[Talisman]

Hey guys, Not sure if this is the right forum or not since its mostly mazak. I have an mid 90's Dyna Mite Machine that has a Mitsubishi Meldas M3 control. I have all the parameters set in the machine as it was as new. But It seems I'm not getting any communication between the axis drives and the control as the LED display on the drives just say "Ab"... Its not displaying any alarms or errors, but I can't move the machine in X, Y, or Z, or turn on the spindle? anyone have any ideas?

[Leelund]

Try the attached sheet and see if it helps any. You can get the whole manual from Meau for your particular servo. Lee

[Talisman]

Thanks Leelund!

[Talisman]

Ok, so here's an update...I'm still in need of some help.

Basically I Isolated the spindle drive and took it out of the equation. unhooked the communication cable going from the axis drive to the spindle drive and plugged in the RF transistor plug to end communication there. And the drives work fine at that point. I can move x y z, etc. So here now i think i have a spindle drive problem. I got the manual out , doing some trouble shooting... , voltage from the supply side looks good... so i found the reset button on the circuit board and reset it. Resent the NC, and The drive is up again. All axis' are locked once more, but now it its communicating and displays an Alarm 10 Under Voltage. Can't clear it, and i can't figure out where its coming from.... any ideas?

[Leelund]

What make and model and size is the spindle controller?

[Talisman]

The spindle drive is a Mitsubishi FR-SFJ-2-3.7k-t

[Leelund]

Sorry in the delay to post a response Talisman. Only thing I can find is the main supply voltage is below 170 VAC. If the alarm won't clear and the voltage is above 170 VAC then maybe the alarm circuit on the main board is bad. I don't know about the FRSFJ controller, but the older ones must have the power taken all the way off then back on to clear some alarms. That's the main machine breaker on/off. Check supply voltage, power off/on and hope it's gone when NC gets back up. If not see attachment.

[Talisman]

Thanks for the follow up leelund. I've already been that route with no success. I'm really scratching my head over this one. Supply voltage is 220, but the alarm persists. I guess i'll have to talk to mitsu about this one. Thanks for all your help.

Tom

[Leelund]

Probably redundant but check all your voltages and the three 10 amp? fuses to the power supply and cooling fans although I believe ALO10 only pertains to the input voltage. Never was any good at component level, only troubleshoot to board level so I can't do you much good there. Good luck,
Lee

[mikwest]

Attached page from the Maint Manual shows the power supply outputs & which check pins to measure on the front board.
If they check out OK then problem will be on the front board, if not then take off the power supply board & give the underside a visual check for anything blown.
I take it you’ve checked the 3 fuses already?
We’ve no FR-SFJ drives but do have the newer FR-SGJ type & we’ve had the fuses blow for no apparent reason on a couple of them. We just replaced the fuses & didn’t have any further problems.

Also try this link, http://www.meau.com/Files/MEIC-A699-001.PDF, it's for an AC Spindle Drive Troubleshooting Manual that covers a few different FR- drives including the SFJ.

Hope this is of some help.

Cheers
Mike

[jetblackaircraf]

Hey, can I get a copy of your tool changer program for your Dyna machine? I'm trying to fix mine. Thanks,

Mike

[Talisman]

Thanks for your help guys. I've pretty much accepted that I'll have to shell out some cash to Mitsubishi at some point... Now i'm just kind of waiting till i'm comfortable spending it given then economy. I've checked continuity across those fuses and it checks out fine, so I stopped looking there... maybe I need to check the actual voltage going across? This thing didn't have any problems like this before it got turned off, unhooked and moved to bring in another machine... I'm not real sure why it would go bad just sitting. I honestly think I'm "missing" something here. I've been over all the parameters, etc.... I just hate accepting "defeat" lol.(nuts) Mike, I have yet to check voltage across the pins, I'll do that this week.

Also, I'll email you the tool change program I have available.

[chippy1]

Hey, if this thing is buss connected, did you remove the spindle before this problem happened. If so, make sure you check to see if you bent any pins on the installation again. This would be the CAM 11 cable. Just a simple observation. I've seen it happen many times.

Regards,

Chippy

[Talisman]

This has been going since I first re-initialized the machine. I've checked all the cables, even swapped them all to see if the problem showed up somewhere else as a result of a bad cable... nothing there .

[hermanb]

Thanks for your help guys. I've pretty much accepted that I'll have to shell out some cash to Mitsubishi at some point... Now i'm just kind of waiting till i'm comfortable spending it given then economy. I've checked continuity across those fuses and it checks out fine, so I stopped looking there... maybe I need to check the actual voltage going across? This thing didn't have any problems like this before it got turned off, unhooked and moved to bring in another machine... I'm not real sure why it would go bad just sitting. I honestly think I'm "missing" something here. I've been over all the parameters, etc.... I just hate accepting "defeat" lol.(nuts) Mike, I have yet to check voltage across the pins, I'll do that this week.

Also, I'll email you the tool change program I have available.

would you be able to email me the tool change program?.. having problems

[mrphuocauto]

Any one has manual of FR-SFJ inveter (Not FR-SF). I have one nos of FR-SFJ-2-5.5k but don't have manual, so I could not make it run.
Thanks you very much.

[onthebumper]

have you searched on Mitsubishi Electric Automation Inc. - MEAU Home You can find many manuals. I found two for FR-SFJ on their website.

[Al_The_Man]

You can find many manuals. I found two for FR-SFJ on their website.

They may have to be forwarded as I believe it is only downloads from a N.A. source are allowed, the rest of the world is blocked.
Al.

[onthebumper]

It's a little known fact but I believe if you change the time zone on your pc to North America you can download from meau.com.

[AFI Systems]

Hi Talisman,

Wish I'd seen this post at the time, I may have been able to help - we repair these drives to component level. I would be interested to know if you managed to fix the problem, what was the cause? Or did you end up sending it out to Mitsubishi?

Undervoltage faults can sometimes be caused by an open resistor, a very inexpensive part if you can identify it. For voltage sensing on these drives they usually use a string of high ohmage resistors to drop the high voltage down to a low level to feed an operational amplifier or comparator IC, the output of which signals to the microprocessor that the voltage level is good or bad. If you can find this string of high value resistors, you can check them with a meter. Google 'resistor color code' if you're not familiar. If a resistor reads over the stated value, it is usually bad, but lift one end before removing it to be sure as capacitors can sometimes affect the reading.

Another possible cause of undervoltage is that the precharge circuit may be bad, so that the DC bus voltage never gets to its proper level, although the logic electronics can still power up OK. I've had bad low ohm high power resistors, and bad feedback auxiliary contacts on contactors cause this.

If you have any problems in future you can shoot me an email, and if I can't talk you through it then we can probably repair it for you cheaper than Mitsubishi - we offer free repair evaluations too. We repair all makes and types of spindle & servo drives & servomotors, PLC's circuit boards, operator interfaces, encoders and pretty much anything else electronic and some hydraulic servo valves too! We also have a warehouse full of old servomotors, drives and other electronics for sale too. We offer systems integration so depending on the machine, we can sometimes swap out the spindle drive for a different model, though Mazaks can be difficult.

And to cap it off, we just signed up as ABB Robotic systems integrators so if you have any repetitive tasks we may be able to save you on labor costs and liability by automating tasks. Robotics are being increasingly used for machining applications, so I'll be keeping an eye on this trend.

Best regards,

Andy Fleming

AFI Systems LLC
551 North Polk St.
Pineville, NC 28134
T: (704) 889-2404
F: (704) 889-0099
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