[shadowbane]

Hi.
I just obtained a V-CNC 500 in really good shape except the spindle lube system isn't working.
It consists of two small pneumatic oil pumps. Each has a proximity sensor to detect the oil shot. See picture.

The pump alarmed out before I obtained the machine, and there was evidence that it had leaked and work had been done to attempt to fix it.

State before I disassembled it: both pumps would actuate, only one seemed to be pumping (only one proximity sensor would fire, and inside I could only see the one internal pin moving). Tubes from the lube system to the spindle are dry.

I figured it probably has a contaminate in it that clogged it, so I disassembled it to blow some air through the inlets and outlets leading to the pump. I also hand actuated the pumps. The functional pump squirted out the oil that was still in it, while the other did not squirt anything. So it appears it was dry. Inlets leading to the pump appeared clear and contained oil.

I reassembled the pumps, and now neither one manages to squirt oil. I'm suspicious that they need to be primed somehow, but I'm unsure how to go about it.

Once they are functioning, the feed tubes from the pump to the destination need to be refilled as well, and one squirt at a time would take forever. So some instructions for doing that would also be useful.

If you have any ideas or documentation, is greatly appreciate it.

Thanks

[the_gentlegiant]

Are you sure these aren't spindle bearing misters? Is the spindle on this machine built in? Meaning the spindle shaft is also the spindle motor shaft? Unless greased for life, the only spindle lube systems I've seen, and granted I certainly haven't seen them all, are mister types, where they combine a small drop of oil that gets blasted in a stream of air and fed to the spindle bearings as a oil mist shot. Usually set off on a timer. The output tubes on a system like this will appear or be empty. I can't see the whole system as your picture is cropped too tight, but it looks like you have a lot of air connected to this thing which leans towards a mister too. Could be wrong. The mister on a Mori Seiki of mine takes a very long time to go through the small reservoir of oil it has. It sends only one small drop at a time through the system every few minutes when the spindle is turning.

Just something to think about. Primary Fluid Power is still around so you might be able to get something from them or dig into your maintenance books.These can be touchy little devices, and you want to be sure they're set correctly as far as pressure etc. Sorry I have no direct knowledge of your Cincinnati.

[shadowbane]

Hi. Thanks for the reply.

I'm not sure it's not a mister. It very well could be. The spindle is belt driven from a fanuc spindle motor. It could be that one was functioning fine, and the other not functioning fine, and the empty tubes could be a red herring. If that's the case though, then the air that is supposed to carry the oil isn't running. There are 2 pressure sensors (upper left corner) that should be showing pressure either all the time (if you are right), or during a lube cycle. But they never show any pressure. So that's another issue with it.

Edit: just realized one of the pressure sensors is disconnected in the picture. That's from me testing the sensor, which works well)

This box also delivers the tool release air, and a tool changer air blast.

The previous owner jacked the system up a bit, by trying to route the lube tubes back to the oil tank, so ignore that part of the picture. I'll fix that. (The spindle was never run this way)

[shadowbane]

Actually, looking at the system again, while thinking of a mister, I'm pretty sure that is what it is. One valve drives the supply air for carrying the oil, and the other is the oil shot.

No air flows through the system when the air valve is open. But air is supplied to the oil pumps (are they still called pumps?)

No oil is ejected when the oil valve is actuated either.

With power applied to the system, the air supply valve gets held open.

[shadowbane]

Amazing how thinking about it as a mister changed things. Found the closed valve hidden in the body for the air flow. Now if I can just figure out why actuating them isn't releasing oil anymore, I think it'll work.

[shadowbane]

Problem solved. Thank you the_gentlegiant for pointing me in the right direction.

Just had to actuate them a ton to prime them.

Thanks again.

[the_gentlegiant]

Wow that is a lot of fancy hardware and what not going on. I'm also thinking that's a mist system. Too bad it looks like it's been jacked around a lot. Unless part of that is your recent experimentation. I hope you have the manuals on this machine. Beg borrow or steal them if you don't. You have a few pressure settings that are going to need to be set correctly. The books should have those.

The two digital items near the top look like pressure sensors I've seen that look for a change in pressure (set-able as to range and amount) that will tell the control things are okay or that it's okay or time to do B because A just happened. From my experience those can be touchy and are a little hard to understand even with the manuals. Especially if unsure of their factory settings. Also there's different modes and uses depending on the type of system it's being used on. Don't understand why you have two of everything and one each seems to be disconnected.

Question: Is there a whole other arrangement somewhere else on the machine that seems to be the way lube system, or is that system also part or one half of this one?

If you look closely in your parts book at your spindle innards, you might be able to find the nozzles that will be right at the spindle bearings. Small little things with one or two at each bearing. If you find those then for sure it's a mister. If it wasn't a mister, I can't see why you'd have all that pneumatic stuff associated with what would otherwise be pure hydraulic pressure system driven by a timed plunger pump. You know... like you see on a lot of way lube systems where they use no air.

If this system operates anything like mine it only runs when the spindle is running. You might be able to actuate it manually with a stray 24V signal if you can get one somewhere. First I'd try to fully understand its operations before getting too deep. You should be able to Google each component you see and get the data sheet on it. That's what I always do.

[the_gentlegiant]

Oh..well... glad to hear. Last post possibly all for not. No problem though. Nice going! Glad to help.

[shadowbane]

The fact that half of it was disconnected was me playing around. I suspect there are 2 nozzles and each has a separate system.

Now to find manuals...

[gwood]

Fives-MSI (Cincinnati) 800-934-0735 is the OEM for this machine and can provide Technical Support / Parts /Service

[shadowbane]

Fives-MSI (Cincinnati) 800-934-0735

Thanks!