[pld0vr]

I've searched everywhere for this... I just bought an '05 TM1 w/ atc and I found the settings to up the spindle speed to 6000rpm, but I have been unable to locate the proper settings to increase the rapids.

I have been told that you can set the rapids up from 200ipm to 600ipm.

Anyone know what to change? It does seem like a big increase... thoughts on this?

Here are the spindle settings for those wondering:

131-MAX SPINDLE RPM
183-Sp MAX FREQ

(PAR 183= MAX SPINDLE SPEED / 3 * 10)

So for 6000 RPM:
131 = 6000
183 = 20000

[pld0vr]

Found it finally...

Find the Parameters for X (Y, Z) ACCELERATION AND X (Y, Z) MAX SPEED and double them.

[CNCRim]

Correct me if I'm wrong, one time the Haas service guy said need more bigger air compressor to keep up with the faster moving accleration.

[Geof]

Correct me if I'm wrong, one time the Haas service guy said need more bigger air compressor to keep up with the faster moving accleration.

????

Was he selling compressors as a side line?

If anything a faster Z would save air because the machine would not spend as much time on a tool change with the purge air blowing.

I think you can file that piece of information under D for didn't know what he was talking about.

[Haas_Apps]

Geof,
I agree on the D file.

pdl0vr,
I would really recommend not changing these values. The factory sets them at where they are at for a reason.

[pld0vr]

Geof,
I agree on the D file.

pdl0vr,
I would really recommend not changing these values. The factory sets them at where they are at for a reason.

I think a lot of the times the "reason" is more for marketing. Do you have any specific technical details on why you would not recommend this? I don't trust the factory.

ie: Don't buy the TM1, get the minimill which has the same spindle, but is set to run at 6000rpm.

I mean how far do you trust a company that puts 16mb of memory onboard but only lets you use 1mb unless you "upgrade" via unlock code.

[HelicopterJohn]

Speeds and Rapids:

I could be mistaken but I believe it has something to do with the machine having an encloser or not. I have a 2007 TM-1P which is the enclosed machine. It has the higher spindle speed and faster rapids. I think???? it has the same spindle as the TM-1 models.

I also believe that HAAS as an OEM manufacturer has the obligation to OSHA or whatever other Federal guidlines to limit the speeds and feeds on non enclosed machines. It is not a question on whether or not they would be capable but for safety reasons i.e flying parts material etc. Just my guess.

As for the memory I too have the 1 meg of on board memory in my machine. I was able to purchase the machine for a lessor price by accepting the fact that the machine only had that amount of memory supplied with the machine. HAAS could have jacked up the price on all of their machines the additional $1000.00 or whatever and some of us would have to pay for memory that we don't need. It just has to do with the way HAAS markets their products. If you don't need it you don't have to pay for it. Whether they as a manufacturer choose to add additional memory by either turning on a code or replacing chips is their choice as a manufacturer.

HAAS made no secret as to the amount of memory that was suppied with my machine or the additional cost of more memory should I option to purchase it. I myself like the "purchase what you need" marketing method.

I am sure everyone has their ideas on this subject and I respect your personal opinions. Just thought I would give you another perspective.

John

[pld0vr]

Speeds and Rapids:

I could be mistaken but I believe it has something to do with the machine having an encloser or not. I have a 2007 TM-1P which is the enclosed machine. It has the higher spindle speed and faster rapids. I think???? it has the same spindle as the TM-1 models.

I also believe that HAAS as an OEM manufacturer has the obligation to OSHA or whatever other Federal guidlines to limit the speeds and feeds on non enclosed machines. It is not a question on whether or not they would be capable but for safety reasons i.e flying parts material etc. Just my guess.

As for the memory I too have the 1 meg of on board memory in my machine. I was able to purchase the machine for a lessor price by accepting the fact that the machine only had that amount of memory supplied with the machine. HAAS could have jacked up the price on all of their machines the additional $1000.00 or whatever and some of us would have to pay for memory that we don't need. It just has to do with the way HAAS markets their products. If you don't need it you don't have to pay for it. Whether they as a manufacturer choose to add additional memory by either turning on a code or replacing chips is their choice as a manufacturer.

HAAS made no secret as to the amount of memory that was suppied with my machine or the additional cost of more memory should I option to purchase it. I myself like the "purchase what you need" marketing method.

I am sure everyone has their ideas on this subject and I respect your personal opinions. Just thought I would give you another perspective.

John

I agree with you on those points of why the speeds would be different. For me... I don't care about the safety risk.

The issue I have is apparently the machine has 16mb of memory onboard even if you bought the 1mb version. Thus, you have already paid for the physical cost of having the memory on your machine... however, if you actually want to use that memory in the machine, you need to pay.

Pay for what you want would make sense if it only came with 1mb onboard and then you installed extra physically.. but when the machine comes with more but they intentionally limit the capability of the equipment, that my friend is a scam.

I like the machine, but the add-on unlock features are retarded.

FYI 1gb of ram is about $15.00

[Geof]

..... but when the machine comes with more but they intentionally limit the capability of the equipment, that my friend is a scam.

I like the machine, but the add-on unlock features are retarded.

No it is not a scam. You know what you are getting before you get it; Haas is upfront with their pricing, nothing is hidden.

Very likely if they had to physically omit something on some machines but include it on others the overall machine manufacturing cost would escalate because of the extra record keeping and tracking.

[Haas_Apps]

Yes, I do have details as to why I would not recommend this. If you would like to discuss them please feel free to call me.

Wayne Reilly
Applications Manager
Haas Automation Inc.
805-278-8560 (direct line)

I think a lot of the times the "reason" is more for marketing. Do you have any specific technical details on why you would not recommend this? I don't trust the factory.

ie: Don't buy the TM1, get the minimill which has the same spindle, but is set to run at 6000rpm.

I mean how far do you trust a company that puts 16mb of memory onboard but only lets you use 1mb unless you "upgrade" via unlock code.

[pld0vr]

Yes, I do have details as to why I would not recommend this. If you would like to discuss them please feel free to call me.

Wayne Reilly
Applications Manager
Haas Automation Inc.
805-278-8560 (direct line)

Why not post them here for everyone to see?

[mactec54]

pld0vr

You don't have the same spindle on your TM as a mini, one is grease packed the other is oil mist

[Geof]

pld0vr

You don't have the same spindle on your TM as a mini, one is grease packed the other is oil mist

This is true but the 'P' versions of the toolroom mills are set at 6000rpm on the spindle and 400 ipm rapids.

[pld0vr]

This is exactly why I feel that if the rapids and spindle speeds are likely de-tuned... so to get the best bang for my buck, I want to change them.

[123tool]

This is exactly why I feel that if the rapids and spindle speeds are likely de-tuned... so to get the best bang for my buck, I want to change them.

It's your machine so do whatever you want to it... run the heck out of it and make some money.

[mactec54]

pld0vr

That's like buying a hybrid car... but they disable the batteries without extra payment.

No not correct, your mill will run just fine with the 1mg of ram, but your hybrid car would not

[307startup]

To be more correct, it's like buying a house and being told you can't use the linen closets or pantry. You physically own the property...would you allow the seller of your new house to have authority over and have a say in what you may use or do with what you have legally paid for? It's more than just a principal...

pld0vr

That's like buying a hybrid car... but they disable the batteries without extra payment.

No not correct, your mill will run just fine with the 1mg of ram, but your hybrid car would not

[JohnJW]

To be more correct, it's like buying a house and being told you can't use the linen closets or pantry. You physically own the property...would you allow the seller of your new house to have authority over and have a say in what you may use or do with what you have legally paid for? It's more than just a principal...

If you don't care for warranty, feel free to hack into the controller and write your own codes. Or, break out the soldering iron and start upgrading the memory chip. Or, rip out the controller and use your own controller. Once you pay for the machine it's yours. You can paint the machine pink and turn it into a piece of abstract art if you like.

[Masher Mfg]

To be more correct, it's like buying a house and being told you can't use the linen closets or pantry. You physically own the property...would you allow the seller of your new house to have authority over and have a say in what you may use or do with what you have legally paid for? It's more than just a principal...

This isn't the same, if you bought a house and didn't pay extra for cable TV but the wire is there, would you complain you are not getting free TV?

How about if you have a Dish TV type system with paid basic programming, would you complain that the premium channels are not viewable unless you paid extra? After all you are paying for the dish, the signals are being received by your equipment, but you are being cheated out of extra programming by not being able to view them.

Another question, would you feel better if the physical memory and other premium software was not installed on your machine so you don't feel cheated? Answer truthfully. Now, would you be willing to pay extra to have a service tech come to your location to install the premium software that you have purchased? Oh, wait, if the software was preloaded all you would have to do is purchase " THE RIGHTS TO USE THE SOFTWARE " , type in the code and off you go. Remember, a software purchase consists of buying the right to use the SW and not the software itself, this is standard procedure in that part of the world.

Ever download a software package that has a free / low cost entry level then for a fee you can upgrade? Sometimes turning on the extra features consists of purchasing the access code. How do you feel about that?

I'm sure your response will go something like " What, do you work for Haas?" No I don't work for Haas or any other CNC company, I do however understand how such marketing systems work.

Yes, I know it is frustrating to have something "in there" but not being able to use it freely. But being you didn't pay for it, it really isn't in there.

[rawen2]

My take on it is that there is a difference between charging for software and hardware. The hardware (memory chips) is already installed in the machine so in effect it's already been paid for. It's just been deliberately disabled. The cost to enable it is pretty steep considering what it actually costs to include it in every machine. I am guessing that it actually cost Haas more to create the programming that ignores the extra RAM until unlocked since most computers recognize extra memory on boot up and automatically use it.

Features such as rotation and scaling, quick code, etc. are software and although they're already installed in the machine they didn't have much, if any, extra hardware cost to install. But software takes a lot of time to write, test and debug. I completely understand paying extra for those features.

Haas can do whatever they want and we are free to buy or not. But in my opinion it's not very customer friendly to install extra hardware and purposely disable it. Especially so in the case of RAM since it's dirt cheap these days.


Quote - "You're asking a factory representative to publicly post details on how to defeat designed-in safety features." - Unquote
No he wasn't, he was asking him to publicly post the reasons for not increasing the spindle and rapid speeds. He already figured out how to do it.

Ralph