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IndustryArena Forum > MetalWorking Machines > Benchtop Machines > New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Hello,

    I'm a new member and i hope someone could help me or point me i the right direction.

    I recently bought a used Optimum BF 46 Vario from 2007 fitted with stepper motors from optimum controlled by optimum controller IV.

    I use UCCNC together with UC100 motion controller and Fusion 360 for CAD/CAM.

    I´ve got the x,y,z axis to work but i don´t know how to connect the spindle to the controller IV and setup with UCCNC or if even is possible.

    Is there anyone here with a Optimum mill that uses Controller IV or anyone who got a good guess.

    Info on the optimum controller IV:

    The Unit has:
    1 X parallel ports named port 1 (25pin)
    9 pin connection plug for a three axis point of origin
    4 X slots for the stepper motor cards (I am using 3)
    1 X relay port, potetial free relay output (8 outputs/pins)

    Pin assignments for the DB 25 male is
    Pin Application Description
    1 RELAY Switch output eg (motor on)
    2 Direction X axis
    3 Cycle X axis
    4 Direction Y axis
    5 Cycle Y axis
    6 Direction Z axis
    7 Cycle Z axis
    8 4th Axis
    9 4th Axis
    10 Free
    11 References switch Z
    12 References switch Y
    13 References switch X
    14 RELAY Output eg coolant
    15 Reference switch 4th axis
    16 - 24 Free
    25 OV DC, Earthing

    The 9 pin connection pins are as follows for the reference switches
    1 X1 Machine point of origin port 1 X Axis
    2 Y1 Machine point of origin port 1 Y Axis
    3 Z1 Machine point of origin port 1 Z Axis
    4 ROUND TABLE
    5 +12V DC
    6 X2 Machine point of origin port 2 X Axis
    7 Y2 Machine point of origin port 2 Y Axis
    8 Z2 Machine point of origin port 2 Z Axis
    9 OV DC


    I would like to controll the spindle speed, direction and on/off from within UCCNC.


    Greetings from Sweden.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    So i do this with the c76 board from cnc4pc. But on a KBIC controller. On a g0704.

    Chances are high that you have a KBIC clone controller inside the spindle control box.

    If so, yes you can control spindle speed this way. I chose only a forward direction but it may be doable to do both. Please advise if a KBIC controller is inside your motor box.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Hi,

    Thanks for the response.

    How do i know if i have a KBIC clone controller?

    Best Regards

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    KBIC-125 (9433) DC Drives Chassis https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007ZQLJM0..._6P3VCbMZS9BBP

    It will look like this for the most part. Hear sink for the mosfets and this mounting pattern. Take a pic and post it please.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Thanks,

    Here is a pic.

    Best Regards
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20190412_180509.jpg  

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    That is much fancier than a KBIC. It probably has an integrated LCD for spindle speed.

    Is optimum still in business? And any chance you can find a part number on this board?

    I’m guessing the thick wires on the left go to the motor, and that it is a 4 conductor motor?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    222

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Yes it has a display for spindle speed, Optimum is still in business but are not very helpful (dosen't answer).

    Yes i got a hold of a manual and the Part nr is 03021303201

    I also got a hold of the wiring diagram. se pic

    I took a pic of the motorplate.

    Best Regards

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    I'm sorry i wrote Controller VI but it is the VI i've got.

    Thanks anyway.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Interesting. That is a 2.2KW closed loop BLDC drive.

    X3 is motor drive power.

    X7 is the hall effect sensor for the motor.

    Are the X* connections marked on the main board?

    It says X6 is going to a 12 pin or more connector - would that be the bundle of pink wires?

    And does the motor control box have a general purpose connector on it anywhere? One that goes back to Controller VI?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Okey,

    I don't think the X connections are marked, but i will have a look tomorrow.

    Yes X6 is most likely the bundle of pink wires, i'm attaching two pics.

    I'm pretty sure that the motor controllbox doesen't have a general purpose connector on it, I will have a extra look tomorrow.

    The only cabel that goes from the motor controlbox to the Controller VI is the emergency stop (the grey cable)

    I guess it's via the relay outputs on the controller VI i should controll the spindle (No 7 in the picture of the controller)

  12. #12
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    So here is my analysis of whats going on so far:

    1. Your Controller VI may not control the spindle at all. Nothing. It may only want to control the axis motion.

    2. You have a standard on/off switch, estop mechanism as well. We can ignore these for now.

    3. You will need to figure out exactly what your reversing switch does. Does it send a control signal to the board saying "forward/rearward motion" or does it actually swap the polarity on the motor inputs. Seems like it might be control signals based on how the motor is wired up. You should look up its part number if you can find it, and check its behavior with a meter to see what it does.

    4. The hardest thing will be dealing with the potentiometer that controls spindle speed. It may have its resistance measured by the RPM display board and send a digital signal back to the controller to adjust the spindle speed.

    Can you send a picture of the back of the RPM display?

    Thanks for your patience.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    8

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Hi,

    I've had a extra look.

    The only cabels that is going in and out of the controlbox is:

    In: main power

    Out: Cabels to the motor, emergency stop, cabels to the display for fine feed of spindle sleve

    There is no general purpose connector or similar.

    The X connections are marked on the bord, some are almost not visable anymore. Se pics of X3, X6 and X7

    I've taken a pic of the back of the LCD-display


    I should be thanking you for you're patience!

    Best Regards

  14. #14
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    So controlling spindle operation will be doable via analysis of your reversing switch.

    This switch will most likely have a voltage or ground that is switched when you turn it. This will be hooked to relays used to control spindle direction. You may need a third relay to do spindle on-off.

    The other part of it is that potentiometer. You should check what’s it’s input voltage is and what happens when you turn it. It may be possible to use a PWM spindle controller hooked to that switch to change the speed.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    https://cnc4pc.com/c6-variable-speed-control-board.html

    This is the control board I use for this.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    33

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Also a point of annoyance - your controller may closed loop operation. Or the encoder may only drive the LCD.

    The mechanism I use does not support closed loop - and you cannot do closed loop straight off of the UC100 unit with the encoder feedback. That means no rigid tapping. Only the UC300 is powerful enough.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    178

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Ok forget the KBIC controller!! These drivers are used on the optimum Vario lathes and is useless for what you want.

    Depending on your setup you can drive the board with your controller. I use pico systems breakout boards. In my case I made a board to replaced the switches with relays (see pic), but If you don't want to make this board, you can buy the C6 board which will do the job.

    Attached is a circuit diag for you.

    Cheers
    Stephen
    Attachment 425242Attachment 425244Attachment 425246

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Posts
    943

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Quote Originally Posted by vectorsc View Post
    Also a point of annoyance - your controller may closed loop operation. Or the encoder may only drive the LCD.

    The mechanism I use does not support closed loop - and you cannot do closed loop straight off of the UC100 unit with the encoder feedback. That means no rigid tapping. Only the UC300 is powerful enough.
    The UC100 has spindle encoder setting so it can do rigid tapping. It does not have the spindle PID setting though what the UC400ETH has.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    178

    Re: New member - Spindle setup Optimum BF 46 with UCCNC

    Quote Originally Posted by vectorsc View Post
    Also a point of annoyance - your controller may closed loop operation. Or the encoder may only drive the LCD.

    The mechanism I use does not support closed loop - and you cannot do closed loop straight off of the UC100 unit with the encoder feedback. That means no rigid tapping. Only the UC300 is powerful enough.
    Just to clarify things. The feedback from these motors is a tachometer... it is not an encoder, so forget that idea about rigid tapping. The Optimum board being discussed monitors speed and will adjust torque according.

    You can do G84 tapping with this motor and in the video you will notice the torque kick in when speed drops.

    https://youtu.be/FR-_Kr4iZms

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by FastFarmer View Post
    Ok forget the KBIC controller!! These drivers are used on the optimum Vario lathes and is useless for what you want.

    Depending on your setup you can drive the board with your controller. I use pico systems breakout boards. In my case I made a board to replaced the switches with relays (see pic), but If you don't want to make this board, you can buy the C6 board which will do the job.

    Attached is a circuit diag for you.

    Cheers
    Stephen
    Attachment 425242Attachment 425244Attachment 425246
    Hi Stephen, picture appear to be no longer available. Would appreciate it if you could upload them again. I will be in Victoria in April/May this year and would love to catch up with you to see how your BF46 is running

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