[haralampos]

Hi, I need to build a 12 axis cnc. My issue is that I need to find a software to control these motors. Mach 3 and others that I've seen can control until 6. Does anyone knows how can I control them or any program; Thanks!

[Jim Dawson]

In the hobby class controllers, I think only Dynomotion has a 16 axis board. https://www.dynomotion.com/Kogna.html

Max for the others is 6 axis I think

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
Mach4 has six axes but also six out-of-band motors for a total of 12.

When you say you want 12 axes,are they all simultaneous or coordinated? If one or more are just free running spindles then that reduces the number
of 'axes', where axes are all coordinated.

Craig

[elfrench]

LinuxCNC has 9 axes and each can have multiple motors.

[haralampos]

Thank you all so much for your answers! Craig I need 12 moving tools so I think mach 4 doesn't fit to my project.

[joeavaerage]

Hi,

I need 12 moving tools so I think mach 4 doesn't fit to my project.

But do they need to be coordinated?.

Imagine this Gcode move:

G0 X10 Y15 Z20 A360 B-360 C720

This would result in the X axis moving to X=10, Y moving to Y=15, Z moving to Z=20, A rotating one revolution ie 360 degrees, B rotating one revolution backward ie -360 degrees
and the C axis rotating two revolution ie 720 degrees, all at the same time such that all six axes arrive at their intended destination at exactly the same time.
This would be called coordinated.

Imagine however that you had two out-of-band spindles say motor6 and motor7. They can be moved or perhaps set to run at a constant speed and MEANWHILE the
move above could run. That would mean the six axis motors would drive in coordinated fashion while motor6 and motor7 run at a constant speed. That would be a case of
six coordinated axes and two un-coordinated axes, but still eight in total.

If you require more than six coordinated axes then Mach4 cannot do it, but it can do six coordinated and another six out-of-band axes simultaneously.

Craig

[haralampos]

Dear Craig, thanks for your reply! This that you suggest is very interesting, but how am I gonna make it ; Should I take a motion card and at every motor input have to connect two motors; How is it working;
Thanks for your time!

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
making a complete system is several questions down the track.

You need to be able to answer the most basic question....'how many axes must move in a simultaneous and coordinated manner?'
This is absolutely basic. For instance you might have a three axis machine, that is X, Y, Z and they will have to move in coordinated fashion
to traverse a toolpath. The fact that each axis may have two or more motors is less important but that three axes have to move in concert is important.

You may have heard about Swiss lathes, and they are often quoted as 12 axis or 18 axis or whatever, but mostly the axes which work together, and have
to work together, is usually three or four, sometimes five. The remaining 'axes' are able to move but they do so in an uncoordinated way with respect
to the motion axes. I don't know what sort of machine you have or want, but I'm guessing that it may be something along the same lines.
In which case maybe a simpler controller like Mach4 might be stretched to do as you require.

I believe Fanuc do a controller that has 27 simultaneous axes and Seimens do one with 40 simultaneous axes but they cost many many thousands, maybe $20,000.

Craig

[peteeng]

Hi Haral - Look at Duet3d can have as many axes as you like. Peter

https://www.duet3d.com/

[Algirdas]

I agree with Mr. joeavaerage

I need 12 moving tools

First we need to understand what is the axis interaction. There is no standard description how the axes should be counted. "12 moving tools" could mean 12 x 5 axes or it can be 12 sepatare contact points without synchronisation, just with interlock.
Normaly as from the control point of view we say "5 Axis control" when the contact point follows the free 3D path synchronously with two inclination ( or attacke angle ) axes. This is quite complicated control in terms of getting constant cutting speed for instance.

[Jim Dawson]

Hi, I need to build a 12 axis cnc. My issue is that I need to find a software to control these motors. Mach 3 and others that I've seen can control until 6. Does anyone knows how can I control them or any program; Thanks!

One thing you have not told us is the type of machine. Is this a turning machine, milling machine, mill/turn, or some other type of machine? There are many control options available, but it depends on the machine type and your budget.

[haralampos]

Hi guys,

http://itaya.eu/spring-forming-machine/rx-series/

https://youtu.be/Q0Wx-j3Z8_E

These type of machines are interesting me, to understand what I need. So I thing that duet3d is a good solution thanks Peter!
Craig please tell me how is working this that you suggest ? We set a parallel card ?

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
that machine may have perhaps two, three or maybe four axes that move in unison, ie coordinated and the rest are uncoordinated, sometimes also called 'out of band'
axes.

You might want to control 12 tools or dies or whatever, but only a small number need be coordinated, which allows you to use a much simpler control than if all 12
tools were coordinated.

Most solutions have a CNC program running on a PC, and that is hooked to a motion control board, and that in turn is hooked to the motor drivers via relays etc.

Mach4 requires a motion controller like an ESS, however the ESS can handle at most six axes.

Maybe peetengs Duet3 is a good idea. It can have many axes but as far as I can see/read its motion planner has only six coordinated axes, the rest being out of band. Nonetheless it looks like a solution....you just keep
adding extension boards until you have enough.

Craig

[haralampos]

Hi Craig, when you say 6 axis in unison you mean I can call into a line for example G0 x1 y1 z1 a1 b1 c1 and on the next line I can call more six G0 r1 t1 k1 p1 v1 w1 can I do this with mach 4? Indeed I don't care if all the axis come together. The moves are simple the command on this machine for each tool is go 10mm front go 10mm back I will not use a cam like mill machine. Think I can do this with mach4;

[joeavaerage]

Hi,
Mach4 can do six coordinated axes plus another six out of band (OB) axes.

So you could call G0 x1 y1 z1 a1 b1 c1 an the axes x,y,z,a,b and c would all move in unison and all end up at the end point of the move at the same time.
However if you have two OB axes, say r and t then G0 r1 t 1 would cause the two axes to move but they would not move in unison. Lets say the t axis is naturally
slower than the r axis, then the r axis would arrive at its endpoint first and some time later t would arrive. If they were coordinated then r would slow down to match
t and they would arrive at the same time.

As an example referring to your 'dream' machine that you linked to earlier. If two dies approach the part and squeeze it if the two dies arrived at the centreline of the part at the same time
then the part would be deformed but with radial symmetry. If the two dies approached at different speeds and uncoordinated the part would be deformed but not symmetrically.

The critical point is that you decide how many axes you need to be coordinated. To my knowledge hobbyist controllers are limited to six coordinated axes even if they have many more OB axes.
That has to do with the software trajectory planner.

Craig