[EZMEF]

I have a gecko g540
Windows 10 computer
Going to get mach4
Going to buy ESS SmoothStepper

in the future, going to buy a WarpRunner for THC.

So here is my first question.
Do you hook up the limit switches to the gecko or the SmoothStepper?
Going to hook the gecko to the SmoothStepper and SmoothStepper to the computer via Ethernet cord.

I also read that you should also hook up the EStop to both gecko “and” the SmoothStepper, is this correct?

Here is the biggie. What is the proper way to hook up EStop and limit switches when I add the WarpRunner?

Thx EZ

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
I cant tell you much about a WarpRunner, but I have used an ESS and Mach4 for 8.5years.

A G540 is a combination breakout board with four stepper drivers built in. It has 'one ports worth' of IO, ie 17 inputs and outputs. As 12 of them are outputs that leaves only five inputs.
You would need at least one of those for an Estop. You are advised not to hook any switches or other paraphernalia to the ESS, not because you can't, but any small cock-up and you'll
blow the ESS. If you use a good breakout board, any cockup might wreck the breakout board but not the ESS.

The issue you have is that you really only have four spare inputs. If you got a second breakout board like a C10 ($23.00) then you have 'two ports worth' of IO, one from the G540 and the other from
the C10. The second port of the ESS you can direct it to make pins 2-9 (of port two) inputs, thus you would have a total of 18inputs and 16 outputs....much more useful.

I made my own breakout board because I wanted features that suited the servos that I used on my new mill. It uses all three ports of the ESS for 51 IO's in total with 31 inputs and 20 outputs.
The motor outputs (step/Dir) of all six axes are differential (for high speed signaling to servos), a relay and PWN outputs for the spindle, and a 24VDC output for the electromagnetic brake on the
Z axis. The remaining inputs are 24V active low, and the remaining outputs are 24VDC sourcing and sinking.

So specifically:

Do you hook up the limit switches to the gecko or the SmoothStepper?

Do not hook direct to the ESS, hook to spare inputs of the Gecko and/or spare inputs on your C10(recommended)

Going to hook the gecko to the SmoothStepper and SmoothStepper to the computer via Ethernet cord.

Yes, that is correct.

I also read that you should also hook up the EStop to both gecko “and” the SmoothStepper, is this correct?

No, the Estop is hooked to a spare breakout board input (either G540 OR C10) and that signals the ESS.

Here is the biggie. What is the proper way to hook up EStop and limit switches when I add the WarpRunner?

Don't know......I believe the WarpRunner replaces both the G540 and the C10, ie it is a fully developed three port breakout board that has in addition to all the usual
breakout board features it has THC features as well. The Warp9TD forum is the best place to get this info.

Craig

[EZMEF]

Thanks for the very thorough answer. Helps a ton.

Do you know of any good posts for general reading on the SmoothStepper and g540?

Thx EZ

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
the G540 is a single port breakout board....not really that much to know. Plenty of people have used the same combination, so I would guess the Warp9TD forum would
be as good a place as any. When all said and done...you still have to set it up......if you imagine you can click your fingers and its done for you you'll be disappointed.
Having said that its not too hard, and there is plenty of help, but the best satisfaction comes from understanding it yourself and setting it up.

Craig

[phomann]

Thanks for the very thorough answer. Helps a ton.

Do you know of any good posts for general reading on the SmoothStepper and g540?

Thx EZ

Hi,
For an example wiring diagram, have a look at this one I provide.

http://www.homanndesigns.com/pdfs/EN010_V8.pdf

As to the Estop, it should remove the mains power. That said some just feed it into a breakout board, feeding it into the controller software to invoke the Estop. This is not safe practice as if the software or breakout board is the reason you are pushing the Estop, it may not do anything

One caveat to that is if you’re machine can’t do any damage then it is probably ok. Say if you have a CNC machine that winds guitar pickup coils you should be ok.

The warp9 motion controllers and the G540 are a great combo.

Cheers


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[joeavaerage]

Hi,

As to the Estop, it should remove the mains power. That said some just feed it into a breakout board, feeding it into the controller software to invoke the Estop. This is not safe practice as if the software or breakout board is the reason you are pushing the Estop, it may not do anything Starting a new setup-need info

I reckon this is plain rubbish. I've never had an Estop that cuts the power, and whenever I've ever hit Estop the machine has always stopped,11 plus years, first Mach3 and parallel port through Mach4 and ESS.
In commercial or industrial practice it may be necessary to have an Estop to cut the power to get an electrical certificate, but it is not a legal requirement for a hobby machine.....aside
from that who's going to enforce it?

This is a classic case where regulation and even common practice is a decade or more behind where even hobbyist hardware is.

A decade or so ago it was not 'legal' to use Profibus or Ethercat to carry safety data, door interlocks, Estops etc. That has changed, so both Profibus and Ethercat now carry safety data.
Why would you have a machine installation with a cable daisy chaining all the nodes together, maybe dozens of nodes, but then require a separate EStop cable for each different section of the machine???
Eventually the pinhead regulators got caught up and realized that safety data over a bus is actually more reliable than a whole swag of individual cables.

Craig

[phomann]

Every one is entitled to an opinion.
I’m not stopping you from wiring however you want.

Cheers

Peter


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[joeavaerage]

Hi Peter,
you have been CNCing for many years....have you EVER had a machine, be it parallel port, ESS or any other motion controller, that did not stop immediately with an EStop?
If you have; then having an Estop depower the machine would be essential........but if you've never had a machine 'runaway' and refuse to stop when you hit an EStop....then why
insist that it depower. Is it needed?

Craig

PS: I've heard the same sort of argument made in yachting circles: 'I have life jackets, a life raft, an EPIRB, flares....all the safety equipment....therefore my boat is safe'
BS....what makes a boat safe is the design, construction and equipment combined with the skill and experience of the crew to avoid the need for a life raft. There is a saying
'you should always climb up (from the sinking boat) into a life raft'. By the time you need a life raft you've long since departed from safety.

[phomann]

Hi Craig,
Sure, I’ve had half a dozen times where I’ve needed to hit the Estop when Mach3 and 4 has had a runaway, usually during jogging. This has occurred while using the keyboard while jogging.
Mach4 in the early days was known for this.
As to whether a soft Estop was sufficient to stop the runaway, I don’t know as, my Estop shuts down power to the drives. That said, the motion controllers are still powered.

As I Said, people can wire their Estop however they like. I just presented a fail safe method.

A soft Estop will work until it doesn’t.

Cheers

Peter.


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[joeavaerage]

Hi Peter,
I rather meant that if you ever hit an Estop does the machine not stop? I suppose you cant tell because your Estop depowers the machine, so of course it would stop.

My Estop operates on Mach alone. That has worked perfectly reliably as long as I have been CNCing.

I used to have Mach3 run away sometimes when jogging, but I don't recall ever having Mach4 do so. I've been using Mach4 for 8.5 years, and I have used the Estop occassionaly over that
time, its never because an axis run away, but because my toolpath was faulty and it was doing something I did not like, gouging clamps or the vice or whatever.

One thing I don't like about an <Estop> is that it aborts whatever trajectory data is in the ESS motion buffer. I leave the ESS motion buffer at its default, which is 180ms. Thus, when you hit
the Estop up to 180ms worth of movement data can be lost and therefore the machine loses reference....and requires re-homing before further use. I hate that. If however you use <FeedHold>
rather than <Estop> the motion data in the buffer is executed before the machine stops. To my way of thinking a potential overrun of 180ms is near enough, to my eye, as instantaneous.
So I don't have an <Estop> button anymore, I in fact have a <FeedHold> button, it still the great big red button.....but it feed holds rather than crash stop. In Mach4 you can decide for instance
whether you want the spindle to turn off when executing a <FeedHold>, which excepting the barely perceptible delay (180ms max) makes it like an <Estop>. A Limit event or a servo alarm still
causes a genuine <Estop> ie a crash stop with the inevitable loss of reference, but I've not had a Limit event or a servo fault while operating my new mill for 2.5 years.
The only time the button gets used is if I hit it for whatever reason, like a faulty toolpath, or some other cockup of my making. I try to minimise those faults but they happen every once in a while,
and Mach4 has never, ever, even once, NOT failed to stop as I have commanded.

Craig

[EZMEF]

OK. I’m getting close to actual setup.
I’ve feel like I’ve looked at every page from Warp9 setup page. I can’t find the info I thought I saw.

Simple question. When mounting the ESS to my control panel chassis, do you use metal standoffs or do you isolate with plastic standoffs? My chassis should have earth ground.
Thx EZ

- - - Updated - - -

OK. I’m getting close to actual setup.
I’ve feel like I’ve looked at every page from Warp9 setup page. I can’t find the info I thought I saw.

Simple question. When mounting the ESS to my control panel chassis, do you use metal standoffs or do you isolate with plastic standoffs? My chassis should have earth ground.
Thx EZ

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
there is a note in the ESS literature somewhere that one of the PCB islands surrounding the mounting hole is electrically connected to the 0V common of the ESS.

If you desire the 0V common to be earthed to the chassis then use a metal standoff on that one mount. The other mount points are electrically isolated, so it doesn't matter whether you
use metal or plastic standoffs.

I would not have thought earthing the 0V common of the ESS is required, so use plastic standoffs.

My own ESS is not mounted at the standoff points but the three 29 pin IDE plugs plug into a socket on the board underneath, and that physically locates the ESS board, thus the board is not earthed to the chassis.

Craig

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
found the note on the mechanical drawing page:

Craig

[EZMEF]

Is there another choice for THC to use with the SmoothStepper ESS other than the WarpRunner?

Unless all the others cost about the same. $499 for WarpRunner.


thx EZ

PS. Warp9 forum doesn't seem to be moderated so I've got no responses from the forum.

[peteeng]

Hi EZM - Look at the knighthawk controller. Does everything in one box. Very well supported I have found and good price. Peter
https://www.cnc3d.com.au/nighthawkcnc-controller

[joeavaerage]

Hi,

Is there another choice for THC to use with the SmoothStepper ESS other than the WarpRunner?

Not with anything like the functionality or the bandidth of the WarpRunner. It has Anti-Dive strategies which no other ESS ready controller has.

Mach4 does have a software driven THC facility, but low bandwidth, say 5Hz, maybe 10Hz. So if you only require low dynamic THC then you should investigate that. You in effect need
a ADC to convert the tip voltage (or sample thereof) to drive Mach4's THC module.

The Proma 150 is another alternative. It does not do ADC, but makes an Up/Down signal based on the threshold you dial into the Proma. Downside is no Anti-Dive, and because Mach4
has no idea of the tip voltage (in absence of an ADC) and therefore little or none of the Mach4 THC module will be of any use to you.

Look at the knighthawk controller.

Does the Nighthawk support THC? Does it have analogue inputs or does it require an ADC? What bandwidth is the THC? Does it have Anti-Dive strategies? Have you actually tried it or
have reports from those who have?

Craig

[peteeng]

Hi - Yes it does have THC but I have no experience with plasma. Ask cnc3D support about it. I did use to run an oxy copier some 30 years ago.. Peter

[joeavaerage]

Hi,

Warp9 forum doesn't seem to be moderated so I've got no responses from the forum.

Andy, the regular support guy at Warp9 is building a house ans has largely been absent for a few months.

Craig

[joeavaerage]

Hi,

Unless all the others cost about the same. $499 for WarpRunner.

I understand not wanting to pay $449 for a THC controller even if it is good....but how much is your plasma machine worth? Even cheap s****t Chinese plasmas are likely more than that,
and even the smallest Hypertherm is much much more than that. What's the bet you'll spend more than $450/year on consumables alone!

Now don't get me wrong .....I am all support for reducing the cost of items but not at the expense of functionality.

A while back I found myself defending the cost of Mach4 ($200) and an ESS ($225) a total of $425. I've had them for 8.5 years, so $50/year, that such a miniscule sum really. Just one
servo costs $438 and I've got five of those, and my whole machine now including the trunnion and fifth axis is over $25000. I pay $500/year for fusion Basic and another $1320/year for Fuson Machining Extensions.
Really the cost of the CNC software solution (Mach4) and the motion control (ESS) is truly miniscule by comparison.

If you start thinking in those terms you might well see that a WarpRunner that you use for the next twenty years is a minor expense.

Craig

[EZMEF]

Thanks again for all the good answers.
Things changed again, so now I have another question.

Are any of you using a wireless keyboard and mouse? I’m thinking of moving my keyboard, mouse and monitor to the other side of my table. Are there any issues of using either wireless or long cables for these 3 items? I only need to move about 9 ft.
Thx EZ