\r\n \r\n \r\n thinking to get a chinese CNC1000MDb really like the style and looks very nice, gcode is similar to mach3 and functions is about what I need. it\'s ATC capable, rigid tapping capable, support 4 axis (actually I\'ll be buying the 5 axis one so I can use a 4th rotary axis and the 5th for the ATC in umbrella)\r\n \r\n
\r\n in fact the very first thing I\'m making is the Y way cover that stands between the column and Y carriage because I really need to make sure it works otherwise I might have to change the design some more.... I only have 125mm space there to cover the whole 300mm travel... so that will be the very first parts I\'m making in this build XD \r\n \r\nstaring at a way cover ahahah sounds funny... someone ask you: hey man where did you started making the machine?? you: Y way covers LOL anyway it\'s a critical part because if it wont fit and you already have the base done will be a PAIN!!!\r\n
in fact the very first thing I\'m making is the Y way cover that stands between the column and Y carriage because I really need to make sure it works otherwise I might have to change the design some more.... I only have 125mm space there to cover the whole 300mm travel... so that will be the very first parts I\'m making in this build XD \n \nstaring at a way cover ahahah sounds funny... someone ask you: hey man where did you started making the machine?? you: Y way covers LOL anyway it\'s a critical part because if it wont fit and you already have the base done will be a PAIN!!!
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That is an odd place to start, but nothing wrong with satisfying your own requirements. Your right that really isn\'t much space. I would like stainless steel telescopic way covers as well for mine. I see you can purchase some from AliExpress and give them your dimensions if it makes it any easier. \n \nAlternatively, one of the things you can do is just use the heat resistant fabric way covers. They certainly do not look as nice, nor have the impact resistance as metal ones, but they surely serve the purpose. \n \nMake sure you take into consideration, electrical wiring, air hoses, and oil lines, as well as limit switches and encoders. You will definitely want to be sure that you can cram all of those in the epoxy castings you want to build. \n \nI\'m wondering if your spindle mount will be rigid enough in your design. I haven\'t seen too much VMC spindles bolted to the front of the Z axis head like yours. Most that I see has the spindle in the casting itself so that the axial forces are shared in the casting. It seems like hanging the spindle off the front of the casting can create a fulcrum causing deflection. Also that spindle mount I\'m assuming would be steel. With the heat of your spindle, the steel can probably suffer from thermal expansion also causing deflection and alignment issues. Maybe you can epoxy granite around the steel locking the spindle mount into one casting, with the ability to easily replace spindles by simply unscrewing the bolts on the bottom. \n \nPerhaps someone else can chime in for a better opinion.\r\n
That is an odd place to start, but nothing wrong with satisfying your own requirements. Your right that really isn\'t much space. I would like stainless steel telescopic way covers as well for mine. I see you can purchase some from AliExpress and give them your dimensions if it makes it any easier. \r\n \r\nAlternatively, one of the things you can do is just use the heat resistant fabric way covers. They certainly do not look as nice, nor have the impact resistance as metal ones, but they surely serve the purpose. \r\n \r\nMake sure you take into consideration, electrical wiring, air hoses, and oil lines, as well as limit switches and encoders. You will definitely want to be sure that you can cram all of those in the epoxy castings you want to build. \r\n \r\nI\'m wondering if your spindle mount will be rigid enough in your design. I haven\'t seen too much VMC spindles bolted to the front of the Z axis head like yours. Most that I see has the spindle in the casting itself so that the axial forces are shared in the casting. It seems like hanging the spindle off the front of the casting can create a fulcrum causing deflection. Also that spindle mount I\'m assuming would be steel. With the heat of your spindle, the steel can probably suffer from thermal expansion also causing deflection and alignment issues. Maybe you can epoxy granite around the steel locking the spindle mount into one casting, with the ability to easily replace spindles by simply unscrewing the bolts on the bottom. \r\n \r\nPerhaps someone else can chime in for a better opinion.
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about the ways I\'ve a friend that has a sheet processing factory so I think he will make these to me easily. \r\n \r\nyes I\'ve to make sure I design all the oilling system, electric wire, air system and so on... \r\n \r\nabout the head it\'s still under development, I\'m still deciding what hardware to get and I won\'t be sure until I actually get it, so the final design on the head won\'t be done until I\'ve the actual spindle. not really concerned about the head since it won\'t inferfere with anything else so I can actually redesign the whole head the only requirement is the distance from the column to the center of the spindle so the spindle can reach the whole table. \r\nbut yes casting the head it\'s an actually option.\r\n
\r\n \r\n \r\n about the contact info for the controller is Susie Xu, [email protected] tell her you been talking to Bruno from Portugal. Shenzhen Guanhong Automation CO.,LTD \nthey have multiple controllers and different panels. I\'m going for the CNC1000MDc-5 axis + E type panel + MPG handbox the c stands for absolute (b is the normal), they also sell servos and drivers at very nice prices.\r\n \r\n
I haven\'t made the order now but pricing is: \r\nNon absolute: \r\ncnc1000mdb 5 axis + E panel - 980usd \r\n1kw servo 80mm frame 4Nm - 131usd \r\n1kw servo driver - 145usd \r\nWith all the needed cables \r\nMotors have Japan tamagawa encoders \r\n \r\nAbsolute system \r\nCnc1000mdc 5 axis + E panel - 1070usd \r\n1kw servo 80mm frame 4Nm - 170usd \r\n1kw driver - 200usb \r\nAll cables included and motors with 17bit Japan tamagawa encoders \r\n \r\nThe mpg 5axis hand mpg is 85usd\r\n
I haven\'t made the order now but pricing is: \nNon absolute: \ncnc1000mdb 5 axis + E panel - 980usd \n1kw servo 80mm frame 4Nm - 131usd \n1kw servo driver - 145usd \nWith all the needed cables \nMotors have Japan tamagawa encoders \n \nAbsolute system \nCnc1000mdc 5 axis + E panel - 1070usd \n1kw servo 80mm frame 4Nm - 170usd \n1kw driver - 200usb \nAll cables included and motors with 17bit Japan tamagawa encoders \n \nThe mpg 5axis hand mpg is 85usd
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That\'s really not a bad price, around $2,000 US for full control system with all three servo axis motors.\r\n
That\'s really not a bad price, around $2,000 US for full control system with all three servo axis motors.
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yeah that\'s exactly it... it adds shipping costs of course but 2600usd total for the absolute controller + servos + drivers and all the wiring looks pretty good to me. I\'ll be ordering this stuff really soon so I can start playing with it I\'ll make a review once I have everything tested\r\n
They are not bad price, you can keep your cam software using mach3 compatible. I will consider to retrofit lathe, cheaper ...
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yeah I asked for the programming manual exactly for that to check the gcodes, and they are very similar to mach3, at most need to do some slight changes in the post processor but I don\'t think so....\r\n
\r\n Hi, \r\nhave you ever tried casting something in Epoxy? \r\n \r\nI have not tried Epoxy/Granite but I do have some experience casting Epoxy components for high voltage assemblies and encapsulating \r\nhigh voltage assemblies/circuits. \r\n \r\nIt was a steep learning curve. \r\n \r\nMold making and preparation and mold release are critical. \r\nAll epoxies exotherm to a certain extent, you must select the right epoxy or you will be throwing stuff out the door trying to squirt it with water! \r\nIf you think that\'s a joke go ahead and try. Without attention to exotherm you will sink. \r\nYou need to know about viscosity of your selected epoxy.....for instance you can warm the epoxies resin and hardener prior to mixing to get \r\na runnier mix and therefore easier to cast but only at the expense of potential exotherm. \r\nNext you will need to decide if you need vacuum degassing, its important in high voltage stuff, not sure about machine beds. \r\n \r\nNo doubt many of these items are covered in the appropriate siemens/forum. Take advantage of what others have learnt. Epoxy is a costly material \r\nin the volumes you are talking about. I would certainly consider making some smaller expoy/granite parts BEFORE I committed myself to a project \r\nof the scale you are talking about. \r\n \r\nCraig\r\n
Hi, \r\nhave you ever tried casting something in Epoxy? \r\n \r\nI have not tried Epoxy/Granite but I do have some experience casting Epoxy components for high voltage assemblies and encapsulating \r\nhigh voltage assemblies/circuits. \r\n \r\nIt was a steep learning curve. \r\n \r\nMold making and preparation and mold release are critical. \r\nAll epoxies exotherm to a certain extent, you must select the right epoxy or you will be throwing stuff out the door trying to squirt it with water! \r\nIf you think that\'s a joke go ahead and try. Without attention to exotherm you will sink. \r\nYou need to know about viscosity of your selected epoxy.....for instance you can warm the epoxies resin and hardener prior to mixing to get \r\na runnier mix and therefore easier to cast but only at the expense of potential exotherm. \r\nNext you will need to decide if you need vacuum degassing, its important in high voltage stuff, not sure about machine beds. \r\n \r\nNo doubt many of these items are covered in the appropriate siemens/forum. Take advantage of what others have learnt. Epoxy is a costly material \r\nin the volumes you are talking about. I would certainly consider making some smaller expoy/granite parts BEFORE I committed myself to a project \r\nof the scale you are talking about. \r\n \r\nCraig
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hi thanks for the advice, yes I did used this stuff before, I made epoxy granite before, didn\'t made extended casting tests but I will do. \r\nI made the base of my machine with about 200kg of this stuff and yes I do know what this stuff is... like I said I will do some testing with release stuff and molds. \r\n \r\nbest regards\r\n
\r\n well, I went forward with the controller and motion servos. went with the CNC1000Mdc-5 axis (however, I might end up using only 4 axis, since the 5th axis might not be necessary for the ATC, I\'m now more convinced that an AC motor will do the job just fine with the Geneva mechanism), 3*1kw 80mm servos, 2500RPM 4NM + driver absolute. should be here before the end of the month. \n \nnext I\'ll order the linear stuff, soon I\'ll go to my friend with the Y cover design to see if he can make the elements to my spec. \nalso will order some epoxy to start making tests with molds and release agents and agglomerates. as for agglomerates, I\'m thinking to use gravel and multiple sand grades, need to figure it out the ratios tho... I\'ll have to make a search on the web for these. \n \nbest regards\r\n
well, I went forward with the controller and motion servos. went with the CNC1000Mdc-5 axis (however, I might end up using only 4 axis, since the 5th axis might not be necessary for the ATC, I\'m now more convinced that an AC motor will do the job just fine with the Geneva mechanism), 3*1kw 80mm servos, 2500RPM 4NM + driver absolute. should be here before the end of the month. \n \nnext I\'ll order the linear stuff, soon I\'ll go to my friend with the Y cover design to see if he can make the elements to my spec. \nalso will order some epoxy to start making tests with molds and release agents and agglomerates. as for agglomerates, I\'m thinking to use gravel and multiple sand grades, need to figure it out the ratios tho... I\'ll have to make a search on the web for these. \n \nbest regards
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Excellent, your really pressing on here. Most people (like me so far) have intentions of building something but take long or never get there, you on the other hand have taken the first leap with purchasing the electronics. Please let us know how the electronics work out for you. I have to admit purchasing the electronics is yet again an odd place to start but I guess your trying to fit the motor mounts to the servos and ensure you have the control system checked out before you continue. \n \nLooking forward to the mechanical portion of your build as well, and the actual building of the machine. Make sure you post your epoxy test and release agents etc so others have a good idea of what to use for future builds. \n \nHave a look at this link, he does quite a few test. May be something useful to get you started: https://www.adambender.info/single-p...e-Frame-How-To\r\n
\r\n well I really want to get the machine done as soon as possible to me. \n \nYes electronics were more at the end of my shopping list but as Starks say, "winter is coming" and I want to have the electronics all tested prior to assembly, also need to tweak the post processor of my cam to have it posting the right code for the machine, this way I\'ll have plenty of time for that on those cold nights. servos weren\'t even part of the plan at the beggining but the price wasn\'t bad and as my initial plan was using the nema34 I have here, the work of making the mounts and making all the wiring, knowing me as I know either I would upgrade them in a few months or not ugrading it at all so I decided to save in shipping and order them right now and it\'s done, no need for changes in the future... also I want to have the motors here so I can actually see them and make sure they fit were they belong... I\'ll be making a review on the electronics since I think if it works nice it\'s a really nice option not at that high price... let\'s see. \n \nyeah I\'ll try to document the mechanical stage of the build the best I can! all testing and ingredients will be displayed. just took a look at the link you shared those were nice tests and a nice place to start with, he went out with the gravel but I really want gravel there, will increase overall strength IMO \nI made some testing on my own when I epoxy filled the base of my other machine BUT my hard drive died on me and I don\'t have the recipies anymore... I\'ll have to start all over again... I got it right within 3-4 tests... anyway, life goes on... \n \nthanks for the interest on this build! it gives me strength to go on \r\n
Have you checked with the factory about the compatibility with mach3, so you won\'t have problem to program your machine.
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I have asked for the programming manual so I could take a look at the controller codding it\'s very very close to the mach3. I\'m not saying that\'s a 100% the same cause I really haven\'t check all the stuff but the basic movement stuff is the same, spindle commands are the same the regular m commands are the same, coord systems are the same. so I might need to tweak just in the specific stuff like custom m codes or so but everything I look at was the same. as I\'m not used to work with auto coolants and that kind of stuff I want to have the controller here soon as possible so I can get familiar with.\r\n
\r\n Hi guys, sorry for the absence but I\'ve been out of town last week and no further advances. Anyway, I\'ve been tweaking the design and been thinking about the head... that\'s me, always thinking... thinking too much I guess... \r\nWell, I was almost sure I was keeping the head design as it is, it\'s basically a steel box, all welded and then EG filled. The idea was had the box made, filled then machine both sides flat so they became parallel then just make the holes and threads for the linear blocks and for mounting the spindle. this way I would have an high level of adjustment for tramming the head. if needed I would epoxy joint the spindle mount to the head as I\'m going to do with the column and base... \r\n \r\nBut after some thinking casting the whole head might be a valid option... I had the intention of buying the spindle+cast iron mounts+air cylinder all from the same manufacturer but the cast iron mounts are very heavy and will increase both the cost of the unit itself as the shipping (shipping cost doubles) so the idea of casting the head is growing on me... \r\n \r\nI know it\'s still early for this kind of concerns but how the hell am I gonna cast this thing fairly straight??? \r\n \r\nso what am I thinking to do? I have many ideas... \r\nfirst one: \r\nmachine the plate where the spindle screws in, in the top of that machine a recess where I would insert a tube with a nice fit for the spindle so I could cast the the head and than just mount the spindle in. Problem. what if I need to tram the spindle? I mean, this would be a great way of doing assuming all ended up absolutelly perfect whitch it won\'t lol... \r\n \r\nfrom that comes the second idea: \r\nso machine the spindle plate with the spindle threads and an oversized hole for the spindle (let\'s say +1 to 1.5mm diameter), machine a small recessin the back for a plastic oversized tube (PVC or something like that) so admiting the spindle is 90mm diameter, I\'ll need an aluminum tube with a close fit for it so let\'s say its 100mm OD and 90mm ID, so let\'s say the PVC pipe would be 110OD, ok I would cast the head with the 110mm tube there and after the EG had cured I would remove the PVC pipe and end up with a 110mm hole for the spindle, plenty of space for adjustment. the backplate would be already flat on the linear block side so just needed to drill and tap the holes for assembly. this would be the reference face, next either set the head in a precision angle plate and machine the plate where the spindle seat flat or, even better, do all tramming (some orings in the screws between the spindle and the head so will be a gap between the head and spindle flange) and epoxy joint the flange with the head, in the end, insert the tight fit tube from the upside and epoxy fill the gap between the tube and the head body... \r\nwhat you guys think? of course I can only decide and design exactly what I need when I have the actual spindle... I\'m looking for some HQ chinese spindles with nice bearings and also a Taiwan made spindle. the Taiwan made looks awesome is 100mm in diameter and uses 4*7009 bearings while the chinese I\'m seeing are 90mm in diameter and use either 4*7008 or 2*7008+2*7007 bearings... prices are not far from each.... so probably I\'ll go with the Taiwan... the one made in taiwan has grooves in the body for oil cooling tho don\'t really know if I\'ll need that but I wasn\'t counting on using that... \r\n \r\nI don\'t know if I\'ve been explicit enough with the process but I think it will work...let\'s see... I\'ll be waiting for some comments. anyway the head will be the last component being casted so I guess I\'ll have a long time to think about it lol\r\n
Hi guys, sorry for the absence but I\'ve been out of town last week and no further advances. Anyway, I\'ve been tweaking the design and been thinking about the head... that\'s me, always thinking... thinking too much I guess... \nWell, I was almost sure I was keeping the head design as it is, it\'s basically a steel box, all welded and then EG filled. The idea was had the box made, filled then machine both sides flat so they became parallel then just make the holes and threads for the linear blocks and for mounting the spindle. this way I would have an high level of adjustment for tramming the head. if needed I would epoxy joint the spindle mount to the head as I\'m going to do with the column and base... \n \nBut after some thinking casting the whole head might be a valid option... I had the intention of buying the spindle+cast iron mounts+air cylinder all from the same manufacturer but the cast iron mounts are very heavy and will increase both the cost of the unit itself as the shipping (shipping cost doubles) so the idea of casting the head is growing on me... \n \nI know it\'s still early for this kind of concerns but how the hell am I gonna cast this thing fairly straight??? \n \nso what am I thinking to do? I have many ideas... \nfirst one: \nmachine the plate where the spindle screws in, in the top of that machine a recess where I would insert a tube with a nice fit for the spindle so I could cast the the head and than just mount the spindle in. Problem. what if I need to tram the spindle? I mean, this would be a great way of doing assuming all ended up absolutelly perfect whitch it won\'t lol... \n \nfrom that comes the second idea: \nso machine the spindle plate with the spindle threads and an oversized hole for the spindle (let\'s say +1 to 1.5mm diameter), machine a small recessin the back for a plastic oversized tube (PVC or something like that) so admiting the spindle is 90mm diameter, I\'ll need an aluminum tube with a close fit for it so let\'s say its 100mm OD and 90mm ID, so let\'s say the PVC pipe would be 110OD, ok I would cast the head with the 110mm tube there and after the EG had cured I would remove the PVC pipe and end up with a 110mm hole for the spindle, plenty of space for adjustment. the backplate would be already flat on the linear block side so just needed to drill and tap the holes for assembly. this would be the reference face, next either set the head in a precision angle plate and machine the plate where the spindle seat flat or, even better, do all tramming (some orings in the screws between the spindle and the head so will be a gap between the head and spindle flange) and epoxy joint the flange with the head, in the end, insert the tight fit tube from the upside and epoxy fill the gap between the tube and the head body... \nwhat you guys think? of course I can only decide and design exactly what I need when I have the actual spindle... I\'m looking for some HQ chinese spindles with nice bearings and also a Taiwan made spindle. the Taiwan made looks awesome is 100mm in diameter and uses 4*7009 bearings while the chinese I\'m seeing are 90mm in diameter and use either 4*7008 or 2*7008+2*7007 bearings... prices are not far from each.... so probably I\'ll go with the Taiwan... the one made in taiwan has grooves in the body for oil cooling tho don\'t really know if I\'ll need that but I wasn\'t counting on using that... \n \nI don\'t know if I\'ve been explicit enough with the process but I think it will work...let\'s see... I\'ll be waiting for some comments. anyway the head will be the last component being casted so I guess I\'ll have a long time to think about it lol
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By casting the whole head your talking about epoxy granite or cast iron? \n \nIf I\'m picturing what you mean with the PVC tube correctly then yeah it can work, but a picture would speak 1000 words :wave:\r\n
That is Taiwan designed spindles but made in China so that not much different in the price ?
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it\'s from Kenturn actually they are made in Taiwan, at least they claim that all of their products are made in Taiwan. \r\nanyway I like the specs and even if it\'s China made and respect the specs it\'s fine by me...\r\n
I\'ll do some testing on the molds/casting first, I think if I cover the MDF with painters tape and then use demoldant spray in the tape I should be ok but I\'ll need to test first. \n \nabout the casting in the surface plate that\'s a no-go, 1st I don\'t own a surface plate, 2nd even I did I wouldn\'t risk casting epoxy on that thing! and I want to see my friend giant (to me) machines tackling my parts, I\'ll have the chance of playing in the Pro League XD \n \nabout the spindle, yes I should be ok with the servo 3.7kw 12kRPM, 17.6NM from 0-6000rpm, at 12Krpm I should get 3.5Nm from the curve they sent me, and that will be plenty for my needs... \n \nI abandoned the metal way covers for the time being, got in touch with a chinese company that makes way covers and those guys make the Accordion Bellows type covers for all axis to my spec for 350usd... that\'s 5 covers including one armored one (nylon fabric accordion with steel angle sheet protecting the fabric) for the Z axis... shipping included... they look pretty good and all people that buys it are very happy with those... I won\'t even bother the the metal ones lol... at least for now... \n \nso I\'m gathering the funds to buy all the linear stuff should make the order by the end of the month, meanwhile I\'m searching for some good epoxy... I got in touch with a couple of dealers let\'s see what solutions will they have to me... also need to study some aggregates, need to source many grades of rock and sand... next week I should have some news on this camp... need to find granite sand...
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Yes definitely do some sample molds to see which release method works best. Even the painters tape the spaces in between each roll width my leave some ridges, so it surely better be something to fully experiment with before the real thing. \n \nI\'m under the impression your going to need to purchase a surface plate as well as some other inspection and measuring tools anyway. What are your plans to measure the flatness and squareness of the objects when bolted together? You don\'t want to have to go through all the tedious work of evolving your own invention only to not have it as accurate as you would like. \n \nI believe I have seen a few pictures of people casting epoxy granite on top of a surface plate. That\'s the idea I have in my head to cast my epoxy parts square and accurately. Like I stated previously I intend to sandwich my design in sheet metal so I\'m not too concerned about running a surface plate as the epoxy granite wouldn\'t touch the plate. \n \nDoes your friend have a surface grinder big enough to grind those mating surfaces down, or do you intend to just mill them flat? \n \nI\'m definitely interested in your spindle and servo motor combination. That seems like it will certainly do the job for this size machine. \n \nKind of glad you abandoned the metal way covers. I just didn\'t want to see you putting tons of effort into something that is so miniscule to the entire build. Although the accordion bellows may not look as nice, I\'m certain the functionality will be just fine. \n \nPlease document your epoxy choice and aggregate testing. It be very useful to have much more information on a sufficient mixture for such a project. \n \nLooking forward to your next updates.\r\n
Hi, \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\nGo to a boat builder or maybe an automotive fiberglass manufacturer. From them you will be able to get tooling grade spray-ready polyester resins. You spray that onto the \r\nmolds which can then be sanded and polished to a glossy state. Wax with a carnuba release wax and just before casting spray the molds with P(oly)V(ynal)A(lcahol) release. \r\nYou will need about 3 degrees of draft, a little more than patterns for cast iron, for molds to release. \r\n \r\nIf you require a material that will release without treatment use polyethelene plastic. Even plastic shrink wrap releases well. \r\n \r\nKeep silicone waxes away from your project/work zone/ your life!!!! Silicone waxes bugger up molding/casting/laminating resins bigtime and once your work zone \r\nis polluted with them just about impossible to get rid of. \r\n \r\nCraig
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hi Craig, thanks for all the advice! surely appreciated! \r\n \r\n \r\n
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Yes definitely do some sample molds to see which release method works best. Even the painters tape the spaces in between each roll width my leave some ridges, so it surely better be something to fully experiment with before the real thing. \r\n \r\nI\'m under the impression your going to need to purchase a surface plate as well as some other inspection and measuring tools anyway. What are your plans to measure the flatness and squareness of the objects when bolted together? You don\'t want to have to go through all the tedious work of evolving your own invention only to not have it as accurate as you would like. \r\n \r\nI believe I have seen a few pictures of people casting epoxy granite on top of a surface plate. That\'s the idea I have in my head to cast my epoxy parts square and accurately. Like I stated previously I intend to sandwich my design in sheet metal so I\'m not too concerned about running a surface plate as the epoxy granite wouldn\'t touch the plate. \r\n \r\nDoes your friend have a surface grinder big enough to grind those mating surfaces down, or do you intend to just mill them flat? \r\n \r\nI\'m definitely interested in your spindle and servo motor combination. That seems like it will certainly do the job for this size machine. \r\n \r\nKind of glad you abandoned the metal way covers. I just didn\'t want to see you putting tons of effort into something that is so miniscule to the entire build. Although the accordion bellows may not look as nice, I\'m certain the functionality will be just fine. \r\n \r\nPlease document your epoxy choice and aggregate testing. It be very useful to have much more information on a sufficient mixture for such a project. \r\n \r\nLooking forward to your next updates.
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Yes all the mold/release agent/EG have to be thoroughly tested! \r\n \r\nabout the inspection equipment, yes I have a granite surface plate (not big enough for this build but big enough for my need), I have a granite high precision 750mm parallel (this thing cost me a kidney, I needed it on my other machine build) and I have a high precision granite square 250*400mm that will be my master square for this build. I\'ve lots of dial indicators both 0.001mm and 0.01mm so I\'m good with inspection stuff. \r\n \r\nI\'ll just mill them flat, my friend already milled the base of my other machine (just where the ways seated of course), a 1100mm*800mm base, he has a large surface plate also at the end of milling he inspected the flatness of the milled part and it was within 0.002mm... those are high-quality german mold making machines, not just big machines... \r\n \r\nyes about the spindle I think I\'ll be more than good... better be for the price of the stuff I\'m putting on it... 1250usd for the spindle and 1500usd for the motor/drive combo... \r\n \r\nyeah the metal way cover where bugging me a little, the chinese covers actually look very nice also and will do the job just fine... and the price is just about the cost of 1 or maybe 2 metal way covers... plus the effort of making the mount system and parts I would need to make myself to keep the price low... in the end, math made, the price of 1 metal cover would be more than enough for all the chinese ones... so I won\'t be thinking on that anymore there\'s just no choice to be made.... \r\n \r\nwell got go to work...\r\n
about the inspection equipment, yes I have a granite surface plate (not big enough for this build but big enough for my need), I have a granite high precision 750mm parallel (this thing cost me a kidney, I needed it on my other machine build) and I have a high precision granite square 250*400mm that will be my master square for this build. I\'ve lots of dial indicators both 0.001mm and 0.01mm so I\'m good with inspection stuff.
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Yeah with that set of inspection equipment you should be fine for your build. Didn\'t realize you have made another epoxy granite machine before. \n \n
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\r\n Originally Posted by vakeiros\r\n \r\n
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I\'ll just mill them flat, my friend already milled the base of my other machine (just where the ways seated of course), a 1100mm*800mm base, he has a large surface plate also at the end of milling he inspected the flatness of the milled part and it was within 0.002mm... those are high-quality german mold making machines, not just big machines...
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Okay yeah that\'s good accuracy, you shouldn\'t require anymore than that for mounting the linear rails. Make sure you put some lifting points in your base and column so its easy setting them on the other machines for cutting the surfaces. \n \n
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\r\n Originally Posted by vakeiros\r\n \r\n
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yes about the spindle I think I\'ll be more than good... better be for the price of the stuff I\'m putting on it... 1250usd for the spindle and 1500usd for the motor/drive combo...
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That isn\'t a bad price for a spindle or the motor drive unit. Please post some links if you do not mind so I have some resources as well. \n \nI have added a link to another builder who is building a VMC, this popped up on my youtube feed. He is 4 parts into his build now and has built the spindle, column, base, and table, seems like he just needs to put everything together now. I have included the links below to the 4 part series. Who knows may be some good parts in there for you to reference for your build: \n \nhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJR2uGO9qfA \nhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTdLRNgY5xk \nhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwPGDHPzZgQ \nhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFl-ZqN_0dI\r\n
\r\n hi guys, sorry I\'ve been very busy with work, and hadn\'t much time for updates, anyway nothing really happened yet, I\'ve been looking for suppliers for the needed materials and still deciding stuff... I\'ve been looking at spindles now I\'m thinking to go with BT40 instead of bt30... not sure yet, been looking at some spindles and BT40 is really sticking, I\'m thinking also in upgrading the spindle motor to 5.5KW instead of 3.7, speacially if I go with BT40... \nAlso found a silica mix suplier that suplies vaious grains of silica sand already mixed at proper ratios for resin casting! grains from 0 to 5mm for mixing at 8-9% epoxy! already asked for 2kg sample so I can make some testing. also, have some resins for testing lets see... \n \nFinally my measuring equipment got here, received my order from mitutoyo (1um inside indicator, 0.01mm outside indicator, 1um outside indicator) and received my master granite square 400*250*50mm grade 00 from ALPA! \nhere\'re some pics of the measuring stuff, also have many other chinese indicators, I must say I\'ve nothing bad to say frome these SHAHE indicators I have! now that I have some mitutoyos I can actually compare the chineses and see how they perform. \n \n \n \n \n \n \n \n \n \nthings are rolling, slowly but rolling. I\'m gathering the funds to acquire the linear motion stuff should pull the trigger on those in 1-2 weeks for those... after that I\'ll start the mold making... \nthe Silimix comes from germany (I\'m portuguese) so I\'ll have to by about 1ton of the stuff and I have to buy it all at once because of shipping cost so I need to get a clean and dry space to store the thing, and I want to order it the closer as possible to the time of casting. \n \nAlso my controller and servo motors should be delivered on monday! yay, that will be the next update! Also I\'ll be needing help of some servo guru here to setup the servo drivers as I know exactly nothing about this subject... anyway when they get here I\'ll share my adventure... getting excited tho... \n \nkind regards to all!\r\n
\r\n Hi guys, been a awhile since my last post, first of all Happy new year for all of you! \nI\'ve been out for the holidays and been very busy, so just a quick report. So, controller and servos came in. What do I have to say? well I\'m AMAZED with this thing! I\'ve been using mach3 since I got my first 3040 router and a new controller is always a new controller BUT man I love this thing, there\'s a couple of thiings that could be better (very minor thing that a person is used to in mach3 like inserting an expression in the DRO like if you write "/2" in an axis it will divide the current value by2 and in this controller that doesn0t work, only accecpt values, but as I said minor things). I\'ll be bringing a video showing the thing working, it\'s really nice. The manual is written in Mil Spec Chinglish as expected but it\'s quite understandable and guys from SZGH are VERY VERY helpfull! it supports macros it\'s very handy. supports ATC, have the routines already written for both unbrella and linear type ATC, just need to define some parameters, connect all the sensors and stuff and you\'re good to go, in umbrella type it supports both Servo type or AC motor type (like the genova index system or something simillar) and it requires all the safety measures (Z position sensor, power draw bar clamp and umclamp sensor, tool0 sensor, tool indexer sensor [for AC motor type so it knows when it moved one tool slot], unbrella in and out position sensor, it supports both way rotation (I assume that since it as T+ and T- signal so I assume it can go forward and backward with the motor, I havent tested any of these ATC stuff but there\'s info in the manual so)) I\'m really surprised with this thing! display quality is very good, well built, panel buttons are very nice, the absolute system is great, the controller responds very well, I bought it with an had MPG and it works flawless and next to no delay. really happy! \nbest of all they sent all the wiring done and labelled so I just received it, plugged in the connectors in the respective places, powered up and was good to go! had a few difficulties seting up the system right since they sent it to 10mm ballscrews and I\'m using 5mm and because of the absolute system, the chinglish manual wasn\'t clear but they helped me via Whattsapp and 10min later was all good. \nthere are 10 editable macros using Mcodes like M880-M889 where we can make them for special usage, a couple of them are in use already for ATC and dividing axis and some stuff but you can change them. anyway I\'ll make a video showing it working, I\'m still learning myself. \nServos and drivers also are very nice, I was expecting to be a bit faster as they are 2500RPM rated so I was expecting they being capable of at least 3500RPM max speed but soon as I pass 3000RPM driver spam me with speed error, might be configuration issues honestly I haven\'t lost time messing with it yet. \n \nabout progress, well finally I received the test sample of Silimix 261 also have some resins to test should be doing this in next weeak or so. Already ordered the linear stuff (Hiwin HGR30mm rails H precision with Heavy load cars, TBI 2005 precision ground C3 for XY and 2505 precision ground C3 for Z, SYK BF/BK bearing blocks and SYK nut brackets) also ordered the Auto Lub setup for the linear motion stuff. now I need to start gathering funds for the Silimix and resin, time to start actually seeing something as I already spend a quite big chunk of money and can\'t actually see anything XD but I really needed to be this way... so next in line is sand, resin and molds. \n \nAbout the design, I\'be changed some minor stuff, added limit switches (the controller is absolute and have soft limits but I guess limit switches never hurt anyone), not going to use home swtiches as it is an absolute system, just want to make sure that motors are at zero encoder position and than I\'ll tight the coupler screw with the table at my desired zero position. also started the enclosure, power box and controller box design. i\'m still sketching these since I need to think this thoroughly as I never used flood collant before... got a final design on the head, gonna be made i n 2 parts so I can align the spindle to the table, if I make it in just one part I wont be able to adjust it so I decided to make it 2 part. \n \nSpindle, well i went or more accuratelly will go crazy with the spindle unit. I found a very very nice BT40 spindle unit, they look very very nice, they are liquid colled and have 4 integrated coolant nozzles I really like it, 120mm body, 4 angular contact bearings and 12000RPM max speed, will go perfectly with the 5.5Kw servo spindle 12K RPM. \n \nhere some pics on the spindle: \n \n \n \n \n \nsome pics on the current design of the machine, still need to touch up the enclosure... \n \n \n \nanyway! happy new year to all!\r\n
\r\n \r\n \r\n Spindle, well i went or more accuratelly will go crazy with the spindle unit. I found a very very nice BT40 spindle unit, they look very very nice, they are liquid colled and have 4 integrated coolant nozzles I really like it, 120mm body, 4 angular contact bearings and 12000RPM max speed, will go perfectly with the 5.5Kw servo spindle 12K RPM. \r\n \r\nhere some pics on the spindle: \r\n \r\n \r\n \r\n\r\n \r\n
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Hey your Machine looking really Good! \r\n \r\nThe spindle looks very interesting. \r\nwhich manufacturer is this? \r\nDo you have a link to the manufacturer page? \r\n \r\nthank you! \r\n \r\nBest Regards and a happy new year to all! :cheers:\r\n
Hey your Machine looking really Good! \r\n \r\nThe spindle looks very interesting. \r\nwhich manufacturer is this? \r\nDo you have a link to the manufacturer page? \r\n \r\nthank you! \r\n \r\nBest Regards and a happy new year to all! :cheers:
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hi Jedi, thanks for liking it :P \r\n \r\nyeah the spindle looks very very nice, I found these guys at Alibaba, here\'s their web ???????????_????????????????, I\'ve been talking with them via email ([email protected]), Tracy has been very helpful, she sent me drawings with all the dimensions, they also sell the hydraulic cylinder for the draw bar... The spindle isn\'t cheap tho... 1470USD for the FKS1202 that\'s the one I\'m looking at.\r\n
\r\n Generally the problem with large servos is there is not enough room for it on the top of the head. I don\'t know yours though. What size the frame of the servo is? \n \nThe spindle looks nice but do you really need a speed like 12k? \n \nSent from my MI 5s Plus using Tapatalk\r\n
\r\n motor frame is 210mm, it\'s about the largest I can fit there. I was going with 3.7KW and BT30 spindle and this one was 180mm frame but as I\'m going with the BT40 I decided to go with the 5.5KW instead, price difference on the motor isn\'t that much so I prefer to have spare power than not enough power specially when I give up torque for speed, increasing the power I\'ll have a bit more torque in this 5.5kw 12000rpm motor than the 3.7kw motor with 8000rpm max (the 3.7kw 8kRPM has 24Nm rated torque, the 5.5Kw 12k RPM has 26Nm rated torque). about the 12k RPM, I machine lots of aluminum work with small mills so usually i\'m in the 8-12K rpm, sometimes even higher when engraving and using 1mm mills. I also do lots of 3d surfacing and the high RPM also allows me faster feeds and when making 0.1mm passes on 50cm length parts, time is an issue lol \n \n\r\n
\r\n sorry no link, it\'s from tthis company and same motor body: 5.5KW AC Spindle Servo Motor \nthe difference is max speed 12000RPM, torque 26NM, rated speed 2000RPM, max speed at rated torque 9000RPM (I\'m not sure on this last value, can\'t find the spec sheet they sent me but from memory I think it\'s 9000)\r\n
\r\n Not that big like yours but I\'m in a progress of installing my BT30 spindle to my BF20 mill. My target head speed was 5000RPM but most of the servos are 3k RPM rated. However Schneider makes nice and fast servos. I got a 1.1kw 6000 RPM max servo. Rated speed is 4000 so my final head speed is 4000 instead of 5000. \n \nI\'d like to see yours running soon. Good luck.\r\n
Not that big like yours but I\'m in a progress of installing my BT30 spindle to my BF20 mill. My target head speed was 5000RPM but most of the servos are 3k RPM rated. However Schneider makes nice and fast servos. I got a 1.1kw 6000 RPM max servo. Rated speed is 4000 so my final head speed is 4000 instead of 5000. \n \nI\'d like to see yours running soon. Good luck.
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yeah I\'ve seen your spindle built thread, really nice job! so I\'ll be watching your project too. hope to see it make chips fly soon! \n \nmy project will take time... I hope to have it done by summer... not sure I\'ll be able to do that but I hope so... \n \nbest regards\r\n
\r\n Hi, \r\nthat certainly looks to be the beast.... \r\n \r\nJust running some of your numbers: \r\n5.5kW 12000 rpm max ,rated torque 26Nm (2000rpm) max speed at rated torque 9000 rpm. \r\n \r\nThis last figure is way out. \r\n \r\nStart with the rated torque/rated speed calculation: \r\n \r\nw (angular velocity rad/sec)= rpm/60 (revs/second) x 2 x PI \r\n =2000/60 x 2 x 3.141 \r\n =209.4 radians/second \r\nshaft power (Watts) =torque (Nm) x w (rad/sec) \r\n =26 X 209.4 \r\n =5445 W or approx. 5.5kW \r\n \r\nSo far so good. If, as your figures seem to claim, that the motor can produce rated torque at 9000 rpm the calculation is: \r\nw=9000/60 x 2 x 3.141 \r\n =942 rad/sec \r\npower= 26 x 942 \r\n =24504 W or 25kW!!! \r\nThis last figure is way out to lunch. \r\n \r\nI suspect what the figures are telling you is that indeed rated torque is available to 2000 rpm but thereafter the torque drops as the speed increases. \r\nThat is called \'power limited\' in electrical engineering parlance. The important point is that at slow speed that full torque is available because \r\nthat is exactly the operating condition when rigid tapping. \r\nThe trick used is called \'field weakening\', it allows permanent magnet AC motors to have very good torque characteristics at low speed AND YET \r\nhave a sufficiently low back EMF to have a high top speed. \r\nField weakening can be used to extend the rpm range of AC servos as well but is not that common, field weakening is very widely used for spindle \r\nmotors like this however. \r\n \r\nCraig\r\n
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Originally Posted by asuratman\r\n 
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