[Teknition]

Hi BBC.
Ive been cutting a few things out. I was having problems with the torch diving at the end of the cut for a while but Tom told me the setting to play with. I still have a fair ways to go as far as getting all the settings correct for each thickness of steel. Ive had a few times the plasma quit half way thru a project for no apparent reason. Ive tried backing up the gcode to regain my cut but that always ended up screwed up and I just started over with a new piece. Im sure there is an easy way but I dont know how yet. I was going to just run the code from the start with the plasma off but I think that would end up dragging the torch because of the touch offs. Overall it is semi frustrating at times but fun most of the time.

Ive been racking my brain on things to cut to make money with this thing. I like the artsy stuff and have ordered a few disks from Signtorch. I think I might cut out some stuff and try the farmers market circuit. I would really prefer to come up with a product/s that requires some cnc cut parts, fabrication, welding, and finish work but I cant think of anything that hundreds of people arent doing already. I may cut a few fire rings just to see how they sell and go from there.

I will post a few pics when I get them resized, right now they are huge.

Brad

[Teknition]

here are a few pics of the stuff ive cut.

Note: the small "x" in the centre of the pics is because they are screen captures in Corel, not part of the actual part.

[Torchhead]

Hi BBC.
Ive been cutting a few things out. I was having problems with the torch diving at the end of the cut for a while but Tom told me the setting to play with. I still have a fair ways to go as far as getting all the settings correct for each thickness of steel. Ive had a few times the plasma quit half way thru a project for no apparent reason. Ive tried backing up the gcode to regain my cut but that always ended up screwed up and I just started over with a new piece. Im sure there is an easy way but I dont know how yet. I was going to just run the code from the start with the plasma off but I think that would end up dragging the torch because of the touch offs. Overall it is semi frustrating at times but fun most of the time.

It depends on how you stop the cut. If you hit STOP or RESET (E-stop) than you can lose position. The buffer gets dropped and so MACH internally thinks it is further down the cut that it actually is. If you hit FEEDHOLD instead it will finish the buffer and stay synchronized THEN hit STOP after it quits moving. You can then reverse back through the code (I go back to the M05 that indicates the end of the prior cut) and then hit a RUN NEXT. When the torch goes over to fire at the beginning of the cut you have lost arc on do two things: Turn the THC button off and turn off the torch with the screen button. As it moves along the cut then fire the torch just before the point it stopped cutting, and as it starts to cut metal turn the THC button back on. Check on the CandCNCSupport Forum. There is a user that has written some nice macros that can automate the process. I need to enlist some beta testers anyway so drop me a line off-list and I can get you a copy to try.

The better strategy is to figure out why the torch stops cutting. There can be several causes. One is control related. If you have the DTHC setup the important indicator is the TORCH LED (RED). If it turns off or flickers when the torch stops then we need to look at the control. If it never wavers than we need to look past the electronics at the cables and wiring and finally at the plasma itself. All it takes to "Un-fire" the torch is for it to drop even for a fraction of a second. Even though the signal may turn back on quickly, the torch will not re-fire for several seconds, if at all.


We run our tables for hours and never have a torch that stops cutting in the middle of a cut.

Ive been racking my brain on things to cut to make money with this thing. I like the artsy stuff and have ordered a few disks from Signtorch. I think I might cut out some stuff and try the farmers market circuit. I would really prefer to come up with a product/s that requires some cnc cut parts, fabrication, welding, and finish work but I cant think of anything that hundreds of people arent doing already. I may cut a few fire rings just to see how they sell and go from there.

I don't hold much hope for making much money at flea markets or other type events. The REAL money in plasam cutting is you being able to do something custom that they can't buy at some hardware store.

NEVER do consignment sales or look at gift shops as a viable market.

Think about what you can do that is unique. Just because it is "neat" is no prediction if it will sell. I am not a big fan of plasma art collections especially in DXF format. The Designs are neat but you will need to be able to edit and combine them with other clipart and/or text (seldom will you find a customer that will just buy a canned design unless you sell it cheap) and PERSONALIZE it for them. DXF is the least useful format to use with the Drawing tools you need for decorative cutting. Over the years of doing commercial cutting we amassed a high collection of designs from places like Vector Art by Holmes & Cottrell - highest quality electronic clip art, clipart, for sign industry, vinyl ready, easy to color fill for large format printing, great results for routing and engraving. and from our own tracing abilities. No matter what I showed the potential buyer they wanted something "different". I found if I just had them describe what they wanted and then with clipart and or a tracing gave them a printed sample of the design it would be about 85% of what they wanted. Our rule was you could change it once for free without getting an "art" charge.

We tried all kinds of products over the years. I did trailer hitch inserts (dud), custom wine racks (dud). We tried flea markets, trades day. town festivals and other one or two day events....all with little more to show than gas money. The best marketing I did was to cut a bunch of finished samples (powder coated) and built a display "tree" and talked a local catfish restaurant into setting it up front (I cut a bunch of decoration for his walls at a deep discount which helped us both). We had laser printed simple color fliers in a holder. I got endless amounts of custom business. We are in a rural area so we did lots of gates, inserts, entry signs etc. It also got me some nice commercial sign business.

All i can tell you is: Whatever YOU think will sell will probably not! If it is not something made for them they won't see much value and won't pay you what you need to make decent money. You will sell more around Christmas because it makes a really unique gift to give something personalized.

Sorry for the long post. We did decorative cutting for several years and actually made money at it. Anything I can do to help just ask.

I will post a few pics when I get them resized, right now they are huge.

Brad

[Teknition]

Thanks Tom, I appreciate you taking the time to write all that out. I cant be 100% positive but I think the torch fault is because it was getting "dipped" at the end of a cut. The sequence of events usually happens like this:

1) The torch dips in the water at the end of the cut and the arc goes out as normal but the torch just sits there and the air stops. (sometimes im fast enough to get to the RUN button before the air quits and it carries on fine, sometimes im not).

2) Next touchoff, torch fires and stops OR fires, starts to do its path and then quits but the torch indicator in mach says it is still on. Usually Im watching for tip ups (no magnetic breakaway) and dont see if the torch indicator has any blips. I believe it is the plasma cutter itself that is locking out as there is usually a lightning bolt indicator on the front of the plasma cutter when it happens.

3) to cure it, I turn the plasma cutter main off and wait for a minute to turn it back on. Once it comes back on I take mach out of reset (i was hitting the e-stop) , raise the torch and do an air purge for 10 seconds or so, then try to find where the last M05 was. Usually by the time all the events are done, mach has scrolled thru hundreds of lines of code and numerous M05's. I just have to get the settings right for each thickness of steel so the torch doesnt dunk its "beak" in the water for a drink at the end of a cut and I think all will be fine.

It would be nice if I could just lift the torch and scroll backwards thru code as the table followed along OR if there was a "last m05 position" button that you could hit and the table would go to that last M05 event. Ive already installed datum plates on the table so I can relocate the sheet to X0 , Y0 if I have a torch drag/snag and it moves the sheet. I will send you an email and get the macros from you, hopefully they will have a similar value. I would be happy to do some beta testing for you.

I hear what you are saying about the art having to be custom. There isnt much that hasnt been done in the way of prefab cutouts that the chinese havent done already for materials cost plus 3 cents labour. All of the discs Signtorch sells are vector drawings done in Corel and exported as CMX, AI, SVG, EPS, and DXF files. You get all the different formats so they are easily scalable and customizable. Have a look, he does some nice work.
SignTorch Vector Graphics and DXF Art Files For Sign Making Machine Cutting
Im pretty good at tracing but it can eat up a pile of time (thats what Ive been doing alot of). One good thing about all the time spent in Corel is Im starting to get pretty good at it.

My ideal customer would be someone that had a widget he needed made that involved a bunch of plasma cut parts that are jigged and welded together then blasted and painted or powdercoated, a couple thousand at a time.

Thanks again for the help Tom,

Brad

[BBchevy396_]

Tek, have you gotten the table dialed in yet? Just wondering if I could be of any more help.

[Teknition]

Its much better but still needs some more tweaking. The tipsaver is coming on part way thru a cut and also when ever it does a cut and the piece drops out, the thorch stops motion and I have to hit "run". I will give you a call after lunch.

[Torchhead]

Tip saver should NOT cause motion to stop. Do you have the Stop on Fault box checked in the cut profiles? The tip saver comes on when there is a jump in the voltage and that is normal at the end of a cut. Normally without it the torch will dive at the end of a cut as the piece falls out. In fact that is the major reason we added that feature. If the motion is stopping it is because either you are losing arc (which stops motion or your voltage is spiking and cause a fault (not a tip saver event) and if you have the Stop on Fautl checked it will ....STOP!.

TOMcaudle
www/CandCNC.com

[Teknition]

Hi Tom,

Yes I have "stop on fault " checked. I figure its alot easier to hit the "run" button than to sort back thru the g-code when something happens. Sorting thru g-code and "running from here" gets old very fast when you have to do it 30-50 times per item cut.

The voltage is spiking at the end of a cut when the piece it is cutting falls out, even with zero delay at end of cut. It was hard to tell at first what it was doing because it was the end of the cut and the torch should be shutting off at that point anyway. So would the cure be to raise the upper fault limit for the voltage?

Brad

[Torchhead]

The "fault" is probably from the upper voltage limit being hit. Those are settable parameters in the Cut profile. It will fault on too low (below the Lower fault limit) or too high (above the upper fault limit. Set those values where you do not get a fault at the end. The defaults are something like 50 and 200v.

"self-inflicted wounds are the most painful" (

[Teknition]

Thanks Tom I will change those values tomorrow. Now I have to figure out why a drawing looks perfect in Corel no matter how far I zoom in but when it is imported into sheetcam it has looped corners and open paths. The file I cut this afternoon made about 80 pierced dots that werent in the original drawing.

Brad

[Torchhead]

If the drawing is generated in CorelDraw then it should not have looped modes. If you are import artwork in some format like DXF or from some of the cheap sign clipart packages the loops are already there. the bad part is loops are not illegal in a a Bezier Curve and display and even fill in Corel

I find the good clipart like from Vector Art by Holmes & Cottrell - highest quality electronic clip art, clipart, for sign industry, vinyl ready, easy to color fill for large format printing, great results for routing and engraving. or any True type font does not have looped nodes and no breaks.

[Teknition]

These were all commercial clipart corel cmx files. I cant understand why i can zoom in with corel to 100000% and the lines are all smooth, joined, and perfect, yet in sheetcam i only have to zoom in maybe 200% and the defects are very obvious? Im using "normal" view mode in corel, is there a way to see these screwups while still in corel? Is there an import setting in sheetcam that is out of wack?

Brad

[Torchhead]

What method are you using to move them to SheetCAM? See, the DXF format being used does not support polylines so each node section or curve section (if using DXFTool) is exported as a object. In SheetCAM there is an import tolerance setting that will auto-join segments if they are within the tolerance level. the LOWER the number the further the nodes can be and still be seen as joined in SheetCAM.

You can send me one of your CMX files that seems to be the worst and i will give it a try and see what the problem is. I think you know my direct e-mail.

TOMcaudle
www.CandCNC.com

[Teknition]

Thanks Tom, files sent.

[Teknition]

Here is another example of the defects that "appear" in sheetcam but arent present in corel

[Teknition]

Thought I would add an update to this thread. I went out to the shop to play around with the table some more on Thursday only to find my plasma cutter would only make a small "blip" and then the torch go out. I tried dismounting the torch and cutting by hand, same thing. I changed out all the torch consumables and tried again, still just a blip. I called Hypertherm tech support and spoke to John, he was thinking it may be a resistor on the main power board but we would have to take some measurements with a multimeter to confirm his suspicions. I was thinking that the fun here never ends (chair)

After pulling the cover off and taking some voltage and resistance measurements and calling John back, he determined the circuit board was OK After a few more measurements and a few more calls in to John, he determined the problem was in the torch head. Apparently the electrode was not going open circuit like it should at the start of a cut once the air pressure blows it back. He provided the part number for the torch overhaul kit and I ordered it thru the LWS. Im now awaiting its arrival (a week or so for delivery).

The main reason I'm posting this is to relay to everyone the excellent customer service experience I had with Hypertherm tech support and John in particular. Even though it is a real bummer when things like this happen, it is nice to have such helpful, knowledgeable people a phone call away to help get you up and going again!

Brad

[Teknition]

I thought you guys might enjoy seeing what Ive been working on while my plasma table is down and waiting for parts. Since I already had these cut out, I figured I would work on my firepit for the back yard. I still have to make a small rack for the logs to sit on, a cooking grille that will sit inside the 1/2" recessed lip on the top of the bowl, and a domed cover screen. It has been glass beaded, painted hammered copper, and the bowl is painted high heat black (1200 degrees) inside and out. All images are composed of vector art from signtorch (SignTorch Vector Graphics | DXF Art for CNC Machine Cutting)

Brad

[Teknition]

I received my rt-60 hand torch repair kit last week and installed it on the weekend. I figured I would snap some pics along the way in case anyone else ended up having to repair their torch.

pic#
1-remove t-10 torx retaining bolts from handle.
2-be careful when separating torch handle, if the trigger assembly pops out the spring will go flying.
3-remove the o-ring and discard it.
4-carefully remove right side of handle, it will take a bit of wiggling as all the torch guts are seated in the right side handle.
5-squeeze the prongs sticking out of the back of the clip to spread it, remove and discard clip.
6-Pull the large copper lug straight up off the blow back spring assembly.

[Teknition]

7- remove the two #1 phillips screws that hold the retaining cap switch in place. note that the switch assembly is 2 pieces, but they can only go back together one way.
8-remove the slide from the retaining cap switch and set them aside together.
9-remove snap ring from the top of the blow back spring assembly.
10-push the top of the blowback spring assembly and it will pop out the front.
11-blow back spring assembly removed. Install the supplied new purple insulator ring and o-ring on the new blow back spring assembly. Lube the o-ring with the supplied grease and slide it in the housing.
12-The new blow back spring assembly installed. install the new large o-ring on the outside of the housing and give it a thin coating of the supplied grease. NOTE- Hypertherm supplied a new snap ring in the kit and the instructions say to discard the old one. I found the new snap ring was too thick to seat properly and reused the original, so dont damage yours when you are taking it off.

[Teknition]

13-Contents of the Hypertherm torch repair kit (instructions not shown). The instructions are pretty straight forward but it is always nice to have some clear pictures to guide you along. The torch repair was fairly easy and took about 15-20 minutes. The hardest part is getting the blow back assembly snap ring seated, I ended up using a small flat screw driver and a seal pick to get it in place by just working them around the snap ring. Assembly is the reverse of the disassembly, no problems encountered, just be sure to route your torch wiring as indicated in the instructions. After the torch was assembled, I did a few test cuts and it is back in business! Thanks again to John in the tech dept at Hypertherm :cheers:

Brad