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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    1740

    CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    I have a Plug and Play NEMA 34 system on my FLA 48x48 router. The system is 1.5 years old but had been running on Mach3, Thanks to GME and others I switched it over last fall to Mach4. Is there a add in or plug in, macro to add the CNCRP touch plate routine to my un-official Mach4? I have emailed them but no response so far, and I assume they are busy as usual. I know they have done their flavor of Mach4 but I really do not want to redo it all over!
    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    841

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by wmgeorge View Post
    I have a Plug and Play NEMA 34 system on my FLA 48x48 router. The system is 1.5 years old but had been running on Mach3, Thanks to GME and others I switched it over last fall to Mach4. Is there a add in or plug in, macro to add the CNCRP touch plate routine to my un-official Mach4? I have emailed them but no response so far, and I assume they are busy as usual. I know they have done their flavor of Mach4 but I really do not want to redo it all over!
    Bill, I don't believe you need a "routine" to run Avid's touch plate. You can just use Mach4's "Touch" subscreen. Here's a screen shot of the Mach4 screen:



    Under the blue screen, see the button called "Touch." Also, see the 4 little boxes above it. The box corresponding to the way you added your probe will turn on upon contact. Pressing the "Touch Button" will open a screen where you set your probe feed rate, offsets, and execute various touch moves. It's all built into a Mach4 canned macro. Works great.

    Here's a screen print of the Touch Screen:


    The Avid Touch Plate is not special, in so far as the way it is set up and used. What's special is some macro and screen modification Avid did. Avid's is nice, but not needed. The generic Mach4 Touch screen will allow you to fully use the Avid plate. If you are like me, the only routines you are likely to use with any regularity will be the center finding (the circle above that looks like cross hairs) and the Z=0 function (lower right hand corner). I believe there is some info about Touch module in the Mach4 docs subdirectory. I recall reading it. I believe it is the TouchOffHelp.PDF file.

    Hope this helps.

    Gary



  3. #3
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    Sep 2005
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    1740

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Thanks Gary that helps. At least I know it will work as is. I may hold off ordering the plate until this spring. Was planning on selling the machine in prep for moving to a townhouse, but thats on hold for now. Had some minor surgery the other day and under orders to slow down.
    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    841

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by wmgeorge View Post
    Thanks Gary that helps. At least I know it will work as is. I may hold off ordering the plate until this spring. Was planning on selling the machine in prep for moving to a townhouse, but thats on hold for now. Had some minor surgery the other day and under orders to slow down.


    Sorry to hear about your having surgery. Aging is a b**ch. Get well soon.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    59

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Hello, Just saw this thread pop up and had a question about touch plates and tool changing in Mach 4. I'm running Mach 3 with the 2010 ScreenSet by Ger21. I love the Semi-Auto Tool Change feature that uses a work zero touch plate AND a fixed plate, off to the side to re-zero after tool change. I'd like to upgrade to Mach 4, eventually. So my question is, does Mach 4 have such a feature built in? If not, what do you recommend? Thanks!

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Posts
    841

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by ssw View Post
    Hello, Just saw this thread pop up and had a question about touch plates and tool changing in Mach 4. I'm running Mach 3 with the 2010 ScreenSet by Ger21. I love the Semi-Auto Tool Change feature that uses a work zero touch plate AND a fixed plate, off to the side to re-zero after tool change. I'd like to upgrade to Mach 4, eventually. So my question is, does Mach 4 have such a feature built in? If not, what do you recommend? Thanks!

    If Mach4 has it, I haven't found it. I believe such a feature could be written for Mach4, but I haven't found anyone who has done it. Requires some skill writing in LUA. I sure don't have it, and don't have the time to try to learn it. Having used Mach3 in the past, Mach4 is far better IMO. Unfortunately, it appears to lack this one feature. On the other hand, it has a very robust "Touch" screen option.

    Gary

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    205

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Avid has their own version of Mach4 that includes this feature. Same price as Artsoft with Avid support. Avid's 4th axis setup also included.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    59

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by GME View Post

    If Mach4 has it, I haven't found it. I believe such a feature could be written for Mach4, but I haven't found anyone who has done it. Requires some skill writing in LUA. I sure don't have it, and don't have the time to try to learn it. Having used Mach3 in the past, Mach4 is far better IMO. Unfortunately, it appears to lack this one feature. On the other hand, it has a very robust "Touch" screen option.

    Gary
    Thanks Gary!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    59

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by MARV View Post
    Avid has their own version of Mach4 that includes this feature. Same price as Artsoft with Avid support. Avid's 4th axis setup also included.
    Hi Marv, I just read through the User Manual for the AvidCNC version of Mach4. It appears that they DO NOT have this feature. They ONLY provide a Tool Change location, NOT the additional fixed plate location to automatically Re-Zero the Z to the new tool. They instruct the user to manually Re-Zero with the movable touch-plate. If you have updated information contrary to this (I really hope you do), I'd love to have it. Thank you!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    1740

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Avid does indeed have the touch off plate in their version of Mach4. I have the plate on order, I just have not had the time to do the change over from the plain vanilla Mach4 to the Avid version yet. Research some more on Avid CNC RP website… its there.
    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP

  11. #11
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    Aug 2005
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    205

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Whoops, I misread the question. Just curious, if you look at Avid's implementation of their tool touch off for their 4th axis, is that akin to what you're referring to (I believe it may be a fixed re-zero tool change location)? Have you put the question to Avid? They've been fairly responsive to requests such as this. Just a thought.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    59

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by wmgeorge View Post
    Avid does indeed have the touch off plate in their version of Mach4. I have the plate on order, I just have not had the time to do the change over from the plain vanilla Mach4 to the Avid version yet. Research some more on Avid CNC RP website… its there.
    Hello, I don't think we're talking about the same thing. If we were, then you would be ordering TWO touch plates, one movable for zeroing your stock and one plate that is fixed/bolted to the side of your machine for automatic re-zeroing after tool changes. Are you familiar with the 2010 Screenset in Mach3?

    I have "talked" to AvidCNC a couple months ago, and at that time they DID NOT have a solution for the SECOND/FIXED touch plate. It was in the planning stages. I jumped into this thread because I thought that is what was being discussed.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    59

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Quote Originally Posted by MARV View Post
    Whoops, I misread the question. Just curious, if you look at Avid's implementation of their tool touch off for their 4th axis, is that akin to what you're referring to (I believe it may be a fixed re-zero tool change location)? Have you put the question to Avid? They've been fairly responsive to requests such as this. Just a thought.
    Hey, my mistake here. I thought this thread was about the implementation of a fixed (as in bolted down) "Tool Change" touch plate in Mach4. I've been waiting a long time. I've been using one for the last eight years in Mach3, via the 2010 ScreenSet macro. Can't live without it now!

    I will contact AvidCNC directly. You are absolutely correct, they are very responsive in customer service. Thanks!

  14. #14
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    Aug 2005
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    205

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    After a closer look at Avid's Youtube video of the set-up of their tool touch off plate on their 4th axis, its clear that they DON'T have an option for a FIXED tool touch off. They've placed their fixture on the tailstock end which is moveable to accommodate varying stock length. I initially thought that it had been mounted on the head stock end which would have made it fixed for the setup. I thought the code for the fixed plate might have been adaptable for a fixed plate tool re-zero on tool change on the XY machine bed. No question the fixed plate option would make manual tool change from within a program a bit faster. May also require a different call out (or change?) in the post processor? Thanks to those who are pursuing this thread, I'm still learning some of this stuff.

  15. #15
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    Sep 2005
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    1740

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    This is what I am talking about nothing to do with 4 axis? The Avid version of Mach4 has a built in routine to use to set Z zero and X & Y zero on the work.

    Attachment 433108
    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    205

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    I'll attempt to clarify and respond to the original post from this thread; What was asked (I believe) was if the Avid tool touch plate could be made functional in Mach4 from Artsoft. Information on the CNC Router Parts website of old detailed how a bit of code could be applied to an existing copy of Mach3 to allow Avid's device to work on other systems. Exactly what I ask of Avid directly in recent months as I have their plate, but hadn't set up Mach4 yet (I've never run Mach3 - my CNC is in progress). The response from Avid was that the code is now "baked in" to their copy of Mach4 and the "cut and paste" approach possible with Mach3 wouldn't work. I chose to down load a demo of Avid's Mach4. Given that I will probably use their 4th axis (also made functional in their version of Mach4), I'll probably stick with it.

    Another post in this thread asked if there was a routine where the touch plate could be used in a fixed position (a fixed reference point) presumably to facilitate manual tool changes called during a machining operation (I hope I got that right). In one of Avid's Youtube videos explaining the set-up of their 4th axis, I thought I remembered seeing such a routine. Had that been the case (it was not), a request to Avid to extend that capability to a user definable XY location for tool changes for "normal" 3 axis work might have been easy. I don't speak for Avid, but that request would seem to be a reasonable one to my way of thinking.

  17. #17
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    Sep 2005
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    1740

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Had that been the case (it was not), a request to Avid to extend that capability to a user definable XY location for tool changes for "normal" 3 axis work might have been easy. I don't speak for Avid, but that request would seem to be a reasonable one to my way of thinking.

    The touch plate and ( I am still waiting for mine) , is designed to set the work piece x-y corner and work piece Z zero. As I understand the final setting of the work piece Z zero after the touch off, is dependent on the distance you enter in the set up. So you could use those zero points for your manual tool change. Or you can use the Home for the machine location for your tool change point.
    Retired Master Electrician, HVAC/R Commercial. FLA Saturn 2 4x4 CNC Router Mach4 Kimber 1911 45ACP

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
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    841

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    On other point of clarification. While Avid's GUI allows for setting X, Y and Z =0 with their movable touch plate, so does the native Mach4 setup. It is accessed under the "Touch" module. I know, because I don't use Avid's GUI, but am able to do the same axes=0 very quickly and easily through the "Touch" module. Also, it doesn't require Avid's touch plate to do it. I use The Maker's guide and it works just fine.

    The Mach4 zeroing routine works essentially the same as Mach3 with the Big Tex Blue Screen. I know, because I used the Big Tex Blue screen before migrating/upgrading to Mach4. I'm talking about the basic zeroing routine, not zeroing on a rotary axis.

    None of what I've written should be taken as a criticism of Avid's GUI. It's just another interface used to access what Mach4 does natively. Nothing wrong with that. Pretty clearly, the Avid setup is designed for use with their control boxes, which seems to me like good customer service - something Avid has a reputation for providing. I didn't find Mach4 all that difficult to set up, but there is certainly room for confusion and frustration. Avid's setup allows users of their control boxes to avoid most, if not all of that. Again, good customer service and striving to further their Plug & Play philosophy.

    Gary


  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    205

    Re: CNC RP/Avid Touch Plate

    Hey SSW, could you elaborate on your fixed plate routine? I don't anticipate adding an auto tool change spindle (can't afford it), but if there was an option to call a macro for a manual/semi auto tool change that would be great. For instance; with an M06 call, the spindle did a Z retract, spindle off, rapid to a fixed location tool plate (XY Zero?) and waited (dwell) while the tool was manually changed. Then with a keyboard command the next tool is touched off, retracted, rapid to next operation with spindle start and with original work Z reference, resume next operations. Is this what you were referring to with your fixed plate? I may be way off in left field here, but if that could be done, it would be pretty sweet!

  20. #20
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    104
    Quote Originally Posted by MARV View Post
    Hey SSW, could you elaborate on your fixed plate routine? I don't anticipate adding an auto tool change spindle (can't afford it), but if there was an option to call a macro for a manual/semi auto tool change that would be great. For instance; with an M06 call, the spindle did a Z retract, spindle off, rapid to a fixed location tool plate (XY Zero?) and waited (dwell) while the tool was manually changed. Then with a keyboard command the next tool is touched off, retracted, rapid to next operation with spindle start and with original work Z reference, resume next operations. Is this what you were referring to with your fixed plate? I may be way off in left field here, but if that could be done, it would be pretty sweet!
    Marv this is exactly what I was hoping to find a way to do in Mach4 since I was basically able to do it with the 2010 screen set in Mach3. I know this is an old thread but was crossing my fingers someone had figured it out.

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