[plain ol Bill]

Hmmmm - Hope I am not a day late and a dollar short again. Just read this thread and I had called and placed an order w/ Koal for plasma quench this morning. Mumble, mumble. I will keep you posted on how my experience w/ them goes.

[aicomp]

I talked to KOAL again today and after telling them of my plan to go to the Attorney General's Office , they said they would Fedex my order right away. I told them I wanted a tracking number by tomorrow morning. We'll see what happens.
Mike

[DISCONNECTED]

Yeah,I ordered from KOAL about 2 months ago,never was charged for my plasma quench and never recieved any either.You would think they would want to make money and sell their product.Oh well, running washing soda now in my water table like many others.

[Jcar]

aicomp,

You may want to check your sources. According to the MSDS sheets, Plasma Quench is made with sodium nitrate, not sodium nitrite. Can one be substituted for the other? I don't know. This is a question for someone with more chemistry knowledge than myself.

[aicomp]

aicomp,

You may want to check your sources. According to the MSDS sheets, Plasma Quench is made with sodium nitrate, not sodium nitrite. Can one be substituted for the other? I don't know. This is a question for someone with more chemistry knowledge than myself.

Hi Jcar,
You are correct. I just read and found that it is in fact sodium nitrate. I will look that up on the web and see where to get it.
Thanks,
Mike Pennington
Pennington Sales and Service
www.penningtonfab.com

[Jcar]

aicomp,

Out of curiousity, I took a look at my empty Plasma Quench container this afternoon. According to the Hazmat info on the container, it contains "nitrite" salts. Who knows what's going on??? Sodium Nitrate has one more oxygen molecule than Sodium Nitrite. Perhaps it's just a little more potent, and either can be used. Just in different quantities. I'll do a little more digging and see what I can find out.

[aicomp]

aicomp,

Out of curiousity, I took a look at my empty Plasma Quench container this afternoon. According to the Hazmat info on the container, it contains "nitrite" salts. Who knows what's going on??? Sodium Nitrate has one more oxygen molecule than Sodium Nitrite. Perhaps it's just a little more potent, and either can be used. Just in different quantities. I'll do a little more digging and see what I can find out.

Hi,
Maybe we should all do some investigation on the web. I have no chemistry background, and am only interested in stopping rust and gunk from forming in my new watertable. I now have only an inch or so of water in it and am waiting to get some good goop before putting the other 5 inches of water in. I figure my table will hold 201 gallons when full. Actually, I am haveing great reduction in smoke and dust with the level 4 inches below the top.
Mike Pennington
penningtonfab.com

[plain ol Bill]

I have been having problems getting product guys so I tracked down a gentleman listed as managing director of Koal and sent him an email. I put in the address of this thread so he could see the problems experienced in trying to get Plasma Quench. Hopefully he will drop in here, take a look AND SOLVE THE PROBLEMS. I remember the saying about the squeakY wheel and the grease.

SQUEAK - SQUEAK - SQUEAK - SQUEAK!

[BIGRAGU]

Hello All,
I have been using a product in my table from Zep called Anti Rust. According to the Zep rep that comes around it is the same stuff as Plasma Quench. I used Plasma Quench for years until I was also no longer to get it. I have been using the Zep now for 6 months and it works just as well as the Plasma Quench. Zep products are available just about anywhere. Just my 2 cents.

[WereWoof]

Hello all!

I was going to order plasma quench but after reading the various comments, that is clearly out of the question, so I began doing a bit of research on my own and combined that with modest chemistry experience and decided on a home brew approach.

Both sodium nitrite and sodium nitrate are used as anti corrosion passivators on ferrous and aluminum materials, often together.

Generally when sodium nitrite is used, it is used in conjunction with sodium borate as a PH modifier. Also Sodium Borate is itself a corrosion inhibitor. Sodium Nitrite is available as previously stated on ebay... or your local chemical house in larger quantities. We get it from Rocky Mtn Reagents. The price there is 75 dollars for a 50 pound bag. To order from them you will need a business license though.

The Sodium Borate is a bit easier. Its sold as 20 mule team borax at your local supermarket, most likely. You will probably want to run about .2 to .5 percent sodium nitrite by weight to water, and about .5 to 1 percent or so borax. In our table which we have just set up recently, I am currently running a bit lighter concentration though and it seems to be working very nicely. When first filled with water, before any corrosion inhibitors were added, steel drill shavings or such would form rust deposits nearly immediately on the stainless steel water table bottom. Now with the inhibitors in the water, I added some drill chips in a specific location just to test it.. and after 2 weeks, they are still completely bright and shiny. Not a trace of rust.

As for a biocide, I stopped by my local pool supply store and purchased a copper amine based algaecide. It was cheap and seems to be doing the job though its early to really tell. Its ingredients are not the same as the physan 20 previously mentioned, which is based on quaternary ammonium, but I am guessing they would work just fine. Your local pool store will have LOTS of different brands of biocides that should be suitable for this use. Also they are very readily ordered for quite good prices, from internet sellers. Compare active ingredients to find the best deals.

Good luck all

[cam1]

Just 1 question: Are there any detrimental human health issues that arise as a result of adding chemicals to the water? I'm not concerned about the water itself, but the steam during cutting.

regards

[WereWoof]

"Just 1 question: Are there any detrimental human health issues that arise as a result of adding chemicals to the water? I'm not concerned about the water itself, but the steam during cutting."


Hmmm... good question to ask.

Just a guess, but I am thinking that one would need to breath LOTS of steam to be exposed to any risky amount of chemicals in the coolant water. I would think the greater risk is via absorbtion through the skin.

The three ingredients I listed are generally considered low toxicity even when ingested in small amounts, so personally I am guessing that there is not a large hazard from inhaled vapors of the coolant at the levels that might be produced by a plasma cutting table.

Running a plasma cutter though, even with a water table will produce various assorted metal vapors and smoke from any contaminants on the surface of the metal being cut, (and some fine dusts) that are dispersed into the air. You really want to try to avoid breathing these if at all possible. This is especially true if you are cutting stainless steel, or plated metals (cadmium plated or zinc/galvanized) A ventilation system that reduces the exposure to the plasma exhaust gasses would be a good idea.

[douglasco]

What a helpful thread. I live on porous granite and have a well, has anybody researched why it would be bad to for the ground water to dump out your table water? Has anyone tried different colors other then green....say maybe blue. I was wondering if it was green to disguse the alage it doesn't kill.

[plain ol Bill]

Heard a truck in the drive today and Fed Ex was here and dropped off a pail of Plasma Quench. I am glad to FINALLY get some. If you have read this entire thread you know the problems that people have been having getting product from Koal Industries. I managed to track down the managing director for Koal and gave him a phone call. He was very surprised about anyone having problems getting Plasma Quench. I told him the story of the problems I and others had been having and as he was on his cell he pulled to the side of the road to talk w/ me about it. He stated that they had some major problems with credit cards wherein there had been some hanky panky going on and had lost quite a lot of product through fraud. So they are not really processing credit cards currently. I let him know that if they had simply told me this I would have been more than happy to mail them a check instead of just being put into limbo waiting for something that never arrived. He did take my information and called their ware house and got a pail of Plasma Quench sent to me. I did give him the address of this thread and let him know that he really should check into things and maybe put a reply in here. Whether that happens or not time will tell but I got my Plasma Quench. Remember the squeaky wheel folks!

[Mike@Torchmate]

We recently placed an order for some, and when we told them about some of the people having problems purchasing the Plasma Quench the man on the phone seemed suprised. He told us they had it in stock and ready to ship.

[aicomp]

We recently placed an order for some, and when we told them about some of the people having problems purchasing the Plasma Quench the man on the phone seemed suprised. He told us they had it in stock and ready to ship.

Pretty neat how they would be surprised. I have called and given this thread on many occasions. I have also still not received the Plasma Quench that I was billed for and was sent an invoice to pay again. This is a group of totally incompetent morons.
My Opinion,
Mike

[Big John T]

For about $10 per 300 gallons you can treat the water with the same chemicals as in Plasma Quench. Plasma Quench cost $70 for 5 gallons plus truck shipping... Maybe $125 to get 5 gallons to your door. I called the skirt at Plasma Quench and she didn't have a clue as to the mix ratio. She said the chemist might know she only takes orders (money) LOL...

My question is to those who have been unlucky or lucky as the case might be to actually get a pail of plasma quench. What is the mix ratio? Is it a 5 gallon pail or smaller (again the money taker didn't have a clue).

John

[duraflap]

I too ordered a pail of Plasma Quench and after two months and many phone calls, I'm wondering what the hay? They have not sent the product after taking my credit card number twice! Cannot give me any information as to my order. Now the poor secretary has me call the warehouse and yet no one answers! What a terrible way to run a business. I'm thinking now that even if I do get my initial order what about when I need a replacement for the treatment.
I DO NOT recommend this company for lack of service even if the product works well.
Any one have any other resources for an antirust product or know what I can do to make my own?
Dennis

[duraflap]

Plasma Quench may work... if you can get them to send you the product.
I don't know how they stay in business. They take the order but do not ship. When you call to inquire, the poor secretary can't tell you anything because the warehouse is not available. A very poor customer service company. I'll not buy from them. I did read some where that RV antifreeze will work. Anyone know about this?
Dennis

[Big John T]

It's easy to get sodium nitrite and pysan 20 from flea bay. Just do a search on here for the amount to use. It cost me about $15 for each one and got it the next day. Same as plasma quench but better and more cost effective.

John