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IndustryArena Forum > Metalworking Machines > Cincinnati CNC > Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot
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  1. #1

    Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    Hi folks,

    Have a Cincinnati Sabre 1000 with an Acramatic 850sx control that stopped booting up last month. Was cutting parts the day prior, then shutoff in the evening and no boot the next morning. Nothing bumped or worked on in the cabinet between the two days. After working with Fives on a few ideas I'm stuck, and wondering if anyone else has encountered this?

    Control and operator stations move through the boot cycle just fine until the end, when the two should handshake on the serial connection and be ready, but the operator station is stuck at "host control initializing" on the first screen and the control box is stuck with an amber run light (signifying booting, not ready) and no error leds. (video -- https://youtu.be/KirFUfg7cIA) Have tried reseating and visually inspecting cards in the control chassis and I/O rack, multiple boots with the diagnostic switches on and off, and with connectors removed. Also tried a soft recovery procedure on the mmc card. This week I bypassed the old serial data wire between the control and op station in case of a short but no change.

    Fives is to the point of suggesting I buy and old control and op station and try swapping those around, but I'm hoping there are simpler/cheaper things to try. Especially if I need to pay them $1500+ to reflash a system eprom from a salvage control board. Anyone have suggestions?

    Thanks,
    John

  2. #2
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    Aug 2009
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    257

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    Do you have the Service Manual ? The four Switches numbered 1-4 below the LED's can do different things...like to enter into Service Mode or to completely Reload System from HDD.

    DJ

  3. #3
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    Mar 2011
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    316

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    I'm assuming Cincinnati had you check your power supply voltages already to ensure they are normal. If not, I would start by verifying that.

    Assuming your voltages are OK, I believe your LED's are pointing to a communication issue on the NIBA (or possibly SIBA in your machine), which would normally require repair/replacement of that board (assuming the selector switch wasn't accidentally changed).

    If you do get to the point of needing an OSA, let me know. I still have one that I haven't needed to use for years and would be willing to part with. I don't believe I have a PCA or MIA to help you though.

  4. #4
    Registered
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    Dec 2006
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    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    From the video it looks like the control is not talking to the I/O NIBA or SIBA in the I/O card rack as maver1k pointed out. If you lost the battery backed up I/O system e-prom software the control would still load up completely. You would have the standard run screen but the machine would not start. You also need to look at the power supply in the I/O card rack this will cause the same error.

    MIKE CNC Machine Services INC | Cincinnati Milacron MachinesCNC Machine Services

  5. #5
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    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    257

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    Did you check the CMOS Battery voltage ? I worked on a 950 control one time that would not see the CPU Cards at bootup and would just hang. Turned out to be the Battery Pack was bad and was pulling down the Voltage....



    Battery... https://www.alliedelec.com/product/t...42-w/70102893/
    SuperCap FS 5.5v 1.0f ... https://www.tokin.com/english/produc...cap_manual.pdf

    SuperCap is soldered to the pcb...so, if this needs replaced get a Pro
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/2pcs-vishay...kAAOSw1ulcRoVl

  6. #6

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    Thanks for all the ideas. Will go over to the machine tomorrow and try them out.

    Assume ps voltages for the control are listed in the service manual? Will look through that and check at the test points on the DIMP board. Had verified green analog and digital pwr LEDs on the control, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're good, just doing something.

    Had the IO rack ps rebuilt once and then I replaced it a couple years ago, so that should be good but I'll check that too. When that failed back then the control still loaded but gave me an IO error alarm at the OSA and the machine wouldn't startup or move after the control booted but I did get a full PCA boot.

    Have tried a boot sequence with only the OSA connector attached to the control, so any issues with motor drives or IO shouldn't have affected boot. Would have expected an error about the IO not being present, but it didn't get that far and hung at exactly the same point as when it was connected. That's why I think I've narrowed down the fault to the PCA, the OSA, or the connection between them.

    I ordered a spare battery and supercap from mouser that should be here later in the week. Question though-- if I swap out the battery and/or the cap on the MMC, what data will I lose? I have all programs backed up, and can rebuilt work and tool offset tables easily enough. But I'm a little concerned about the commissioning data and other stuff, or doing something that'll require an expensive system reflash. I did make a sxparam dump back in 2015 though. I expect the current battery could be original to the machine from 1993 and the cap certainly ought to be.

    --John

  7. #7

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    At the machine today. Checked voltages on the pins for the DIMP board and they were all OK. Also checked the battery on the MMC and it's at 3.6 V though shows an Apr 1992 manufacture date.

    Fuses on the input for the control power supply are all good, as is the input power for the I/O rack. If the I/O serial interface is unplugged, will the control and OSA still boot and pair up? Assume they would, but give me an alert about the I/O afterward. Have been unplugging the I/O serial to try and narrow down the issue with no change.

    If the dsub connectors for the motor drives aren't connected to the control rack I get no green APWR LED. Assume that's normal? DPWR is always green.

    Is there something at the OSA end that could cause this issue beyond a bad cable? Display gets stuck with a solid "host control initializing" when control goes amber and hangs.

    Anyone in the Columbus OH area that can work on these machines?

    Thanks,
    John

  8. #8
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    257

    Re: Acramatic 850sx won't finish boot

    Quote Originally Posted by John-INTENSE View Post
    I did make a sxparam dump back in 2015 though.
    --John

    Have you tried reloading that backup commissioning data ?


    I was reading an old thread here about someone elses 850sx
    https://www.cnczone.com/forums/uncat...-question.html

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