[jeriesfacouseh]

please , i have a 5 axis cnc machine that have a cylendrical device.
i can do 5 axis planar finishing with no problem , but roughing i cant do .
i need to do roughing in 5 axis with cylendrical device ( in madcam named : 5 axis rotary-head machine ) using a stock material shape
please how could i do that .
Thanks
Jeries

[Gregore]

Could you please re explain your problem , I do not quite get what part you are having issues with

[jeriesfacouseh]

Could you please re explain your problem , I do not quite get what part you are having issues with

Thank you George , in attached JPG image i explain exactly what i need , thanks for your help .
jeries

[Dan B]

I'm going to ask a basic question: Did you try the MC_SelectStockModel command? If so, is it not working?

[jeriesfacouseh]

Thanks , how to get this command in madcam 5xtra ?
Attachment 331984

[Mauri R]

Jeries,
Performing Roughing on 4/5 Axis Simultaneous using a Drive surface is a problem especially with statues that have offsets and have deep profiles.
Some 3D models have the cutter Roughing profile moving all over the place no mater what drive surface you have.
Joakim, will in the near future make a Planar Roughing module, which will make a multiple single movement profile cuts, much like the Planar Finishing.
This will suit most simple 3D statue models and most other general 4/5 axis simultaneous and general machining.
Joakim, will also be refining the Drive Surface to prevent/reduce gouging and violent cutter/machine movements, but maintain a close cut to the 3D profile.
Currently the Smoother you have the Drive Surface the less chance you have in cutting in deeper areas of the 3D model profile.
However the closer the Drive Surface is to the Model profile the more violent the cutter movements and more cutter gouging.
Once Joakim finishes the 4/5 cutting simulation, this should show up these issues a lot better than a line display.
I like you look forward to changes like these to do some 4/5 axis simultaneous cutting on statue models.
Regards,
Mauri.

[jeriesfacouseh]

I DON’T USE ROUND ( CYLENDRICAL ) WOOD AS RAW MATIRIAL , AS RAW MATIRIAL MOSTLY IS CUBOLD OR OTHERS FOR EXAMPLE
Attachment 339278

SO IF I WHANET TO DO ROUGHING USING 4 AXIS OR 5 AXIS , THE SOFTWARE MAKE THE TOOLPATH AS IF THE WOOD HAD A CYLENDRICAL SHAPE AND IN THIS WAY THERE WILL BE A BIG ARIA THAT THE MACHINE WILL WORK FOR NOTHING
Attachment 339280



I TRY TO DRAW A BOX AS RAW MATIRIAL , THEN I DRAW A CYLENDER AROUND AS DRIVE SURFACE THEN RESAPE THE CYLEDRICAL SHAPE ACCORDING TO THE BOX SO I GET A BOX SHAPE DRIVE SURFACE
Attachment 339282

SO THE IDIA WAS TO DO 2 DRIVE SURFACE ( attached Rhino file named 2kings ) ( ONE FOR THE MAIN MODEL CALLED -A- ) ( AND ONE FOR THE MATIRIAL SHAPE BOX CALLED -B- ) , THEN TO DO AS BELOW :
1- I WILL CHOOSE THE DRIVE SURFCE -A- AS THE MAIN MODEL AND CREATE TOOL PATH ROUGHING START FROM THE DRIVESURFACE -B- AND END ON THE TOP OF THE DRIVE SURFACE -A-
2- I WILL CHOOSE THE MAIN MODEL AS THE MODEL AND CREATE TOOL PATH ROUGHING START FROM THE TOP OF THE DRIVE SURFACE -A- TILL THE MAIN MODEL
3- I WILL DO FINISHING USING THE DRIVE SURFACE -A- .
BUT THIS HAD NOT WORK , WHY I DON’T KNOW , PLEASE HELP IN THIS CASE .


This is the link for the rhino file https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...FNMRVZlbjJUM28

Thanks
Jeries

[Mauri R]

Jeries,
I presume that your wanting to machine the Model using 4 or 5 axis Simultaneously.
Rough Cutting this Model will make the toolpath profile (Cutting Tool) in simultaneous 4/5 axis go all over the place if you are cutting it in a rotary fashion.
This is because Joakim has not made a Planar Rouging Module available in his program yet, like he made in the Finishing process.
These are complex mathematical processes and there are many ways of calculating them i.e. from the surface of the model or using both the stock surface and the model surface to calculate it. The later should keep the tool path with in these two surfaces.
You have a good Drive Surface for finishing so finishing should not be an issue.
I noticed in your example a small piece in the Red Circle (Pic below) if selected as part of your model would cause an issue.
You have the Stock which you would use as in a 4 Axis Simultaneous cut.
You have the Drive Surface except you have a fold at the beginning; it must be smooth the rest of the surface.
You can produce Surfaces using larger Tools that the one you intend to use for cutting this may help in producing a better drive surface.
Not sure what type material (Timber) you are using, if hardwood then Roughing will be an issue.
If your machine has plenty of Z axis movement available then you could do multiple 4 Axis simultaneous cuts using the "Stock to Leave" as your multiple Z depth cuts with Planar Finishing otherwise use indexing with a Tool Lead-in if the material is hard.

Joakim may be able to provide more pointers on this if he can spare time from his very busy schedule.

Can anyone else help Jeries?
Regards,
Mauri.

[Dan B]

Why does it have to be roughed with simultaneous motion? Couldn't you use indexed toolpaths to rough, and save the simultaneous motion for finishing?

[jeriesfacouseh]

thanks Dan , but how i can do that ?

[Gregore]

There are a number of ways to rough using indexed paths , they all involve cutting in a fixed position then rotating the model in your controller by hand or doing it in cam.

An in cam example would be to use a flat drive surface above the model and choose depth of cut, then run a tool path , next rotate drive surface around model to a new position ( usually 90 degrees ) then re choose drive surface and reset depth of cut run tool path again , continue until you have the whole model covered . You only have to worry about having the cutter move enough out of the way to not crash into the model when it turns to new index .

I do not know how to have the Post prossesor do this , So I just modify the Gcode by looking for all of the A moves and placing a home move just before the A move

A lot of my work is mirrored in cad so Both sides or multiple sides of the model are the same. I can sometimes tool path from 1 view in cam then in the controller turn the model the correct amount and run the same tool path again and repeat as many times as needed to complete the full cut .

Hope that makes some sense

[Dan B]

It can also be done without a drive surface if you use the indexed 4-axis toolpaths (the 4X toolbar).

Attachment 339480
Attachment 339482

[jeriesfacouseh]

Thank you all for trying to help me .
on the youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOYNC_abRTw i think this will help in roughing , BUT WHEN I TRY TO CHANGE THE C-PLANE AS IN THE VIDIO , I GET THE FIRST SIDE TOOLPTH , THEN I TRY TO CHANGE THE C-PANE FROM BUTTOM INSTEAD OF TOP AND GENERATE TOOLPTH , BUT I GET THE SAME TOOLPTH THAT I GET BEFORE FROM THE TOP ARIA ( IN THE VIDEO IT WAS GOING FROM THE OTHER SIDE BUT WITH ME IT REDO THE SAME SIDE ).

[Dan B]

Are you using the 4X or 5X toolbar, or the 3X? Do the toolpaths listed on the layer pane have the word "indexed" in them? I've seen many times when someone intends to make an indexed path, but they use the wrong icon and end up with a 3-axis path and they can't figure out why.

[jeriesfacouseh]

THANKS DAN , I WAS USING THE RHINO C-PANES , BUT I UNDER STAND TO USE THE MADCAM ( 4 AXIS SITTINGS > INDEXED ( 4AXIS ) ) AND IT WORKS FINE .

BUT IN THE 5 AXIS I DO A 5 AXIS DRIVE SURFACE AND IN SIMULATION EVERY THING IS GREAT , WHEN I GO TO THE MACHINE I WORK ROUGHING ( IN 4 AXIS INDEXED FROM BACK AND FRONT SIDE ) THEN NED TO FINISH USING 5 AXIS .
WHAT HAPPNED WITH ME THAT THE TOOL GO OUT FROM DESTINATION ( SORRY FOR BAD ENGLISH AS I AM PALESTINIAN FROM BETHLEHEM SO MY HOME LANGUAGE IS ARABIC ).
Attachment 339830

[Dan B]

If your simulation looks good but the machine is not duplicating what you saw, I would suspect that there is a problem with your post-processor. There was another post here within the last week or two where the user had a post issue. I suggested a change to their post. See if that helps you too. You might need to post your post-processor here to see if a problem can be spotted.

[jeriesfacouseh]

Thanks Dan for your help ,
about post-processor ( attached a copy of what i use ) as i add 364.5 after axis offset for the distance from spindle motor rotation center till the top of the collet ( a rhino drawing for my machine attached ).
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...kQtcFZfVDVGS3M
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...ENjNHlfcE9HV1k
i thank you and thank any one that help me now and before in my way to start my work .
thanks
Jeries

[Dan B]

Hi Jeries,

Can you remove the section with the 364.5 axis offset and see how it works?

Thanks,

Dan

[jeriesfacouseh]

HI DAN ,
WISH YOU A GOOD DAY , AS LINK https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...XFxRmFPMWNUaWc I WILL TRY TO DO IT ON THE MACHINE TOMOROW AND I REPLACE THE 364.5 WITH ZERO AS IT WAS FROM THE BIGINING .
I WILL LET YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPNED .
THANKS
JERIES

[jeriesfacouseh]

HI DAN ,
WISH YOU HAPPY THANKS GIVING ( USUALY THIS IS A DAY IN U.S.A. I DONT KNOW IF YOU CELIBRATE IT CANADA TOO )
ATTACHED THE FILE I USE https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...XhYRkFtX2MtVnM
THE TOOLPATH IN THE FILE IS AS https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3...GNMWkpEblZlaW8
I TRY TO DO THE POST PROCCESOR WITHOUT THE 364.5 OFFSET , THERE WAS A PROBLEM , THEN I FOUND THAT THERE IS A PROBLEM IN WORKING ARIA AROUND AXIS 'A' .
SO I DO ANOTHER FILE THAT MAKE FINISHING USING THE 5EXTRA BUT THE SPINDLE ROTATION 'AXIS B " IS ZERO ( SO WORKING WILL BE AS 4 AXIS AND I GET THE SAME PROBLEM .
I DO THE FINISHING USING THE 4X AND I GET THE SAME PROBLEM
THE PROBLEM WAS AFTER I DO INDEXED ROUGHING FROM THE FRONT AND THE BACK , IN THE FINISHING THE MACHINE WORK IN A DIFFERENT ARIA THAN IT SHOULD BE AS I FEEL THAT THE PIECE OF WOOD LET US SAY THAT IT IS ON ZERO ( AXIS A ) AND THE SPINDLE MOTOR ( AXIS X ) IS WORKING IN THE WAY THAT AXIS 'A' IS ON 5 DEGREE SO FROM SIDE SOME TIMES THE SPINDLE WILL WORK IN A BIG DISTANCE FROM THE WOOD AND SOMETIMES IT WILL GO INSIDE THE WOOD