead decided to invest the money into a retrofit next year. I have the cable and software to drip feed and just got a deal on Bobcad but need to order my phase converter so hope to be under power by Xmas...

LOL this thread of Sparky's is looking more like the V2E3 Boss 8 Clubhouse...

BTW what is the serial number on your machine ?

[srbliss]

Have you considered using EMC2 for control? EMC2 directly supports servos and seems ideal for retrofitting an old servo based machine, the price is right to - free! I am will be using it along with pico-systems electronics on my Boss 5 conversion. This combination allows you to use cheap +10/-10V servo amps vs. new expensive PWM amps. If you like I have some new amps that I will sell you cheap.
Steve

[Sparky_NY]

Have you considered using EMC2 for control? EMC2 directly supports servos and seems ideal for retrofitting an old servo based machine, the price is right to - free! I am will be using it along with pico-systems electronics on my Boss 5 conversion. This combination allows you to use cheap +10/-10V servo amps vs. new expensive PWM amps. If you like I have some new amps that I will sell you cheap.
Steve

The machine is up and running under Mach3 and performing extremely well.
I will be posting more pics very soon along with more details.

The dugong drives were quite cheap and I am extremely pleased with their performance. They are PWM and loaded with features.

[srbliss]

I didn't notice your mill has DC servos. My amps are for AC brushless. If were using DC servos I think I would have made the exact choice that you did. Please post some pics - I need a little nudge to work on my project.
Steve

[Sparky_NY]

Here are some pics of the dugong drives. I mounted them all to a 3/4 aluminum plate which mounts to the top inside of the cabinet. This is more heat sinking than is necessary but more can't hurt and it provides a nice solid mounting method.

The other pic shows the drives and their alum plate mounted inside the cabinet along the ceiling.

The mill is now up and running nicely, I am very happy with it. I will be posting more pics/info shortly.

[Sparky_NY]

Here are some pics of the cabinet inside.

There is a C10 bob mounted to the side of the original bridgeport power supply. I used the c10 for the step/dir outputs to the servo drives and gecko stepper drive. The drives don't need opto isolation because it is internal.

On the rear panel, at the right is the smoothstepper board with ribbon cables connecting it to the C10 and C11 bob's. The C11 was used for outputs to the VFD spindle drive, the tool touchplate, limit switch inputs and estop circuit. All the limits and estop are run on 24V for noise immunity.

On the floor of the cabinet is the original Bridgeport servo power transformer, a smaller 240 to 120V stepdown transformer and on the right is a small powersupply with the gecko 201 stepper drive that is used for my 4th axis.

The 4th axis is a 6 inch vertex rotary table with stepper drive that I made.

There is a lot of stuff in that cabinet! It is one of the original cabinets which I cut in half (height wise) and put wheels on the bottom in case I need to pull it out for servicing. The cabinet is approx 2ft square and a foot deep, it sits against the wall next to the mill taking up little space and allowing the mill to sit much closer to the wall.

[Sparky_NY]

Here are some pics of the mill.

One is of the X motor servo drive, one of the head and Z motor, one a front view of the whole mill. A pic of my 4th axis vertex rotary table with stepper drive setting up on the mill table is also shown.

On the head, I removed the original air cylinder for the brake, replacing it with a standard lever from a manual head. I also removed the air turbine motor that changed spindle speed replacing it with the standard round crank. I have a VFD for the spindle and cover a range of 1000 to 5500 rpm without changing the belt drive ratio and 100 to 700 rpm in backgear at the same belt setting. I had this same setup on my other retrofit and never found a need to ever move the speed on the head itself, the VFD does it all nicely leaving the head set at approx 3300rpm on the dial.

I installed a 4th dugong servo drive for future use in powering the knee. Mach3 will send the tool length offset only to the knee motor keeping normal Z moves on the quill. I already got a 40lb servo, brand new, on fleabay for the purpose and will be doing the knee retrofit pretty soon. I have 250lb gas struts to counterbalance the knee weight for better performance.

[Sparky_NY]

All the wiring is done and the mill has been tested. The dugong drives worked out fantastic. I set the rapids for 250ipm, the same as the original spec (and plenty fast enough for me!). The encoders are set for 2048 counts and the dugong drives set for X2 resolution giving 4096 counts/rev of the motor.

The first thing I noticed is how quiet servos are! I was used to stepper machines that sounded like someone playing a organ. The machine at speeds up to 100ipm is so quiet that the fan inside the VFD for the spindle drowns out the sounds.

I set the steps per to the mathamatical result for the screw pitch, 2:1 belt drive and encoder resolution. Using jo blocks and a tenth indicator it positions within 2 tenths for every test I did. Backlash seems to also be around 2 tenths which makes me very pleased. It is so accurate that it is very difficult to measure any error.

In my tests, I initially found the Y axis was not repeating and also made some strange growling noises. I pulled the belt drive assembly off and the ballscrew bearings. The bearings were slightly rough under pressure so I put a set of plain old 7204 angular bearings in for test purposes which quieted things down and made the positioning repeat nicely. That confrimed the bearings were bad. I found a set of those ultra quality 20TAC47 ballscrew bearings on ebay which are on the way as a final fix. I believe the cause of the bearings going bad was the grease being somewhat dried out and displaced away from the actual bearing raceways. The mill is a 1985 so that is not suprising. I will be pulling the X bearings very soon to clean and repack them with fresh grease while they are still good.

I ran peck drill tests, and circle pocket tests with 8" diameter and 100ipm feed rate. All tests were smooth, accurate and without any concerns. I also ran a repeating loop of rapid moves for several minutes during which the drives remained at room temperature.

I really love the dugong drives. They work fantastic, the software to tune them is very nice and the best part is the drives are extremely reasonable in cost. Support is outstanding to put it mildly.

I am in the process of putting together a enclosure for the table to keep the chips contained and will then do some metal cutting.

[autorouter34]

Great job on the retrofit Sparky_NY. i am looking to do a retrofit like your in the future. right now i am still trying to find an electrical schematic for the controller.

anyone you you guys have the electrical schematic/manual for the v2e3 controller?

i have the program and the operator manual only and it does not help when it come to troubleshooting.