[bartp]

Hey guys, I have a slight problem with my SolidWorks.

I purchased an academic license of SolidWorks 2008 for school (I'm an aerospace engineering major) but I'm having slight problem with enabling Hardware OpenGL on my laptop.

I have two computers, a brand new tower at home with good graphic card, SolidWorks works flawlessly on that. However, I primeraly use my laptop for everyday use, since I'm home almost never... I purchased the laptop in December, it's an HP dv2660se with Intel Centrino 965 chipset, meaning it has an IGP X3100 graphic card (integrated). From what I understand it supports OpenGL, but for some reason SolidWorks cannot detect hardware supported OpenGL. For, it enables Software OpenGL by default and disables the option of unchecking the "Use Software OpenGL" button in performance menu in properties. I'm trying to solve this riddle for some time now, I cannot find anyone else with the same problem, I tried countless things such as reinstalling the software, newest video Drivers, and trying to trace the option of enabling the Hardware Support in Windows Registery.

The SolidWorks support line is no use, as they tell me "Your graphic card is not on the list of supported hardware, therefore we cannot help you". From what I read, This verson of SolidWorks should detect any OpenGL supporing graphic card and use that, but for some reason it does not.

Did anyone else ever had that problem? or figured out how to bypass it? I would hate to replace a one month old laptop!

Thanks,
Bart

[DareBee]

2 strikes against you.
ATI is not a CAD friendly card.....period.
The openGL that that card supports is different than what SW 08 needs.

You will have to use software GL or get a new laptop.
My laptop is for occasional SW use so I cheaped out a wee bit and got a new Dell with an 8600M GT. It works very well.
If it was my primary CAD machine I would never use ANYTHING but a quadro card. Currently running 5 Quadro's and have thrown out a few old ones. I tried 3d Labs back in the early years but they was bad. FireGL is known for having driver issues but I haven't tried them for that reason (and the Quadro cards have been flawless!).

[Spinnetti]

Hmm.. Don't have a definitive answer, but I'm running it on a iMac which has an ATI x1600 card, and basically has laptop internals - works dandy.. may just need a driver? Post on the Soldworks user forums - Somebody should be able to help.

[bartp]

Hmm.. Don't have a definitive answer, but I'm running it on a iMac which has an ATI x1600 card, and basically has laptop internals - works dandy.. may just need a driver? Post on the Soldworks user forums - Somebody should be able to help.

its an Intel X3100 card, some Macs use this card as well and I know they work fine with SolidWorks

It also popped to my head that I'm using Vista Home Premium, and the manufacturer supports only Business and Ultra, maybe that has something to do with it.... Good thing that we have an MSDN account, I'll get a license.

[bartp]

2 strikes against you.
ATI is not a CAD friendly card.....period.
The openGL that that card supports is different than what SW 08 needs.

Its an Intel card not ATI, in which cases it's sometimes worst, but I originally purchased Centrino because of battery life, not thinking that I might do CADing later on.

[pixburghenat]

Its an Intel card not ATI, in which cases it's sometimes worst, but I originally purchased Centrino because of battery life, not thinking that I might do CADing later on.

...check with HP, they might have a 'piggyback' card that will plug in to up the graphics card.


pix

[DareBee]

Sorry bout that (I read 1300 (ATI) not 3100).

2008 has really upped the sys requirements, integrated graphics may not work at all anymore.

[JerryFlyGuy]

Sw is tough on computers and graphics cards. If there is a knock against the program, this has to be it. I purchased a new DELL Precision M6300 in December. It came w/ a Nvidia Quadro FX 1600M graphics card. I've got a 3 mth old 'Monster server desktop pc' w/ the same ram and an ATI FireGL V7350 card and the laptop kills it. If your serious about SW, the only sane thing to do is go and look up what they have for 'tested and approved/passed' video cards [and for laptops they include actual systems] on their website [it's why I bought/picked my M6300 over all the other 'cheaper' units on offer]
I've tested other laptops and I've yet to find one that works well w/ SW as these Precision models [there are lots of them on ebay, just search for Precision M60,M90,M4300 or M6300]. If it isn't on the approved list.. it's just a gamble and w/ the kinda $$ laptops cost.. you gotta be pretty lucky to get one that works and not lose your shirt at the same time.

Now that you have the HP, I'm not sure if there is an upgrade you can do to install a better card [I suspect that it's an 'on-board' card which isn't replacable]. I don't know if you'll ever be able to run SW on it.

Sorry

[DareBee]

I bet a Vid company could make good money by developing a good PCMCIA vid card, or something similar.

[tnik]

For, it enables Software OpenGL by default and disables the option of unchecking the "Use Software OpenGL" button in performance menu in properties.

if you goto options before opening a part file and check the open GL on, does it turn it off after you open a part file?

[d8432]

You said that your OS is Windows Vista... I think it isnt a good system for CAD, even if you have all drivers adn SW 2008. I guess you could try switching to XP and re-install SW.

There are some forums where you could get your drivers (if u dont have em), so try it. My laptop came with W Vista and 0 drivers, I just could use Explorer and Word, but when changed to XP with all drivers it was quite fast... If it cant be helped well.... you may think on getting another laptop, maybe one with a Geforce Go.

Good luck

[JerryFlyGuy]

While I use XP and haven't used Vista [avoid it if possible] SW is certified for use w/ Vista 32bit.. I've not heard anyone complain about it not working properly on the SW site forums.. [Maybe I'm just not paying close enough attention over there....]

What service pack are you trying to run??

[Spinnetti]

Sw is tough on computers and graphics cards. If there is a knock against the program, this has to be it. I purchased a new DELL Precision M6300 in December. It came w/ a Nvidia Quadro FX 1600M graphics card. I've got a 3 mth old 'Monster server desktop pc' w/ the same ram and an ATI FireGL V7350 card and the laptop kills it. If your serious about SW, the only sane thing to do is go and look up what they have for 'tested and approved/passed' video cards [and for laptops they include actual systems] on their website [it's why I bought/picked my M6300 over all the other 'cheaper' units on offer]
I've tested other laptops and I've yet to find one that works well w/ SW as these Precision models [there are lots of them on ebay, just search for Precision M60,M90,M4300 or M6300]. If it isn't on the approved list.. it's just a gamble and w/ the kinda $$ laptops cost.. you gotta be pretty lucky to get one that works and not lose your shirt at the same time.

Now that you have the HP, I'm not sure if there is an upgrade you can do to install a better card [I suspect that it's an 'on-board' card which isn't replacable]. I don't know if you'll ever be able to run SW on it.

Sorry

Not sure thats it. Works perfect on my integrated x1600 ATI mobile graphics on my Mac, and also on my 5year old 2.8gig PC with lord knows what video card in it.... prolly just driver stuff.

[ALC4CNC]

On regards to the
Nvidia Quadro FX card; It is my knowledge that Quadro cards are for high performance but on 2D applications only.

meaning that they are intended for high RES and High Color but in 2d like when doing photoshop, movie viewing, movie editing, and other apps like excel where there might be lots of uP work but always in 2D.

for that reason I got stuck with a new nVidia Quadro card myslef. and never really used it.
perhaps this is your problem. (the wrong video card)

[JerryFlyGuy]

Not sure thats it. Works perfect on my integrated x1600 ATI mobile graphics on my Mac, and also on my 5year old 2.8gig PC with lord knows what video card in it.... prolly just driver stuff.

Ya, the MAC stuff is totally out of my area of experiance, are you getting a full real view w/ that ATI card and a MAC? Do you do photo renderings as well??

I seriously think you'll have trouble getting it to work on the laptop..however I hope you prove me wrong!! Best of luck

ALC4CNC.. um, I've never heard it said that the Quadro cards are for 2d only. I've used a few of them and they always seem to out perform pretty much every other SW certified card I've tried. Like I said, my laptop w/ a Quadro Fx 1600M will kill my desktop w/ a ATI FireGL v7350. [Go look at the spec's of those two cards.. it should be the other way around but it isn't.] I used to be an ATI believer, but I'll be buying Nvidea of the foreseeable future..

The Quadro cards are at the top of the list when it comes to SW tested and approved cards.. I don't know of any that are better.. Please pass on any info or sites which would point us to even better cards.. I'm always looking for performance at a decent price..

[ALC4CNC]

Yeah Jerry

I had never heard of the Quadro card being any different so when I found what I thought was a high end card at a great price at the store. I quickly snatched it.
thinking for once I was going to be able to handle rendering in MAYA
with all the bells and whistles of skin translucency, realistic water, "sub pixel shading", Chrome and metals, and all the other capabilities of directX 9 or OpenGl 2.

However, somewhere I found technical details stating that the Quadro was optimized for high performance in 2D apps like I mentioned.
it can still do 3D but not from hardware since the GPU is not designed for 3D apps, 3D gaming, etc. so the main CPU does the work. (and it could not achieve the rendering of Metals in photo quality)

sort of like rendering Mpg2 or Mpg4 movies w/o an encoder board with those specialized chips.

My MPG2 card could convert on the fly w high quality. MIRO DC-50
but without, you have to finish editing your movie (with non-MPG2 original clips, like DV)
then Render to MPG2 via software thru the main CPU
and the quality is never the same and takes 8 times as long or more.

MPG4 was never intended to have its own encoder since it was thought that the main CPUs, by now, were powerful enough to the rendering easily.
but that was never really the case.
so now you can buy Vid capture cards with MPG4 encoder chip built in

on Regards to nVidia cards; nVidia has become clearly the leader in Video cards. 3d Game companies, even AutoCAD and other companies are writing their programs specifically for nVidia GPUS and to fully utilize their capabilities.
(not to forget you must have direct X 9c installed (in not using OpenGL)

ATI and others Can only simulate certain capabilities or under perform.

BTW: the Capabilities of nVidia Chips(3D) coupled with the Capabilites of DX9 have surpassed the rendering of OpenGL and some of the companies I mentioned are switching from OpenGL to specifically, Windows rendering


So, you could not hardly get a better card than nVidia now.
unless you are into Hollywood Movie making and willing to spend the big bucks for a rendering box. or Multi GPU cards.

Disclaimer:
Jerry the only thing I not sure about is, if there is such thing as "Quadro" and "Quadro FX" if so, maybe that's the diff.
you might want to research that.
but so far I DO KNOW that Quadro is Optimized for high performance 2D.

I hope the other info is also of use.

I am also an INDIE filmmaker in Hollywood BTW

Oh, one more thing; Check your DX installation. sometimes when you install a program it also installs the version of DX that it needed at the time that prog was made, thereby replacing your own installation.
meaning you could have HAD DX9 but replaced by DX8.x by one of your progs.

from the RUN window type DXDIAG to check your DX version, check on bad drivers and test your 3D DX features (I have found some DX disabled)
make sure all buttons say ENABLED, test sound etc.

Cheers


ALC

[pixburghenat]

bartp may need to contact HP and see if his video card is truly intergated into the motherboard or if it's a plug in on the board that can be upgraded.
I had a compaq laptop that was upgradable this way.

The Quadro cards had many models, check the nvidia site for all the details.
But, for vector based 3D graphics, it's the best. And it works just fine for 2D stuff too, like AutoCAD.

What it doesn't work the best with is Nerbs base 3D graphics, which Maya is and other software like Rhino. The nvidia Gforce line of cards are ideal for nerbs based 3d graphics and they work very well with 2D also.

I kinda understand the problem bartp is having, I have an Intel Graphics 2 video on my motherboard and it's terrible for Solidworks. I only have it there in case the nvidia card dies, but it works fine for most everything else including AutoCad.

I've used ATI Fire GL2, 3Dlabs, Matrox, and nvidia cards over the years and the nvidia works the best for Solidworks, ProE, Lightyear, and GeoMagic.

I think anyone will see the difference when a Solidworks assembly is opened with only a few dozen parts, the non workstation class cards will begin to struggle, have a few of those parts opened at the same time and those cards will choke.

If you want to do a quickie test of your videocard in Solidworks, search for Mike Wilson's 'ship in a bottle' over at comp.cad.solidworks. Run that for 50 rebuilds. ***found link while typing ***

http://www.mikejwilson.com/solidwork...orks_files.htm

Greater than say 50 seconds is really slow, less than 50 is good, less than 40 is very good, less than 30 is really really good. ...you get the idea

...mine came in at 39.5 seconds with an nvidia FX1000 AGP. ***updated it was 39.5 not 29.5*** in 2007
...when loaded into 2008 the bottle wasn't transparent, but it ran at 44 seconds.

But you can't compare videocard preformance using two different types of software on two completely different computers....it's the apples and oranges thing.


bartp, you may be able to live with your laptop using Solidworks. In Solidworks, turn off dynamic highlighting, set the performance levels to about the middle range, turn off snapping, turn off the grid, and try setting the auto relations to just horizontal, vertical, and center. In windows, I'd turn off the animated window stuff along with anything that makes a sound when you click or move your mouse over it and a basic single color background in both
windows and Solidworks.


...sorry for the long post (for me anyway) and I hope it makes some sence.


Scott

[JerryFlyGuy]

ALC4cnc, one thing I should clarify. I think you've got me mixed up w/ the original poster.. I'm having absolutely no issues w/ my Quadro Fx Card. Attached is a render I just did on an old model I had kicking around.. So regardless of whether they say it will or won't render on 3d.. it does it.. and it also does it in real time w/ certain functions.. [in 2008]

picxburg, I looked up that model and loaded it up.. are you talking about just the regen stats? Mine was 1.08 seconds.. seems like a big descrepency from 30+seconds.. what am I missing??

[pixburghenat]

Hi Jerry,

The zip file had a macro in there.
In Solidworks, TOOLS|MACRO|RUN filebox will open, load the file.


Are you using 07 or 08?

In 08 the bottle lost it's transparency.


Scott

[JerryFlyGuy]

I'm using 08. Actually, if you translate the photoworks data into 08, the bottle becomes transparent again.. I ran it w/ the performance sliders at the top of the scale [in the red] and it took 30.28 seconds. When I start pulling it back it drops pretty quick. Part way back and I'm down to 24.89.

Not too bad for a laptop I don't think..