[kanton]

Is anyone familiar with this company or this mill as described here: http://www.atron.com.tw/uwish/front/....phtml?Part=K3

I was wondering how much it cost and if it is available in the U.S..

Also, is it a Seig KX3?

Their site doesn't provide much information.

[CROSSHATCH]

It's looks too be identical too the Seig KX3. Same Mill under different name....


-Jason

[djnbig]

Fair enough, RBP.

djn

[syil]

as we konw.how-mao no factroy,no own products,total buy from other factroy and just a trading company sell tools in taiwan.
in china only SIEG.SYIL and SMITHY,TORMACH make this kind cnc machine by ownself.Others total trading no back service in later.
regards them smithy machine.syil will present soonly as new edition name will be X6.but will be totally different.just size similar.
then we will also have a X7 present only SYIL make on 1000KG very soonly.

more our factory pic,please email to us for get,we don`t want to post at here like how mao to attract customers.
as i konw those factroy pic from them was not belong how-mao,really a cheating advertise banner.

[djnbig]

So are you saying that HOW-MAU buys directly from the factory that produces the smithy machines in China?

Can anyone who knows exactly how this all works shed some light on this?

Who's actually producing all these machines for smithy, syil, tormach, etc .and why are other companies allowed to rebrand the EXACT same hardware without any consequence?

thx.

djn

[sansbury]

So are you saying that HOW-MAU buys directly from the factory that produces the smithy machines in China?

Can anyone who knows exactly how this all works shed some light on this?

Who's actually producing all these machines for smithy, syil, tormach, etc .and why are other companies allowed to rebrand the EXACT same hardware without any consequence?

thx.

djn

Well, I don't know *exactly how all this works* but I can provide a little color commentary.

1. There is not really much "secret sauce" in these machines in terms of patents, intellectual property, really brilliant engineering. With the exception of the edges of the CNC chain (e.g. Mach and Gecko drives), this is all cutting edge circa 1940-something.

2. Manufacturing techniques (sand casting and machining of iron) are equally old-school. Anybody with a little bit of knowhow and a permissive regulatory environment can do it.

3. Asia (and particularly China) is known for a very... tolerant attitude towards things like photocopying your competitor's blueprints and making your own version for 20% less. The South Koreans and Chinese are masters of reverse-engineering as can be seen from things like the iPhone clones that were released within a few months of the real iPhone--some of them actually had even better feature sets. I would not be surprised to see companies buying Sieg mills, measuring them, and making carbon copies of them with little consequence, especially if they were outside of mainland China.

4. There is as much (and often far more) profit to be made in distribution, marketing, and sales as in manufacturing, and this is especially true of a relatively commoditized item like these mills. Just add up the weight of cast iron in them relative to the price and realize that Sieg is probably getting only a minority share of the price you pay, and you'll see what I mean.

5. This sort of re-branding/packaging is far more common than I think many people realize. There have always been all sorts of "secret bargains" out there where you get $20 brand-name products in $4 brown-paper-bag packaging. For the most part the brand-name guys have been OK with this so long as they are able to convince enough people that they're actually really better and special. Smithy is selling you their name and reputation for support. The How-Mau dealer may or may not still exist when you have a problem, but hey, you saved 10-20% off the Smithy price, so maybe you come out ahead. So long as the gap remains reasonably large, no one is really competing that closely with each other.

[2ndSteel]

I recently came across this companyies website and saw that they have TT type tooling advertised. I contacted them regarding pricing for their QT57 set. A 20 piece set that clearly list a boring head and boring bar set which is also shown in the pictures. Jessica replyed to my email the next day and said it would be $267. I was pleased with the price and told her I wanted to proceed. Next came the payment issue. I wanted to pay by credit card or paypal but as you will see they do not want to use those. They don't want you to have any way to stop payment, So I agreed to wire the money. Next day I get an email that said so sorry but the price I was quoted for the QT57 set was with out the boring head and bar set and that I would need to pay $100 more for those. I asked how much shipping to Mongolia would be and she said $14 by air. I thought ok and offered to purchase this set for $350 delivered. Jessica accepted. I provide my shipping address in Mongolia and she provided bank transfer info. I wire $350 to the indicated account and 2 days later I receive an email that the item has been shipped. This was on a Saturday afternoon. Monday morning I receive an email that I need to send another $140 to cover shipping to Mongolia. I am told that they made a mistake in quoting the freight and thought I meant Inner Mongolia which is part of China. I had provided my complete address. There is no mention of Inner Mongolia on any of my correspondence. So now my good price set of TT tooling that I thought would be $267 is now up to $507. I ask for my money back and I am given the run around and told that I will have to pay their bank fees. I wait another day for a response and in the mean time I have a business acquaintance in Shanghai that I have contacted to see if he will accept this item and then bring it with him in February. I ask Jesica if she will send it to my friend and she said it will be $14 in shipping. Now Jesica is demanding that I wire the $14 upfront for shipping to Shanghai. This will cost me another $7 in bank fees. I again ask for my money back and I am now being ignored. So my recommendation is to not do any business with this company. Jesica finally came back and said they will send it to Shanghai for $4.50 but I need to wire that before they will ship it. After sending several emails asking for my money to be refunded they agree to ship it to my friend COD for the shipping charges and since I am obviously not going to get a refund of the money I have already sent I agree. The kit is now in Shanghai and I have learned a valuable lesson. THIS IS NOT A COMPANY I WILL DO BUSINESS AGAIN.

[philbur]

Which company??

Phil

I recently came across this companyies website and saw that they have TT type tooling advertised. I contacted them regarding pricing for their QT57 set. A 20 piece set that clearly list a boring head and boring bar set which is also shown in the pictures. Jessica replyed to my email the next day and said it would be $267. I was pleased with the price and told her I wanted to proceed. Next came the payment issue. I wanted to pay by credit card or paypal but as you will see they do not want to use those. They don't want you to have any way to stop payment, So I agreed to wire the money. Next day I get an email that said so sorry but the price I was quoted for the QT57 set was with out the boring head and bar set and that I would need to pay $100 more for those. I asked how much shipping to Mongolia would be and she said $14 by air. I thought ok and offered to purchase this set for $350 delivered. Jessica accepted. I provide my shipping address in Mongolia and she provided bank transfer info. I wire $350 to the indicated account and 2 days later I receive an email that the item has been shipped. This was on a Saturday afternoon. Monday morning I receive an email that I need to send another $140 to cover shipping to Mongolia. I am told that they made a mistake in quoting the freight and thought I meant Inner Mongolia which is part of China. I had provided my complete address. There is no mention of Inner Mongolia on any of my correspondence. So now my good price set of TT tooling that I thought would be $267 is now up to $507. I ask for my money back and I am given the run around and told that I will have to pay their bank fees. I wait another day for a response and in the mean time I have a business acquaintance in Shanghai that I have contacted to see if he will accept this item and then bring it with him in February. I ask Jesica if she will send it to my friend and she said it will be $14 in shipping. Now Jesica is demanding that I wire the $14 upfront for shipping to Shanghai. This will cost me another $7 in bank fees. I again ask for my money back and I am now being ignored. So my recommendation is to not do any business with this company. Jesica finally came back and said they will send it to Shanghai for $4.50 but I need to wire that before they will ship it. After sending several emails asking for my money to be refunded they agree to ship it to my friend COD for the shipping charges and since I am obviously not going to get a refund of the money I have already sent I agree. The kit is now in Shanghai and I have learned a valuable lesson. THIS IS NOT A COMPANY I WILL DO BUSINESS AGAIN.

[2ndSteel]

TAIWAN HOW-MAU MACHINERY is the name of the company and it's web site is listed in the first post of this thread.