[RA-Bowtie]

G'day Guys,

I've only used a couple of end mills to get started, but it occurs to me that laying out a plan
for the tool table might not be a bad idea.

What I mean is .... you wouldn't want Tool-1 to a 3/8" end mill and Tool-2 to be a 1/4" drill bit.

That could get mighty confusing.

I've already figured out that you can't move an entry, which would actually make life really easy, so;

Do you (as an example) allocate numbers 1-15 for end mills, numbers 20-35 for drill bits, etc?

Michael

[R.DesJardin]

The really OCD people put tools in groups, but then you have to remember what group is for what. I just started with a tool and added to it as I needed more. Close to 60 tools I use regularly, and pretty much I know what each one is just from repeated use. Also in my CAM you have a list to look at and its pretty easy to find the tool you need.

[LeeWay]

I just started with about 8 tools and added them as I needed them. My second to IS 1/4" drill bit. My first tool is my zero or master tool. I have 24 tools now. I know in Mach 3 when it needs a tool, it calls out the number. In the Gcode from Sheetcam and other cams you have the definitions on screen as well. I imagine Path Pilot would be the same. It gets a little easier once you start using them. One thing that happened because of this is that most of the drills have the taps for that size right beside them. Happy accident.

[CadRhino]

It always starts out clean and neat but like Rory says, it has to also be set up in the cam that way. In the heat of production all good organizstion go awry ant I have tool numbers all over the place.
The real thing that helps me is numbering my tool holders with a paint marker and having the organized on a stand near the machine.

G'day Guys,

I've only used a couple of end mills to get started, but it occurs to me that laying out a plan
for the tool table might not be a bad idea.

What I mean is .... you wouldn't want Tool-1 to a 3/8" end mill and Tool-2 to be a 1/4" drill bit.

That could get mighty confusing.

I've already figured out that you can't move an entry, which would actually make life really easy, so;

Do you (as an example) allocate numbers 1-15 for end mills, numbers 20-35 for drill bits, etc?

Michael

[shred]

I'm about as un-OCD as you can get, but find it very useful to set numbers for commonly-used tools (1/4" end mills, 3/8" end mills, etc) and put number-drills in tools #101-180. So Tool #101 is a #1 drill, tool #124 is a #24 drill and so on. Makes it easy at CAM time if you don't obsessively sync tool tables between controller and CAM.

[Uman]

As a beginner, I have become quite aware of how critical the library is. I maintain four independent libraries; Sprut, PathPilot, paper hard copy and physical rack; the hard copy is the master. Apparently, the electronic versions lack organization capabilities and print out features or I have missed something? Libraries gotta be synchronized and updated across each media when a new tool is introduced or altered. This is a very weak logistical system for such a critical function.
I gave up with grouping like item tools in the library and just add/alter next in line.
Is my approach to the library uncommon?

Uman in Florida

[WOTDesigns]

I to went OCD on organizing tool numbers. With an excel spread sheet I set up end mill sizes in groups of ten and kept all tools on their holders which had me ending up with 75 or more tool holders. I used an orange paint pen to label each tool holder and set them up in cam to match. It does work and eventually i memorized most of them which is impressive since I have a terrible memory.

I now have cat 40 tooling and a 20 station tool changer and since I couldn't afford a ton of holders I started buying only er holders and change tools constantly. What I do now is actually easier (for me).

Tools 1-10 are blank and 11-20 are fixed. For example 12 is 1/4 short, 13 1/4 long, 14 is 3/8, 15 is .5, 16 is .5 long, 17 is 1" indexible, 18 is Tormach 1.5" face mill (I still use daily on my Haas), 19 is a 3" Glacern face mill, and 20 is my probe.

I use HSM to program and if I select tool 12 it will call tool 12 which happens to already always be on the machine. If I call a 1/4" drill it Is set as tool 0 so hsm automatically assigns it tool #1 if it's the first tool.

This makes life easier with a changer because I print out toil numbers and just add tools 1-10. In 5 years I've never once needed more than 13 tools for any job I've ever done. Once you're used to it you can change tools in an er holder in less than one minute. It takes a lot of uses of the same tool to make up the cost savings of buying it's own tool holder.

If you don't have a tool changer you can do similar by just writing down your common tools and assigning them easy numbers like:

20: .125 short
21: .125 long
22: .188 short
23: .188 long
24: .25 short
25: .25 long
and leave 1-10 or 1-20 for random stuff you are going to load for an individual job.

A lot also depends on your touch off procedure. It you can touch off 3 tools in 2 minutes then it's not a big deal touching off 3 or 5 tools per job. Also if you use a LOT of different tools like machining small and large features in AL, plastics, steel and stainless then you would be spending a LOT of money on holders if you kept them all in


My neighbor behind me has 7 CNCs in his shop and uses almost exclusively set screw holders. He has about $6K worth of holders alone... I have about $1K and don't need any more... today... yet.... wellwe'll see. Tooling and support equipment is the greatest addiction I've ever seen and had. Love every minute

[Steve Seebold]

I have NEVER used the tool table. I don't like the idea of using tool 26 as the second tool in a program. I always use the offset page and number my tools in order. I find it to be much easier that way. Tool 1 is offset 1, tool 2 is offset 2 and so on.

[Uman]

Hey I am new to this, so take it as idiosyncratic and unpredictable.

I use a system that utilizes two physical tool racks; a library rack and a staging rack.
The library rack is big and affixed to the work bench and stores the tools long term.
The library rack has designated numbers that correspond to the tool numbers.

The staging rack is small and affixed to the mill tray inside right and same side as the monitor.
The staging rack has no designators, but has two columns of tool holes front to back, 10 holes each column.
The inside column is for "waiting to use tools"; the outside column is for "tools after use".

After the G-code is loaded, the program header lists the tools by library tool numbers.
Library tools are then relocated from the library rack and positioned according to use sequence in the staging rack (front first to use, back last to use).
The program tool call-out is now in sync with the staging rack tool - front to back.
The only tool that permanently resides in the staging rack is the Haimer Zero Master; all others are short term, program duration.

I realized early how critical a well maintain library is and the consequences of a tool error. I wish PathPilot would call out the tool table description with the tool number. Just image in your pharmacy issues meds with a med# and no description or name.
I think I will send Tormach PathPilot a memo to request this; they seem to be quite responsive to customer suggestions. I already have one approved for next major release.

Uman in florida

[tmarks11]

I think I will send Tormach PathPilot a memo to request this; they seem to be quite responsive to customer suggestions. I already have one approved for next major release.

Good idea. I seem to recall this being tossed around before and Tormach saying "We will look into it". The more customers asking for this feature, the better.

[R.DesJardin]

Good points, I do have my holders numbered. They work in either machine one is Mach and one is PP and I typed in the tool description in the PP offset tool list, is this not what you meant.

[Uman]

Good points, I do have my holders numbered. They work in either machine one is Mach and one is PP and I typed in the tool description in the PP offset tool list, is this not what you meant.

In PP, when a program is executed, PP displays a statement something like "insert T4 in spindle".
PP should also display the tool description from the tool table at this point.

[MikeC8]

I recently setup a tool table using Google Docs. This allows me to make updates from my phone, tablet, or PC which has been useful. I use a height gauge to measure my tools out in the garage, and update the tool length offset, tool stickout, and flute length using my phone or tablet. From there, I'll update the tool library at the CNC controller, again using my phone or tablet. And when I am doing my tool pathing in the house, I enter my values into my cam softwares tool library, so that when I run my simulation it has the correct values.

I made block 1-9 my edge finder, height gauge, superfly, and drill chucks. Block 10-19 are 1/8 endmills, 20-29 are 3/16, list goes on for 1/4, 3/8, and 1/2. After that I have a block of 10 for specialty cutters, such as a woodruff cutter. Another block for metric tooling, block for common drill bit sizes that I personally use.

Knowing what each block is setup for does help red flag a program if you pay attention. And you do not have to have every tool thats in your tool table actually in a tool holder, or even have that particular bit. You can still move your tools from holder to holder depending on the job.

[mountaindew]

In PP, when a program is executed, PP displays a statement something like "insert T4 in spindle".
PP should also display the tool description from the tool table at this point.

It does in the g-code window or sprutcam puts these notes in g-code so user can see tool #9 1/2" e.m. c2 carbide or whatever you named it in cam.

I have asked this question a number of times in the past and never read to many replies or comments so I settled into a strategy like below "for now anyway"! . "Tool #1 reserved for hamier probe and all my programs call for it"
I have a master tool crib in sprutcam with about 400 tools defined with number sets like 100-200 drill bits 201-250 End mills 251 300 ball end mills 301-350 taps .... reamers... and so on. I use it when I need a new tool added to the day to day tool file. I will then change number to a subset of numbers that fit inside the 256 tool offsets pp allows to be defined. 10-20 drill bits, 20-25 end mills and so on. Trying to keep the subset with same abbreviated number. This is a new system for pp and I just started using it a few weeks ago. Time will tell if its useful.

I am still trying to understand the strategy used if you have a automatic tool changer and I have asked this question number of times also. What do you use for tool numbers with a atc? And is this the reason for a tool setter?
Example: load tools in atc. Then with a program all the tool offsets are entered into tool offset table with atc number. Then run cam program that never uses a tool number higher then the atc has, is this correct?
I think wotdesigns explained it , still trying to understand his strategy.

[MikeC8]

I am not sure how the Tormach ATC works, on a VMC ATC has pockets, the Tool number has nothing to do with the pocket number. However on more basic tool changers, such as a CNC router I have seen the pocket number, be the tool number.

[R.DesJardin]

The Tormach ATC just looks for the tool numbers in the tray. It knows where the tools are since you tell it that when you load the ATC tool tray. No need for any order it will find the right tool. Your CAM tool numbers must match your machine tool numbers since it/the machine stores the tool length offsets. Unless you want to touch off tools everytime you run the machine, no thank you.

[ChrisAttebery]

I use #1 for my edge finder.
First two digits in diameter for end mills, 25 for .250", 37 for .375". etc.
Drills have a 1 in front. 125 is .250 drill, 137 is a .375 drill.
100 is a 90 degree spot.
I don't use anything over .75" so 99 is a chamfer tool, 91 is a 125 round over, 92 is a .25 round over, etc.

I think keeping the end mills and drills consistent is key, after that squeeze in the odd and ends.

[R.DesJardin]

In PP, when a program is executed, PP displays a statement something like "insert T4 in spindle".
PP should also display the tool description from the tool table at this point.

If you look at the GCode display it shows the tool description in the code. Showing it the message would seem to be redundant.

[Uman]

If you look at the GCode display it shows the tool description in the code. Showing it the message would seem to be redundant.

Yes, GCode does display the tool number and description, but this may not agree with PP library and PP is now in charge and you will not know.
If PP displays the tool description, a realtime comparison between PP & CAM would confirm library is in sync just prior to the "here we go" moment. Since PP & CAM libraries are independent and manually maintained, libraries will always be prone for error. Just because the GCode states tool #4 is a 1/2" rougher endmill, it does not necessary mean PP has tool #4 as same tool. PathPilot has this information so lets see it. Also I believe once a program is active, PP will not permit internal library observations.
How about "have a nice day" at the end of a program too.

[R.DesJardin]

Ok, you see the tool desc. in the G-code then you grab a tool to insert into the spindle that as many of us do has a number on it. You look at the tool, its the right one. I just don't get why you think you need PP to tell you what the tool is too. Maybe some more time on the mill and you will feel the confidence many of us have. Now a days I just load the ATC and press go and walk away. But yes at first I was cautious too. Its been almost 7 years now, I mow the lawn while the machine runs, or go in the house and eat lunch.