[Padawon01]

Hi all, I am new to VFDs and needing some help deciphering the manual that I received.

Make/model: Huanyang GT series VFD, 4kW

I have everything else set up correctly based on another thread in the forum.



Issue: Currently trying to understand why the spindle is not responding to the AI1 or AI2 inputs (0-10v). I have set the minimum and maximum voltages, set minimum and maximum percentages.

I have also set
P0.01 =1
P0.02 =2
P0.07 =2

P0.08 =?
P0.09 =?
P0.10 =?

P0.11 =5
P0.12 =5

P0.13 =0
P0.14 =DEFAULT (8?)

P0.15 =?
P0.16 =PERFORMED AUTO TUNE DURING INITIAL SETUP



P2.01=4.0
P2.02=300
P2.03=18000
P2.04=220
P2.05=10



P5.10=0
P5.11=.50
P5.12=0
P5.13=0
P5.14=0
P5.15=0
P5.16=.10
P5.17=0 (ASSUMING THIS IS MANUAL TYPO AND ITS SUPPOSED TO BE LOWER LIMIT?)
P5.18=0 (ASSUMING THIS IS ANOTHER MANUAL TYPE AND IS SUPPOSED TO BE LOWER LIMIT?)
P5.19=10 (AI2 UPPER LIMIT)
P5.20=100 (AI2 UPPER LIMIT %)
P5.21=.10

Not sure what else I need to run the VFD/Spindle from motion control. If someone wouldn't mind assisting with troubleshooting this, it would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you in advance!

[mactec54]

Hi all, I am new to VFDs and needing some help deciphering the manual that I received.

Make/model: Huanyang GT series VFD, 4kW

I have everything else set up correctly based on another thread in the forum.



Issue: Currently trying to understand why the spindle is not responding to the AI1 or AI2 inputs (0-10v). I have set the minimum and maximum voltages, set minimum and maximum percentages.

I have also set
P0.01 =1
P0.02 =2
P0.07 =2

P0.08 =?
P0.09 =?
P0.10 =?

P0.11 =5
P0.12 =5

P0.13 =0
P0.14 =DEFAULT (8?)

P0.15 =?
P0.16 =PERFORMED AUTO TUNE DURING INITIAL SETUP



P2.01=4.0
P2.02=300
P2.03=18000
P2.04=220
P2.05=10



P5.10=0
P5.11=.50
P5.12=0
P5.13=0
P5.14=0
P5.15=0
P5.16=.10
P5.17=0 (ASSUMING THIS IS MANUAL TYPO AND ITS SUPPOSED TO BE LOWER LIMIT?)
P5.18=0 (ASSUMING THIS IS ANOTHER MANUAL TYPE AND IS SUPPOSED TO BE LOWER LIMIT?)
P5.19=10 (AI2 UPPER LIMIT)
P5.20=100 (AI2 UPPER LIMIT %)
P5.21=.10

Not sure what else I need to run the VFD/Spindle from motion control. If someone wouldn't mind assisting with troubleshooting this, it would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you in advance!

You can't do an Auto tune unless all the main parameters are set first

Do you have the 0-10v PWM to analog working from the control

Your Parameters do not look correct, I guessing that you have an air cooled spindle 300Hz what are all the spindle specs.

[Padawon01]

You can't do an Auto tune unless all the main parameters are set first

Do you have the 0-10v PWM to analog working from the control

Your Parameters do not look correct, I guessing that you have an air cooled spindle 300Hz what are all the spindle specs.

Yes, you're correct, its an air-cooled spindle. It just something to get me started until I can make an electric motor and spindle assembly.

When I first hooked up this spindle, I followed the manual and entered in the main parameters such as freq, motor data plate info, etc. I selected the auto tune, ran it, and it seemed to work just fine with no problems.

From here, I would like to use the 0-10v spindle control wire from my motion control to control the VFD/spindle.

The pin outs on the command wire are:
1. ground
2. PWM
3. DIR (direction)
4. 0-10v

According to the manual, I hooked up the following:
1. ground - hooked up to terminal ground
2. PWM - did not hook up
3. DIR - did not hook up
4. 0-10v - hooked up to AI2
Please feel free to recommend something better if this pin out arrangement allow it. I'm stuck at this point anyway, may as well be stuck trying to hook up the best option available.


Next, I selected:
P0.00=0
P0.01=1
P0.02=2
P0.04=300 (UNCHANGED)
P0.05=0 (UNCHANGED)
P0.06=300 (UNCHANGED)
P0.07=2

P0.08=0 (DEFAULT)
P0.09=0 (DEFAULT)
P0.10=0 (DEFAULT)
P0.11=10
P0.12=10
P0.13=0
P0.14=5 (DEFAULT OR FROM AUTOTUNE)
P0.15=1
P0.16=0
P0.17=0

P1.00 THRU P1.19 ALL DEFAULT

P2.00=0
P2.01=4.0
P2.02=300
P2.03=18000
P2.04=220
P2.05=10 (YES, IT IS CORRECT)

P2.06 THRU P2.10 SET DURING AUTO TUNE

P3.00 THRU P3.10 ALL DEFAULT

P4.00 THRU P4.13 ALL DEFAULT

P5.00 THRU P5.09 ALL DEFAULT

P5.10=0 (I am not fully understanding the differences in how these control modes are properly set up)
P5.11 THRU P5.16 ALL DEFAULT

P5.17=0
P5.18=0
P5.19=10
P5.20=100
P5.21=.10

P5.22 THRU P5.26 ALL DEFAULT

P6 THRU P9 GROUPS ALL DEFAULT

[Padawon01]

Forgot to answer - Yes, the 0-10v command signal out is working fine. There is both a visual indicator light and I have measured it at various percentages (10%=1v, 25%=2.5v, 50%=5v, 100%=10v), and verified that the control signal activates/deactivates when I turn it on/off from the software.

[mactec54]

Forgot to answer - Yes, the 0-10v command signal out is working fine. There is both a visual indicator light and I have measured it at various percentages (10%=1v, 25%=2.5v, 50%=5v, 100%=10v), and verified that the control signal activates/deactivates when I turn it on/off from the software.

Not sure how you are measuring it as a % as 0-10v analog output is related to RPM of what you ask the control to run the spindle at you have a minimum speed you can run your spindle at so nothing below 120Hz =7200RPM below this your spindle will over heat

Auto Tuning does not work in V/F mode,

Just at a glance you are missing some main Parameters

P0.03=300

P0.05=120 Your spindle minimum speed may need to be higher than this as most air cooled have a minimum of 150Hz you can try the 120 watch the spindle temperature


S1-COM is for On / Off ( Relay )

Ai2-Ground is 0-10v check J16 jumper is correct

P0.01=1 may also need to be 2 for remote control

[Padawon01]

Not sure how you are measuring it as a % as 0-10v analog output is related to RPM of what you ask the control to run the spindle at you have a minimum speed you can run your spindle at so nothing below 120Hz =7200RPM below this your spindle will over heat

-% of RPM is being controlled by the motion control software.
-Yes, I am aware that running an air-cooled spindle at too low an RPM can cause overheating and damage. Is there an actual hard calculation for this number, or is this an arbitrary calculation? How did you arrive at 7200 RPM? Why not 7000 RPM or 7250 RPM? Genuinely interested in how 7200RPM is the magic number. (Personally, I stay at or above 8000 RPM)

Auto Tuning does not work in V/F mode,

-But it does. Not trying to argue, but I entered in the motor parameters and a few of the other basic set up parameters, selected auto-tune, and it ran and updated parameters P2.06-P2.10 automatically.

Just at a glance you are missing some main Parameters

P0.03=300

-I have 300Hz entered for this, it was a typo.

P0.05=120 Your spindle minimum speed may need to be higher than this as most air cooled have a minimum of 150Hz you can try the 120 watch the spindle temperature

-Where do I find this information? Unfortunately, I did not receive anything with my spindle that outlines minimum RPMs. Just wondering if there is a calculation or formula for this? I would like to have a better understanding of how this is determined.

Ai2-Ground is 0-10v check J16 jumper is correct

- both are fine

P0.01=1 may also need to be 2 for remote control

- P0.01 is the correct setting

S1-COM is for On / Off ( Relay )

- Problem was discovered to be at the motion control. I am using a Openbuilds Blackbox controller and the 0-10v command signal works fine. However, I noticed (and it is outlined in the VFD manual) that if there is a jumper across S1-COM prior to powering the VFD on, it prevents the inverter from running (note on page 48 beneath figure 6.12).

To solve this, I attempted to use the relay that is included in the Blackbox Motion control (grbl). Unfortunately, when the motion control powers on, it cycles the relay and make the VFD think that the S1-COM had a closed circuit condition prior to power up, preventing it from running.

The tech support at Openbuilds suggested using "use spindle DIR as ENABLE" - this did not work for obvious reasons. What ends up happening is that the Blackbox cycles the relay upon start up which briefly causes a close circuit condition across S1-COM, and then cycles the relay a second time when connecting to the controller with a computer. The only options to correct this are to alter the coding in the grbl firmware or simply install an external relay, switch, or simple logic circuit to circumvent it. You may not be interested in this information, but I am compiling it here for others who may come looking for it.

[mactec54]

-% of RPM is being controlled by the motion control software.
-Yes, I am aware that running an air-cooled spindle at too low an RPM can cause overheating and damage. Is there an actual hard calculation for this number, or is this an arbitrary calculation? How did you arrive at 7200 RPM? Why not 7000 RPM or 7250 RPM? Genuinely interested in how 7200RPM is the magic number. (Personally, I stay at or above 8000 RPM)





-But it does. Not trying to argue, but I entered in the motor parameters and a few of the other basic set up parameters, selected auto-tune, and it ran and updated parameters P2.06-P2.10 automatically.





-I have 300Hz entered for this, it was a typo.





-Where do I find this information? Unfortunately, I did not receive anything with my spindle that outlines minimum RPMs. Just wondering if there is a calculation or formula for this? I would like to have a better understanding of how this is determined.






- both are fine



- P0.01 is the correct setting



- Problem was discovered to be at the motion control. I am using a Openbuilds Blackbox controller and the 0-10v command signal works fine. However, I noticed (and it is outlined in the VFD manual) that if there is a jumper across S1-COM prior to powering the VFD on, it prevents the inverter from running (note on page 48 beneath figure 6.12).

To solve this, I attempted to use the relay that is included in the Blackbox Motion control (grbl). Unfortunately, when the motion control powers on, it cycles the relay and make the VFD think that the S1-COM had a closed circuit condition prior to power up, preventing it from running.

The tech support at Openbuilds suggested using "use spindle DIR as ENABLE" - this did not work for obvious reasons. What ends up happening is that the Blackbox cycles the relay upon start up which briefly causes a close circuit condition across S1-COM, and then cycles the relay a second time when connecting to the controller with a computer. The only options to correct this are to alter the coding in the grbl firmware or simply install an external relay, switch, or simple logic circuit to circumvent it. You may not be interested in this information, but I am compiling it here for others who may come looking for it.

What you are compiling is of no use to anyone because you are making a mess of it

You seem to have got into a mess your wiring to the VFD drive is incorrect, if using a relay there is nothing to change you are miss reading what is in the manual, the relay is just a switch there is no power involved in the Relays output to the drive connection, if there is you have a problem and it is wired incorrect

You can't just stay at or above a RPM number like 8,000 RPM and call it good, this number needs to be set using the minimum speed Parameter as a Hz setting so that the spindle can't go below this setting

All these spindle have a minimum speed water cooled is 6,000 RPM=100Hz most use the water cooled spindles at 7200=120Hz if you want to use 8000RPM then the Hz would be 8000 RPM=133Hz nothing magic about these numbers 6,000 RPM for a water cooled spindle is what the manufacturers state in there spec's your Spindle will have a manufacturers minimum speed also, this depends on the fan that cools the spindle

[mactec54]

But it does. Not trying to argue, but I entered in the motor parameters and a few of the other basic set up parameters, selected auto-tune, and it ran and updated parameters P2.06-P2.10 automatically.

Are yes, I forgot you are only using 300Hz max, so yes it does work for up to 300Hz spindles, most use 400Hz and it does not work for the 400Hz spindles

I have 300Hz entered for this, it was a typo.

No, Typo, P0.03 it is not even in the list

[Padawon01]

What you are compiling is of no use to anyone because you are making a mess of it

You seem to have got into a mess your wiring to the VFD drive is incorrect, if using a relay there is nothing to change you are miss reading what is in the manual, the relay is just a switch there is no power involved in the Relays output to the drive connection, if there is you have a problem and it is wired incorrect

You can't just stay at or above a RPM number like 8,000 RPM and call it good, this number needs to be set using the minimum speed Parameter as a Hz setting so that the spindle can't go below this setting

All these spindle have a minimum speed water cooled is 6,000 RPM=100Hz most use the water cooled spindles at 7200=120Hz if you want to use 8000RPM then the Hz would be 8000 RPM=133Hz nothing magic about these numbers 6,000 RPM for a water cooled spindle is what the manufacturers state in there spec's your Spindle will have a manufacturers minimum speed also, this depends on the fan that cools the spindle

Ok, to address the relay - Yes, I know the relay is nothing more than a switch. There is no power at the relay.

For simplicity -

I currently have no way to control activation of the VFD. The only way that I have found is to jump S1 to COM. S1 is set by default as the FWD signal for the spindle. S1 carries a voltage of 20v DC, and when jumped to COM, closes the circuit and drops to 0v DC. Closing this circuit activates the VFD and any signal from the control such as M3 and M5 now work. If I send M3 S8000, the spindle will start up and accelerate to 8000 RPM. I can now enter any value S7500-S18000 to control the RPM of the spindle. Entering and sending M5 stops the spindle and brings it to a stopped position.

My wiring is as follows:

1. 240v 3-wire outlet, 30A breaker in the main panel.
Wiring goes into:
2. 25A, 2-pole circuit breaker
Wiring goes into:
3. 25A, fast blow fuses - 2-pole
Wiring goes into:
4. 30A contactor, with 120v coil (motor load of 32A)
Wiring goes into:
5. EMI filter
Wiring goes into:
6. R, S, G, terminals at the VFD. Power to VFD complete


From VFD to Spindle:
1. 4-wire VFD cable with foil and braided shielding. Drain is terminated at the control panel into the ground bus. Power from VFD to spindle complete.


Power to motion control:
1. 120v terminal block in panel to DC power supply.
2. From DC power supply to motion control box. Stepper drivers and all necessary items contained and powered in same motion control box. Power to motion control complete.

Auxiliary wiring from motion control to VFD.
1. 0-10v signal wire to VFD AI1
2. Ground for signal wire to terminal ground on VFD

The following parameters are selected in the VFD:
1. P5.10=0 (2-wire control, the defined FWD/REV terminal command determines the direction - in this case, the FWD command is determined by S1 since it is set at FWD as a default setting (P5.01=1). Terminal S2 default is 4 (jog forward), but I set terminal S2 to REV (P5.02=2). To run the spindle, the voltage at S1 (20v) needs to go to ground to complete the circuit. This can be performed with the use of a jumper between S1 and COM.

The caveat -

When using a jumper between S1 and COM, both of these terminals cannot be connected to form a circuit PRIOR TO powering on the VFD. The VFD manual even states in the P5.10 control programming (on page 48)

"Note: when 2-wire control mode is active, the inverter will not run in following situation even if FWD/REV terminal is enabled:
**Coast to stop (press RUN and STOP/RST at the same time)
**Stop command from serial communication
**FWD/REV terminal is enabled before power on <-- in other words, if S1 and COM are jumped prior to power on, inverter will not run (no spindle control)



Relay - I am not misreading anything in the manual. When the relay is open, there is no continuity. When the relay is closed (in the case of VFD and spindle operation) the relay has positive continuity. I did ask their tech support for clarification on the relay to make sure of its operation since my machine and workstation are in two separate places.



One way to fix this VFD issue, is to use the relay on the motion control box. Seems easy enough, right? This relay is triggered whenever the spindle is activated via the motion control software. In normal circumstances, this should be a straight forward and easy fix, but it is not.

Whomever designed this feature in the Openbuilds Blackbox firmware, has the relay toggling on and off briefly when the motion controller powers on for the first time. When the relay is hooked to the VFD S1 and COM terminals, the VFD "sees" this as having S1 and COM jumped (closed circuit) prior to the VFD powering on, which nulls the ability to use the 0-10v control signal the way it was intended.

Tech support provided recommendation after recommendation, none of which worked. Rather than taking the most direct route possible, I had to change relay functions in the box and change programming for the "enable", even though the correct solution was right there - change the firmware to stop the motion control box from cycling the relay on/off on initial power up, and again when establishing communication from the port on the laptop. This is the correct solution. For whatever reason, the person was more intent on trying to find fault in everything that I said.




Spindle minimum RPM - When I start my spindle, I type in M3 S8000 - to start the spindle at 8000 RPM. I see no issue with this, I am the only person running this machine and I know not to run it at rpms lower than that for any significant amount of time. At most, I will run 10% and 25% to check function, but not much more than a minute or so.

Are you telling me that I need to have the minimum frequency programmed into the VFD because it will damage something, or are you telling me to set the minimum frequency because that simply acts as the point of lowest RPM to prevent accidentally running at low RPMs? If the latter, then I am not concerned about it at this point. I will make that adjustment once I am able to make a few test cuts in this range (~7200 rpm, 7500rpm and up). If the test cuts show a good value to use as my rpm "floor", then I will set it accordingly. I also plan to obtain the proper value from the manufacturer. In any case, unless it is damaging to my equipment in some way, I will set the minimum frequency at a later time.

[mactec54]

Ok, to address the relay - Yes, I know the relay is nothing more than a switch. There is no power at the relay.

For simplicity -

I currently have no way to control activation of the VFD. The only way that I have found is to jump S1 to COM. S1 is set by default as the FWD signal for the spindle. S1 carries a voltage of 20v DC, and when jumped to COM, closes the circuit and drops to 0v DC. Closing this circuit activates the VFD and any signal from the control such as M3 and M5 now work. If I send M3 S8000, the spindle will start up and accelerate to 8000 RPM. I can now enter any value S7500-S18000 to control the RPM of the spindle. Entering and sending M5 stops the spindle and brings it to a stopped position.

My wiring is as follows:

1. 240v 3-wire outlet, 30A breaker in the main panel.
Wiring goes into:
2. 25A, 2-pole circuit breaker
Wiring goes into:
3. 25A, fast blow fuses - 2-pole
Wiring goes into:
4. 30A contactor, with 120v coil (motor load of 32A)
Wiring goes into:
5. EMI filter
Wiring goes into:
6. R, S, G, terminals at the VFD. Power to VFD complete


From VFD to Spindle:
1. 4-wire VFD cable with foil and braided shielding. Drain is terminated at the control panel into the ground bus. Power from VFD to spindle complete.


Power to motion control:
1. 120v terminal block in panel to DC power supply.
2. From DC power supply to motion control box. Stepper drivers and all necessary items contained and powered in same motion control box. Power to motion control complete.

Auxiliary wiring from motion control to VFD.
1. 0-10v signal wire to VFD AI1
2. Ground for signal wire to terminal ground on VFD

The following parameters are selected in the VFD:
1. P5.10=0 (2-wire control, the defined FWD/REV terminal command determines the direction - in this case, the FWD command is determined by S1 since it is set at FWD as a default setting (P5.01=1). Terminal S2 default is 4 (jog forward), but I set terminal S2 to REV (P5.02=2). To run the spindle, the voltage at S1 (20v) needs to go to ground to complete the circuit. This can be performed with the use of a jumper between S1 and COM.

The caveat -

When using a jumper between S1 and COM, both of these terminals cannot be connected to form a circuit PRIOR TO powering on the VFD. The VFD manual even states in the P5.10 control programming (on page 48)

"Note: when 2-wire control mode is active, the inverter will not run in following situation even if FWD/REV terminal is enabled:
**Coast to stop (press RUN and STOP/RST at the same time)
**Stop command from serial communication
**FWD/REV terminal is enabled before power on <-- in other words, if S1 and COM are jumped prior to power on, inverter will not run (no spindle control)



Relay - I am not misreading anything in the manual. When the relay is open, there is no continuity. When the relay is closed (in the case of VFD and spindle operation) the relay has positive continuity. I did ask their tech support for clarification on the relay to make sure of its operation since my machine and workstation are in two separate places.



One way to fix this VFD issue, is to use the relay on the motion control box. Seems easy enough, right? This relay is triggered whenever the spindle is activated via the motion control software. In normal circumstances, this should be a straight forward and easy fix, but it is not.

Whomever designed this feature in the Openbuilds Blackbox firmware, has the relay toggling on and off briefly when the motion controller powers on for the first time. When the relay is hooked to the VFD S1 and COM terminals, the VFD "sees" this as having S1 and COM jumped (closed circuit) prior to the VFD powering on, which nulls the ability to use the 0-10v control signal the way it was intended.

Tech support provided recommendation after recommendation, none of which worked. Rather than taking the most direct route possible, I had to change relay functions in the box and change programming for the "enable", even though the correct solution was right there - change the firmware to stop the motion control box from cycling the relay on/off on initial power up, and again when establishing communication from the port on the laptop. This is the correct solution. For whatever reason, the person was more intent on trying to find fault in everything that I said.




Spindle minimum RPM - When I start my spindle, I type in M3 S8000 - to start the spindle at 8000 RPM. I see no issue with this, I am the only person running this machine and I know not to run it at rpms lower than that for any significant amount of time. At most, I will run 10% and 25% to check function, but not much more than a minute or so.

Are you telling me that I need to have the minimum frequency programmed into the VFD because it will damage something, or are you telling me to set the minimum frequency because that simply acts as the point of lowest RPM to prevent accidentally running at low RPMs? If the latter, then I am not concerned about it at this point. I will make that adjustment once I am able to make a few test cuts in this range (~7200 rpm, 7500rpm and up). If the test cuts show a good value to use as my rpm "floor", then I will set it accordingly. I also plan to obtain the proper value from the manufacturer. In any case, unless it is damaging to my equipment in some way, I will set the minimum frequency at a later time.

You have some wiring incorrect

The input power supply is incorrect for this VFD Drive R and T Plus Ground is the correct connections for single phase

You can't us a shielded cable Drain and connect it to the Ground Bus this is a big No. if you need to know how to correctly terminate a Shield, I can help you.

You should not have the 25A, fast blow fuses, as you have a 25A circuit Breaker

The setting of the minimum speed is what the 0-10v speed control is controlling, this would be set in your control as well

You also should not have Reverse active for these Spindles, most manufacturers recommend to block Reverse

You play with an undeveloped over priced system / machine, you will have these problems, when you had a problem with their Relay you should have just added another and used an output if it had any spare or just used logic as this VFD Drive can use either for the On / Off control

[Padawon01]

You have some wiring incorrect

The input power supply is incorrect for this VFD Drive R and T Plus Ground is the correct connections for single phase

I did have it wired to R & T when I did the initial set up - the manufacturer includes a sheet that shows both options for a 3-wire and 4-wire variation. On the 3-wire, it shows R, T, and ground. When those failed to power up the VFD, I contacted the manufacturer via their skype contact listed on the sheet. I was told to use R, S, and ground instead.

Because I was having some issues with the VFD and the spindle (basic functions), when the spindle did function it burnt up. This was due to two different amperage ratings - one said 16A and the other said 10A. The ad for this spindle has since changed, as well as the exterior housing and data plate. I also obtained the 16A from 4000w / 240v = 16.66A. I used this to calculate the amperage for the fast blow fuses at 16A * 1.5 = 24A, rounded to next standard size of 25A. Since the Spindle and VFD both have a higher rated amperage, the 25A fast blow should go before either of those two are impacted at all.

You can't us a shielded cable Drain and connect it to the Ground Bus this is a big No. if you need to know how to correctly terminate a Shield, I can help you.

Could you explain the reasoning for this? The drain is only connected to the ground bus, and not anywhere on the spindle end. If you have a better suggestion for this, please let me know.

You should not have the 25A, fast blow fuses, as you have a 25A circuit Breaker

25A fuses, circuit breaker is lower than the VFD rated amperage. VFD rated input amperage is 36A. If anything, they are undersized (manual recommends 1.5x to 2.0x the rated input amperage (54A and 72A respectfully). Seems a little over the top, but thats what the manual says.

The setting of the minimum speed is what the 0-10v speed control is controlling, this would be set in your control as well

Right, I understand. I have it set to Min: 0 Hz and Max: 300 Hz. This corresponds to 0-100% in my control software dashboard, and as a g-code command corresponds to 0-18000 RPM. As noted, I don't run the spindle under 8000 RPM for any significant periods of time. If I do run it below 8000 RPM, its very briefly for troubleshooting and verifying operation in the full RPM range (there was a point where it would not run at anything less than 11,500 RPM due to the command signal).

[QUOTE}You also should not have Reverse active for these Spindles, most manufacturers recommend to block Reverse[/QUOTE]

Reverse isn't "active". It is only set to the S2 terminal. The logic table on page 47 shows that even if REV is set to the S2 terminal, it still requires activation before it can be used. Jumping the S1 and COM terminals only enables FWD. I have also tested the 2-wire control by leaving the S2 terminal set to the manufacturer default (jog) and it makes no difference when trying to use the 0-10v control wire at AI2.

You play with an undeveloped over priced system / machine, you will have these problems, when you had a problem with their Relay you should have just added another and used an output if it had any spare or just used logic as this VFD Drive can use either for the On / Off control

I mentioned those two things to their tech support and it was not received very well. What I wanted to do was to simply add a relay that triggers the S1 to COM terminal to a closed circuit condition as soon as there is voltage across the 0-10v command wire.

Seeing as how the minimum frequency can be set, and that my spindle minimum RPM would be about 8000 RPM, that would mean there should be about 4.4v going across the command signal to the VFD. I could tap this for use with a 3v-10v+ DC relay on the coil side, then run S1 to COM through the controlled side of the relay.

[mactec54]

You have the spindle set in the VFD Drive Parameters for 10 Amps what is on the name plate of the spindle list all the specs, you only burn up a VFD Drive if the main frequency Parameters are not set correct to the motor specs.

220v
300Hz
18,000RPM
Amps=??
Kw=??
2 Pole

[Padawon01]

You have the spindle set in the VFD Drive Parameters for 10 Amps what is on the name plate of the spindle list all the specs, you only burn up a VFD Drive if the main frequency Parameters are not set correct to the motor specs.

220v
300Hz
18,000RPM
Amps=??
Kw=??
2 Pole

The spindle is 10A and 4kW.

This is what is listed on the data plate from the second spindle (the spindle I have now).

The first spindle had a different data plate on it and a different motor housing with different mounting holes. Motor also looked as if someone had mounted it before I got it. This spindle was sent back. The motor burned up because it was set to 16A in the VFD, based on the info I had on it. Sucks but its a dead issue.


Not sure why they advertise the spindle as a 4kW. Its more like a 3kW spindle after you account for the line voltage, amperage, and power factor (0.75)

[mactec54]

The spindle is 10A and 4kW.

This is what is listed on the data plate from the second spindle.

The first spindle had a different data plate on it and a different motor housing with different mounting holes. Motor also looked as if someone had mounted it before I got it.

There is no way a 4Kw motor can be 10 Amps, 10Amps would be if it was running on 380V supply, the 2.2Kw 220v spindles are 8.5 and up to 10A for the better quality spindles

Why would you buy a 4Kw spindle and only have the power supply to run a 2.2Kw spindle ??

That will be a very wimpy motor running off of that supply, which also would not pass the electrical code wired how it is.

[Padawon01]

For whatever reason its advertised as a 4kW spindle. I didn't design it, I don't know why they chose to inflate their advertised power. No clue.

When I purchased it, I was expecting a 4kW spindle. I have since discovered that it is not. It would cost me more to remake the mounting features than to just continue on with the spindle, despite its slightly lower power rating based on the math (not their false advertising). None of this matters. The spindle needs to last long enough for me to mill the parts necessary to upgrade to a 3-phase electric motor with belt driven spindle so I can properly mill steels.

What I care about is that it supposedly has a little more power than the standard 2.2kW offerings, its square and has consistent mounting features, it cannot rotate in a mounting bracket, and has an ER25 collet.

[mactec54]

For whatever reason its advertised as a 4kW spindle. I didn't design it, I don't know why they chose to inflate their advertised power. No clue.

When I purchased it, I was expecting a 4kW spindle. I have since discovered that it is not. It would cost me more to remake the mounting features than to just continue on with the spindle, despite its slightly lower power rating based on the math (not their false advertising). None of this matters. The spindle needs to last long enough for me to mill the parts necessary to upgrade to a 3-phase electric motor with belt driven spindle so I can properly mill steels.

What I care about is that it supposedly has a little more power than the standard 2.2kW offerings, its square and has consistent mounting features, it cannot rotate in a mounting bracket, and has an ER25 collet.

If you were to use the ER25 max tool size the spindle will stall using this spindle in its dumbed down condition, it may even stall with a 12mm endmill with the correct depth of cut, so having an ER25 is not always worth it unless you have the power to drive it.

Mill steel on what kind of machine, do you have???

Round body spindles do not turn or move in the spindle mounting holder if the mount is the correct size

A 2.2Kw 3Hp spindle has no problem with milling aluminum and does it very well, with the right speeds and feeds, the machines rigidity is normally the problem, not the spindle power, a normal knee mill has from 1.5Hp to 3Hp motor which can mill any material types with much lower RPM range available

[Padawon01]

If you were to use the ER25 max tool size the spindle will stall using this spindle in its dumbed down condition, it may even stall with a 12mm endmill with the correct depth of cut, so having an ER25 is not always worth it unless you have the power to drive it.

Regardless, I would like to make some test cuts to see for myself. I also don't understand how it is "dumbed down" - how is this any different than a round air-cooled motor?

Mill steel on what kind of machine, do you have???

Vertical 3-axis, not a gantry style.

Round body spindles do not turn or move in the spindle mounting holder if the mount is the correct size

Noted. There were other reasons for not going to a round spindle, but it's looking more and more like that may be what I need to do.

The main attraction to this air-cooled unit was the higher power, lower maximum RPM, and the other features I mentioned earlier. This is also why I went with the GT-series VFD - to increase torque IF possible. If its not possible, then I still have the GT series VFD already in place for the 3-phase electric motor and belt driven spindle. Again, to utilize its features to improve torque on the electric motor and spindle.

A 2.2Kw 3Hp spindle has no problem with milling aluminum and does it very well, with the right speeds and feeds, the machines rigidity is normally the problem, not the spindle power, a normal knee mill has from 1.5Hp to 3Hp motor which can mill any material types with much lower RPM range available

Right. Seeing the 4kW motor, along with its mounting features seemed like it would be a good fit. Even at ~3kW, it should be more than plenty to mill aluminum.

It doesn't really matter though if this VFD isn't going to work with it. I have been through the settings enough to nearly have them memorized. I have reset the VFD countless times, I have set up the spindle parameters countless times, and I just end up chasing one issue, fixing it, and finding another (mostly the command signal issues and the OC3 and OC1 faults). Oddly enough, the OC1 fault can be triggered as a result of the command signal circuit being closed at the wrong time. If the logic sees a closed circuit, then an open, then a closed, it can trip the OC1 fault (think attaching a jumper between S1 and COM, inserting the wire, making contact, losing contact when I go to tighten the terminal screw). I am going to swap in an HY series VFD and give that a try - if the HY series has the same issues, then I have a feeling that there may be something going on with this spindle design.

[mactec54]

Regardless, I would like to make some test cuts to see for myself. I also don't understand how it is "dumbed down" - how is this any different than a round air-cooled motor?



Vertical 3-axis, not a gantry style.



Noted. There were other reasons for not going to a round spindle, but it's looking more and more like that may be what I need to do.

The main attraction to this air-cooled unit was the higher power, lower maximum RPM, and the other features I mentioned earlier. This is also why I went with the GT-series VFD - to increase torque IF possible. If its not possible, then I still have the GT series VFD already in place for the 3-phase electric motor and belt driven spindle. Again, to utilize its features to improve torque on the electric motor and spindle.



Right. Seeing the 4kW motor, along with its mounting features seemed like it would be a good fit. Even at ~3kW, it should be more than plenty to mill aluminum.

It doesn't really matter though if this VFD isn't going to work with it. I have been through the settings enough to nearly have them memorized. I have reset the VFD countless times, I have set up the spindle parameters countless times, and I just end up chasing one issue, fixing it, and finding another (mostly the command signal issues and the OC3 and OC1 faults). Oddly enough, the OC1 fault can be triggered as a result of the command signal circuit being closed at the wrong time. If the logic sees a closed circuit, then an open, then a closed, it can trip the OC1 fault (think attaching a jumper between S1 and COM, inserting the wire, making contact, losing contact when I go to tighten the terminal screw). I am going to swap in an HY series VFD and give that a try - if the HY series has the same issues, then I have a feeling that there may be something going on with this spindle design.

But you don't have higher power output it has been dumbed down to 10A it may be little better if you can get it running, than a 2.2Kw but with your 25A supply it won't be great. 25A supply is what is used for a 2.2Kw spindle

The OC3 tells you your Power supply voltage / current is not sufficient; you would need a minimum of 40A supply all the way to the VFD Drive to run this size spindle

OC1 is a similar problem relates to a low bus voltage, because the input supply is not what it needs, there is only one thing that may help that is the P0.11=15 acceleration or ramp up to speed
this can be set at any number which may give it a chance to get up to speed

Just remember all the main Parameters must not be changed or you will see lots of smoke, so there are not many that can be changed to run your spindle

Using a jumper between S1 and Com is a bad idea, just use the keypad if this is a problem with your control

Changing to a Regular HY VFD will not change anything, you will have the same problems

There is nothing wrong with a direct mounted spindle like you have, just needs to be sized correct for your Power supply

[Padawon01]

But you don't have higher power output it has been dumbed down to 10A it may be little better if you can get it running, than a 2.2Kw but with your 25A supply it won't be great. 25A supply is what is used for a 2.2Kw spindle

I think I understand what you are saying. I was thinking you meant VFD power output, but you're referring to motor output. Yes, the motor output is limited to 10A, which makes the 25A breaker/fuse slightly oversized by about 5-10A.

The OC3 tells you your Power supply voltage / current is not sufficient; you would need a minimum of 40A supply all the way to the VFD Drive to run this size spindle

To run a true 4kW or to run the spindle as is now? How did you arrive at 40A? The spindle can only draw 10A under normal 100% load and the VFD only allows 10A to the spindle. Could you explain how you get the 40A? Thank you.

OC1 is a similar problem relates to a low bus voltage, because the input supply is not what it needs, there is only one thing that may help that is the P0.11=15 acceleration or ramp up to speed
this can be set at any number which may give it a chance to get up to speed

I have tried to adjust the acceleration in 5 second increments, starting at 10 seconds and going to 30 seconds. This did not solve the fault code. I don't think that ambient temperature changes would impact performance enough to throw a fault code in the first <10s of operation, but I could be wrong.

Just remember all the main Parameters must not be changed or you will see lots of smoke, so there are not many that can be changed to run your spindle

Right. When those are set, they are stored even when the parameters are cleared and reset to factory settings. I check the P2.xx series parameters every time I make changes and have noticed this.

Using a jumper between S1 and Com is a bad idea, just use the keypad if this is a problem with your control

This is the primary reason for me wanting to try the HY series.

Changing to a Regular HY VFD will not change anything, you will have the same problems

I believe the 0-10v control is different.

There is nothing wrong with a direct mounted spindle like you have, just needs to be sized correct for your Power supply

Right and I would like to get it up and running. I had it running just fine - to include using a jumper to activate the FWD run condition. This last time I went to run it, I jumped the S1/COM like I had done previous times, and now it throws OC1 in <10s. It threw OC1 one other time, and it was under the same conditions.

[mactec54]

I think I understand what you are saying. I was thinking you meant VFD power output, but you're referring to motor output. Yes, the motor output is limited to 10A, which makes the 25A breaker/fuse slightly oversized by about 5-10A.



To run a true 4kW or to run the spindle as is now? How did you arrive at 40A? The spindle can only draw 10A under normal 100% load and the VFD only allows 10A to the spindle. Could you explain how you get the 40A? Thank you.





I have tried to adjust the acceleration in 5 second increments, starting at 10 seconds and going to 30 seconds. This did not solve the fault code. I don't think that ambient temperature changes would impact performance enough to throw a fault code in the first <10s of operation, but I could be wrong.





Right. When those are set, they are stored even when the parameters are cleared and reset to factory settings. I check the P2.xx series parameters every time I make changes and have noticed this.






This is the primary reason for me wanting to try the HY series.






I believe the 0-10v control is different.






Right and I would like to get it up and running. I had it running just fine - to include using a jumper to activate the FWD run condition. This last time I went to run it, I jumped the S1/COM like I had done previous times, and now it throws OC1 in <10s. It threw OC1 one other time, and it was under the same conditions.

Your 25A supply circuit is way undersize for the 4Kw spindle motor, this is why you are having problems, your 4Kw spindle motor is 220v 17A x1.732=29Ax125%=36A so the closest Breaker would be 40A circuit, a 25A circuit is never going to do a very good job of running the 4Kw spindle on 220v / 240v single phase supply if this was 3Phase supply then a 25A main Power supply would work

I thought I made it clear a 2.2Kw spindle requires a minimum of 25A supply Circuit for it to have max performance You 4Kw spindle is going to be very wimpy unless you can up the Current required which means bigger everything including main Power supply wiring to suit, if you had of used the full 30A Main Power supply circuit that you have, this would have given you a better chance at it running quite well

The Spindle set at 10A can easy draw 3X that on startup, so if the DC Bus Voltage can't reach its voltage max this will cause a fault OC3 and OC1, this has nothing to do with you using a jumper S1-Com, that is just a logic circuit and is just like turning on a switch


The 0-10v is no different than on any VFD Drive they are all the same you just made it more difficult than it had to be.

The main Parameters that have to be set are in the P0 group the P2 is just the motor specs the P0 Parameters are the most important.

What's wrong with the KeyPad on the GT VFD Drive you just have to set a Parameter for it to be working, which is no different than the regular HY VFD Drive

P0.01=0 KeyPad Control
P0.07=1 Pot control