[Bob La Londe]

What CAM are you using with ViaCad. I am currently using CamBam and its pretty good. Excellent for the price. However I am looking for something that does a few things better. Implements some HSM strategies, does REST machine, will calculate trachoidal tool paths, and can use files other than STL so I can take machining boundaries directly off the solid geometry... and of course doesn't cost a lot more. LOL.

Currently I do most of my quick and dirty 2D CAD in CamBam and use ViaCad 2d/3d v7 and v8 for my 3D stuff. Most projects employ a bit of both. That's not to say that the 2D tools in VC are bad. They work just fine, although there is one little thing I'll check a little more thoroughly before I ask about. Its just that I use CB so much that the 2D tools there are almost intuitive for me. Even the work arounds.

[datac]

For Cam, I jump between VCarve, Aspire and VectorCam 10 (which was supposed to be related to Bobcam). On rare occasion when some specific need arises, I have imported things into Signlab and used its code creation abilities. All depends on what a guy is doing.

I will say that for as many times as Autodesk has toyed with DXF standards, ViaCad does very well maintaining compatibility. I have not had any troubels over the years with importing or exporting DXF files into and out of other programs with ViaCads export filters.

[Bob La Londe]

For Cam, I jump between VCarve, Aspire and VectorCam 10 (which was supposed to be related to Bobcam). On rare occasion when some specific need arises, I have imported things into Signlab and used its code creation abilities. All depends on what a guy is doing.

I will say that for as many times as Autodesk has toyed with DXF standards, ViaCad does very well maintaining compatibility. I have not had any troubels over the years with importing or exporting DXF files into and out of other programs with ViaCads export filters.

So, which of those would be best for 3D Cam? Does it do HSM toolpaths and/or REST machining?

[datac]

So, which of those would be best for 3D Cam? Does it do HSM toolpaths and/or REST machining?

Well, for 3d Cam, I'm primarily stuck with Aspires typical methods ala .STL, though I also have an older version of Meshcam. I have only actually made but a few full 3d projects, but enough of them to understand what I have to do to get there.

HSM as in Trochoidal Milling ? It was possible in Vector by using something they had called MTB.... it was a macro tool that could give you an endless amount of variables including spirals in any plane.... then those entities could be used as toolpaths. Both Vector and Signlab have the ability to do "rest" machining as does V-Carve albeit with a few minor hoops to jump thru IIRC.

Obviously, Signlab is not something a person would buy for "machining" per say.... it does offer a lot of variables for pocketing tool paths because their intentions are to "Fill" open areas from space between TrueType font lines and other signage usuals.

My VectorCam is getting long in the tooth and it would be nice to find a "modern" answer. But frankly, most of the Cad/Cam programs I demo these days seem to be as antiquated in Cad as the last combo program I spent a lot of time with years ago, Surfcam. That's one reason why for myself, I decided I was never going to commit to the cost of your popular Cad/Cam programs when you find you never end up using the Cad side because it sucks compared to whats out there.

So, I haven't minded jumping thru a few other programs on the Cam side. The Cam side is pretty straight forward and little has changed except for things like HSM.... which I can live without as a hobbyist. I run a few machines at my day job as well, but even there, the expenditures necessary to obtain HSM via modern cad/cam program would not be recovered for years.

My only recent "problem" really is MS Windows and its inability to float my old programs any longer. So, in the next year or two, I suppose I will need to look deeper into my Cad/Cam future. Most of what I have demo'd lately makes me wonder what the heck their developers have been doing !

[mmoe]

For a software that takes solid models, provides HSM/Trochoidal style machining strategies and has rest machining, there really is nothing in the budget end of the spectrum better than Bobcad. I'll leave out comparisons to products that don't have those features, since that is the specific question, but there are good products that are similarly good values that lack those features. I know that Bobcad's reputation seems to always get in it's way, but the company really has made significant efforts to change their approach to customer service for the better and it really shows in all my dealings with them over the last couple of years (I've had Bobcad since V18). On top of that, the technology in Bobcad is really impressive to say the very least. Since V24, they have been implementing the Module Works technology core and as of V26 I'd say they are pretty well caught up with anything costing 3 times as much for comparable products to Mill Pro (not the list price, but the street price). Even if you have had past problems with the way Bobcad works with customers, I would recommending burying the hatchet and giving them another shot as their service has much improved. Any incidents that happen these days seem to be very quickly dealt with by the management, so significant progress is being made that way. If you're still leery at all, you can always contact Al DePaelo there here on the zone and you will be guaranteed to be treated with excellent service and respect.

I don't want to get too detailed in comparisons, since I could really write a multipage essay about how Bobcad's features compare to this or that, but to keep it relatively short, I'd recommend going to the Module Works link below and checking out which companies are using their technology as the basis for their CAM systems. You'll probably notice a common thread in that they are all very high end. If you examine the toolpath strategies available in the various product and at the various pricing, you'll also see there is a very common thread regarding these strategies. There may be different names from product to product, but close examination reveals that there are more similarities than not for those behind the scenes CAM processes (like the difference between a Ford and Mercury built on the same platform). This technology is no different in Bobcad than it is in MecSoft (Rhinocam, VisualMill, etc.), Mastercam, Gibbscam, and the rest. Vectorcam is another Module Works based product, which is probably why it might be thought similar to Bobcad. The difference between Bobcad and these other products are in the user interface, but Bobcad has put so much work into their interface over the last two releases that it's getting good enough that you could say it is more a matter or preference than quality now comparing Bobcad to those more expensive systems.

I used to own OneCNC, which I very much liked. OneCNC is perhaps one of the last mid-high end software that is doing their own CAM engine code. Just about everything else worth noting that has the solids/HSM/rest machinning features is built on the Module Works core. What always attracted me to OneCNC back then was how easy it was to use (and still is). At this point, Bobcad has hit a similar degree of simplicity and intuitive user experience. At least as much as you can while having the kind of powerful variables available for more sophisticated toolpaths. Software such as Meshcam, which I also own, are simple and easy to use, but that's as much a function of limited capability as it is good software design. More features/capability just necessitates a more complex interface so that the user has control over more aspects of the process of generating toolpaths. Bobcad V26 is a very good balance of intuitive interface and flexible features that I think is unmatched at it's price.

I believe that Bobcad V26 has HSM style machining (adaptive) available in their Mill Express package for 2d pocketing etc. and as you move up to Mill Pro you get it in 3d roughing as well as 2d pocketing. The brochure at least says that it has "High Speed Pocketing" at the Express level, which I'm pretty sure is the adaptive option that generates the trochoidal style pocketing. The thing is that 2d pocketing in Bobcad is not just for 2d geometry. You can select the pocket directly from the 3d geometry and then also select the cutting depth by selecting a part of the geometry on the 3d model itself, so no need to tell the software how deep to cut manually. In fact, all 2d toolpaths are now able to be run directly off the 3d model without extracting edges (unless you want to create boundaries for greater control and even then that's just one way to get the boundaries). Rest machining is available in Mill Pro for advanced roughing and equidistant offset 3d strategies, not so sure about Mill Express or Standard for 2d pocketing, but I can have a look. I don't have specific insight, but I do think they will continue to add rest machining to other toolpath strategies as well where they might make sense. Equidistant Offset is really the go-to toolpath for 3d surfaces anyways, so that's where it is most useful outside of roughing.

Also, Vectorcam has some cool features and is not really related to Bobcad beyond the Module Works core. I like their ISO strategy and plan to submit a feature request to Bobcad for a similar strategy (equidistant works similarly, but with a tweak could add even more versatility), but one of my big gripes is that Vectorcam just doesn't handle geometry very well in terms of formats in my experience. I've never been able to open a SAT file in it, no matter what program I used to output that SAT file (this is Viacad's native ACIS format). IGES seems to be one of the better formats for it, but it still opens them looking a little funny. Those artifacts in the IGES don't seem to translate to the toolpath, so they may just be visual, but they do make me nervous. Vectorcam is also more by close to $1000 if I have my pricing right (actual prices paid as opposed to retail pricing) and is the closest Module Works product to Bobcad in terms of pricing. They all go up from there. This is really where Bobcad is an excellent value. You're getting technology that is the same as the majority of the best products are based on, but at a fraction of the cost. If you're curious about certain functions, let me know and I can give examples. If you are looking at Bobcad, I would recommend Mill Pro for a 3 axis machine and I also recommend getting the Pro Simulation module as well (it doesn't add that much if you negotiate a bit).

Partners who work with ModuleWorks CAD/CAM components