[Wolffie]

I've got a Huanyang 2.2kw inverter FT3000 series.
For some weird reason it does not have a ground connection.
Without it, it just trips the circuit-breaker in the power-board after about 5 seconds.
Where the yellow warning triangle is there is no screw and no connection to anything on the back of the circuit-board, just a soldering blob
How can I make a earth/ground connection to make the inverter work?
TIA
Wolffie

[neilw20]

In picture number 3 the two small caps, usually 1nF cause some current to flow to ground, and is typical of a VFD.
A VFD is best connected to a fused circuit that does not have an earth leakage detector. The caps are intended to stop EMI going out the power lead.
If you can't use a supply circuit that has no leakage detection, then powering through a 1:1 isolation transformer will solve it. But hey, a 2.2KW transformer is HEAVY.

[Wolffie]

1) I just realised it is not a HYUNYANG inverter, it is an XINFUTAI
2) I sorted out the earth problem, the manufacturer had neglected to connect it
3) The power connection is supposed to be R, S, T. I only have R, S for the hot (red/brown)wire, where do I connect the (black/blue) one that is supposed to be T?
4) The power board is the box with the mains circuit breakers not a cabled one.

Cheers
Wolffie

ps
I have no idea what a "fused circuit", "earth leakage detector" nor "EMI" are.

[neilw20]

Safety switch is earth leakage detector.
Fused circuit does not go through the safety switch

[bushwakka]

I would suggest that you connect red(brown) to R, black(blue) to S.

However if you don't know what a fused circuit is, then I reckon you should get someone with electrical experience to check and do this work for you.

Paul

[neilw20]

I second that. Read my signature.

[Wolffie]

I would suggest that you connect red(brown) to R, black(blue) to S.
Tried that, it tripped the circuit breaker immediately, swapping them lasted 5 seconds.

However if you don't know what a fused circuit is, then I reckon you should get someone with electrical experience to check and do this work for you.
Sorry, my native language is not English
Paul

Obviously neither connection works so there has to be another solution.
This inverter is for both single and 3 phase connection so, where is the "T"?
Old red/black cable is only for testing, proper 15A cable will be used in the workshop. Unfortunately no 15A power point in the office.
Wolffie

[Wolffie]

I second that. Read my signature.

If I wanted to use my way, I would not have asked for help
Wolffie

[bushwakka]

Well, when you get someone electrical to look at it, they will probably tell you that you are overloading the circuit. A thermal trip is consistent with the 5 seconds or so before it trips.
Or try it on that 15a circuit.

[Wolffie]

Well, when you get someone electrical to look at it, they will probably tell you that you are overloading the circuit. A thermal trip is consistent with the 5 seconds or so before it trips.
Or try it on that 15a circuit.

Nope :bs:
Just had 2 qualified sparkies here and they were as stumped as I was.
Nothing about overloading the circuit, they tripped it several times themselves.
They checked everything I had tried and could not find anything wrong with that.
Didn't worry themselves with semantics as to what I called the wires nor what colour they were as long as they were connected correctly.
THERE IS NO "T" CONNECTION
In the end, working together we decided the earth terminal was wrong and tried several connections before we found the good one :cheers:
Inverter is working now so, as soon as I get the parts for the CNC done, I can get them back to hardwire it into the switchboard (in my language "powerboard")
Wolffie

[bushwakka]

Electrical work is something that should only be done by electricians. I am glad that you got some electrical advice and got it working, even if the electricians only did what you told them.
The Circuit Breaker (or earth leakage breaker) was tripping because the electrical circuit was not correct.
I don't condone electrical work by non-electrical people, as the consequences of getting it wrong can quite easily be catastrophic (death, burns).

The FT3000 series inverter can be a single phase supply if the model number is FTA1Lxxxxx. I would assume in this case they save costs and use a single phase bridge rectifier to get the DC bus voltage.
If it is FTA3Lxxxxx then it is 3 phase supply (and should have T connnected to something - normally to a 3phase bridge rectifier).

The unit appears to be rectifying the AC supply on R&S (no T connection), via the choke (coil of wire on the same side as the terminals) and the bridge rectifier (alumium looking square thing on the opposite side to the terminals.). The DC bus is then chopped back to AC of varying voltage and frequency by the 6 three legged packages next to the bridge rectifier.

Without having access to the inverter, I stand by Active to R, Neutral to S. The Earth probably should end up on a ring terminal and be connected under one of the 2 mounting screw that is connected to the small section of bus and one leg of each capacitor that Neil correctly suggested is for EMI suppression. I'm happy to be corrected if this information is incorrect.

I believe that without this point in the EMI filter being connected to an actual earth, that the earth connection point in the inverter can float all the way up to full phase voltage, and a number of electric shocks have been recorded from welders and other appliances where the earth is not connected (broken strands in the lead for example). In your case, this could mean that the earth point on the connected motor could be floating and potentially you could have 240V on the motor housing (if the motor was in a plastic mount bracket for example). It is for reasons like these that electrical work should be done by appropriate electrical workers.

Just to note. The yellow triangle with a lightning bolt in it means "be very effing careful, this is electrical and dangerous and you could die if you touch this".
It DOES NOT mean "earth".

Sorry if i come across as a prick here, but as an electrical engineer responsible for electrical safety on industrial sites, I don't condone electrical work being done by people who don't have the appropriate competency/training/skills to complete it PROPERLY and with an understanding of what could go wrong if it is not done PROPERLY.
It works/doesn't work is not all there is to electrical work.

Cheers
Paul

[Al_The_Man]

Electrical work is something that should only be done by electricians.
I don't condone electrical work by non-electrical people,.
Paul

Well we would have to shut the site down, as I would hazard a guess that applies to the vast majority of the 233,741 registered members!
I have an both an Electrical & Electronic Background and I don't mind steering anyone in the right direction that comes here for help rather than them flying blind without the aid of help of any kind.
Al.

[neilw20]

Well put, Paul, and for 2 'qualified sparkies' to not understand this is A PROBLEM!!
If it won't work with the earth on it get further advice from someone who understands why.

I had a device tripping a safety switch. Initial tests, with hands off (no safety switch and no earth) worked fine.
I carefully connected to a properly fused outlet and BANG!!
Yes, there was leakage, due to an incorrectly mounted IGBT flashing over to chassis. This was connecting -160vDC to frame. LETHAL to touch.
I will repair it one day. Turns out it was a poorly implemented prototype BLDC (brushless DC motor) drive 'donated' to the local museum (TO BE USED!!)

[Wolffie]

Electrical work is something that should only be done by electricians. I am glad that you got some electrical advice and got it working, even if the electricians only did what you told them.
The Circuit Breaker (or earth leakage breaker) was tripping because the electrical circuit was not correct.
I don't condone electrical work by non-electrical people, as the consequences of getting it wrong can quite easily be catastrophic (death, burns).
Come off your high horse, do you expect people to get a sparky every time they connect a plug into a socket? This was not a matter of playing around with high voltage, this was a matter of connecting a power cord to the right connections. I asked for help, not a lecture. If you know about the FT3000, why didn't you tell me first time? You may call yourself a bushwakka but obviously you have no idea of the distances up here and the shortage of tradies.
I was extremely lucky to get them here that quickly, only because they were in the area already, otherwise to travel over 200km just to look at a powercord connection is not regarded as a priority job.
It took me a month to get my workshop connected after the cyclone rebuild. This is Far North Queensland, not the big smoke. Not too many inverters on sugar harvesters or banana sorters.

The FT3000 series inverter can be a single phase supply if the model number is FTA1Lxxxxx. I would assume in this case they save costs and use a single phase bridge rectifier to get the DC bus voltage.
If it is FTA3Lxxxxx then it is 3 phase supply (and should have T connnected to something - normally to a 3phase bridge rectifier).
Easy to read if you understand Chinese.

The unit appears to be rectifying the AC supply on R&S (no T connection), via the choke (coil of wire on the same side as the terminals) and the bridge rectifier (alumium looking square thing on the opposite side to the terminals.). The DC bus is then chopped back to AC of varying voltage and frequency by the 6 three legged packages next to the bridge rectifier.

Without having access to the inverter, I stand by Active to R, Neutral to S. Actually vice verso, it tripped with the Active/Positive/Power/Red/Brown to "R" The Earth probably should end up on a ring terminal and be connected under one of the 2 mounting screw that is connected to the small section of bus and one leg of each capacitor that Neil correctly suggested is for EMI suppression. I'm happy to be corrected if this information is incorrect.

I believe that without this point in the EMI (Sorry, not conversant with English abbreviations) filter being connected to an actual earth, that the earth connection point in the inverter can float all the way up to full phase voltage, and a number of electric shocks have been recorded from welders and other appliances where the earth is not connected (broken strands in the lead for example). In your case, this could mean that the earth point on the connected motor could be floating and potentially you could have 240V on the motor housing (if the motor was in a plastic mount bracket for example). It is for reasons like these that electrical work should be done by appropriate electrical workers.

Just to note. The yellow triangle with a lightning bolt in it means "be very effing careful, this is electrical and dangerous and you could die if you touch this".
It DOES NOT mean "earth". Again, this is what the seller suggested and I was worried about doing
Sorry if i come across as a prick here, but as an electrical engineer responsible for electrical safety on industrial sites, I don't condone electrical work being done by people who don't have the appropriate competency/training/skills to complete it PROPERLY and with an understanding of what could go wrong if it is not done PROPERLY.
It works/doesn't work is not all there is to electrical work.

Cheers
Paul

Everything would have been fine here, if both the sparkies and I could read Chinese, unfortunately neither of us do.
Wolffie

[Wolffie]

Well put, Paul, and for 2 'qualified sparkies' to not understand this is A PROBLEM!!
If it won't work with the earth on it get further advice from someone who understands why.

I had a device tripping a safety switch. Initial tests, with hands off (no safety switch and no earth) worked fine.
I carefully connected to a properly fused outlet and BANG!!
Yes, there was leakage, due to an incorrectly mounted IGBT flashing over to chassis. This was connecting -160vDC to frame. LETHAL to touch.
I will repair it one day. Turns out it was a poorly implemented prototype BLDC (brushless DC motor) drive 'donated' to the local museum (TO BE USED!!)

See above.

[Wolffie]

Well we would have to shut the site down, as I would hazard a guess that applies to the vast majority of the 233,741 registered members!
I have an both an Electrical & Electronic Background and I don't mind steering anyone in the right direction that comes here for help rather than them flying blind without the aid of help of any kind.
Al.

Thank you Al, I was asking for advice not a lecture
:cheers:
Wolffie

[neilw20]

It took me 6 hours to translate a 28 page technical manual. This was for VFD type device (3 phase stepper) 220vAC input. Then I connected it up.
Google Translate

[Wolffie]

It took me 6 hours to translate a 28 page technical manual. This was for VFD type device (3 phase stepper) 220vAC input. Then I connected it up.

Lucky for you that you could find it, nobody else could.
Wolffie

[neilw20]

I ordered new top of the line DSP based VFD drives and their documentation. It was no luck. I had the documentation a week before the drives arrived.
It as all matter of overcoming the language barrier.
After 6 hours, darn it, if I didn't start to learn and recognize some symbols. Brain damage in progress??

[bushwakka]

Gents,

That was far from a lecture.
Sometimes what you want and what you need are different things.

The advice to get an electrician got you the results you were after. The drive is now working, and nobody was hurt.

My post contains lots of advice and information if you read it, and also contains a warning that you need to make sure you know what you are doing, as you could kill someone. If you are a long way from electricians, then you are also a long trip for the ambulance when you need a defibrillator.

If you want a manual in english, try this
www.cnc3axis.com/FT-H2000(english).pdf

I found it after conducting a google search for "XINFUTAI inverter", first post goes to the inverter, and the text underneath has a link to a manual in english.

Paul.